Another M1 Annual Protection question.

[kohnen]

I just don't see who Mobil thinks will buy M1 Annual Protection. It won't sell well to garages that do oil changes for people - the only way it would sell would be for shops to tell their customers that the change will last 20,000 miles and 1 year. They won't do that for liability reasons and business reasons.

Do it yourself folks will understand that AP is only 5,000 miles more than EP for double the cost. And, they're both good for one year. We DIY folks are doing our own work because we're thrifty, so $25 extra for only 5,000 miles more won't fly.

And then, the Only reason that a person might want to use AP would be if they know they'll put over 15,000 miles within one year, and that's not too common.

My GM car (see signature below) has an oil life monitor that will let ANY Dexos1 oil run for 2 years, so AP is not at all useful to me. I can run the cheapest Dexos1 oil I can find and I'll be set.

Folks who want a boutique oil aren't likely to consider Mobil over RedLine, or Royal Purple, or Liqui Moly, or...

At $30-35 for a 5 quart jug and I might consider it for giggles and grins. But, I just don't see a market for this oil at $50 for 5 quarts, or $12.50 a quarter.

What am I missing?

 

[Dyusik]

Don't you read!? It says it is THE ULTIMATE SYNTHETIC! The quest for the best oil is over!

M1 team is based here in the PNW, because they are defiantly smoking the funny!

 

[The Critic]

I guess I am one of their target customers. I drive between 20-22k/yr with a mix of city and highway driving. My weather conditions are reasonable (30-100F). My car (2011 Prius) doesn't have a turbocharger and does not see anything that is truly defined as "severe service" by Toyota.

 

[double vanos]

I don't see sales #s being big enough to have them keep it very long. 5 quarts for around $50? And there so many cheaper oils that'll protect your engine for a 10k OCI, I just don't see it being a success. Price too high, value isn't there. But then what do I know? Might take off and be a bitog darling. UOAs will determine if it's worth the cost ( 1-2 ppm on every wear metal there is over 20k miles). That might do it..

 

[Garak]

If you want my unvarnished opinion, XOM would be better served getting the LL-01 spec back onto M1 0w-40 than worrying about $50 a jug oil, which they have in ample quantities up here. As for this annual protection stuff, maybe now I know where the PAO in my Delvac 1 went.

 

[demarpaint]

They might specifically be targeting Amsoil's top of the line product with this oil. The only problem I see though is the price. At the current $50 price point they might actually be helping Amsoil. It's a small market segment of people in the know who might buy this oil, similar to Amsoil Signature Series Oil customers. Now if they were on the fence about using Amsoil Signature Series and they see this price them might say screw Mobil for 50 bucks, I'll try Amsoil SSO.

 

[Matagonka]

If this oil is a true synthetic, like group 4/5, then the price isn't too bad and it could sell as well as Amsoil/Royal Purple/Redline. We just don't know what group oil it is yet.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Garak
If you want my unvarnished opinion, XOM would be better served getting the LL-01 spec back onto M1 0w-40 than worrying about $50 a jug oil, which they have in ample quantities up here.

Agreed. The 0w40 has a more robust add pack and is already capable of 20k mile OCI based on some of the mfg specs that it carries, and it's only half the price of M1 AP.

 

[njohnson]

Originally Posted By: kohnen
I just don't see who Mobil thinks will buy M1 Annual Protection. It won't sell well to garages that do oil changes for people - the only way it would sell would be for shops to tell their customers that the change will last 20,000 miles and 1 year. They won't do that for liability reasons and business reasons.

Do it yourself folks will understand that AP is only 5,000 miles more than EP for double the cost. And, they're both good for one year. We DIY folks are doing our own work because we're thrifty, so $25 extra for only 5,000 miles more won't fly.

And then, the Only reason that a person might want to use AP would be if they know they'll put over 15,000 miles within one year, and that's not too common.

My GM car (see signature below) has an oil life monitor that will let ANY Dexos1 oil run for 2 years, so AP is not at all useful to me. I can run the cheapest Dexos1 oil I can find and I'll be set.

Folks who want a boutique oil aren't likely to consider Mobil over RedLine, or Royal Purple, or Liqui Moly, or...

At $30-35 for a 5 quart jug and I might consider it for giggles and grins. But, I just don't see a market for this oil at $50 for 5 quarts, or $12.50 a quarter.

What am I missing?


I think Mobil is offering this oil to those want the "Ultimate" synthetic, the best of the best approach. It will be interesting to see how it sells.

They are offering a brand new product, which they say is their highest quality product. I believe they would sell more if they reformulated the EP to include the new technology and then charge a few more dollars.

What will affect the sales is the price. Let's see what kind of rebates Mobil offers, they have the rebates for the other Mobil 1 oils. I would try the Annual Protection if Mobil offered a good rebate for it.

 

[njohnson]

Originally Posted By: Garak
If you want my unvarnished opinion, XOM would be better served getting the LL-01 spec back onto M1 0w-40 than worrying about $50 a jug oil, which they have in ample quantities up here. As for this annual protection stuff, maybe now I know where the PAO in my Delvac 1 went.

"Unvarnished" Good one! I agree though, losing that spec makes Mobil look bad. If Mobil really wants to introduce a $50 oil, it probably would make more sense to offer it in this category or market. You could have the one oil that meets, say, older European specs. Then, there is the new, super duper oil that meets the newest specs and uses the latest technology.

 

[bigt61]

The price is going to come down. Patience - Exxon-Mobil aren't stupid. WTI Crude just dipped into the 40's and XOM are investing $20B into the Gulf in the next ten years. They are about volume and market share.

 

[HolyOilSeeker]

Originally Posted By: Garak
If you want my unvarnished opinion, XOM would be better served getting the LL-01 spec back onto M1 0w-40 than worrying about $50 a jug oil, which they have in ample quantities up here. As for this annual protection stuff, maybe now I know where the PAO in my Delvac 1 went.

I completely agree. The new mobil 0W-40 pds has great specs yet they lost the BMW long life 01 certification. That's also a very specific high price market. They didn't lose the certification because they're not willing to pay, mobil is a huge company. My guess is there a new product does not stay within specs for the required amount of miles. Heres the PDS for this new annual protection: https://www.mobil.com/English-US/Passenger-Vehicle-Lube/pds/GLXXMobil-1-Annual-Protection
My newbie analysis says not that different from EP or even AFE. Has anyone done a virgin oil analysis, lol, maybe when the price drops by half !

 

[4WD]

The new XOM CEO comes from Downstream ... and look what his first major announcement is ...

 

[Linctex]

Originally Posted By: 4WD
The new XOM CEO comes from Downstream ... and look what his first major announcement is ...


What? This AP oil?

 

[Yah-Tah-Hey]

Be gone from Walmart shelves in a year.

 

[Mr Nice]

6 months it will be on clearance for $20 a jug.

 

[kohnen]

Originally Posted By: njohnson

I think Mobil is offering this oil to those want the "Ultimate" synthetic, the best of the best approach. It will be interesting to see how it sells.

They are offering a brand new product, which they say is their highest quality product. I believe they would sell more if they reformulated the EP to include the new technology and then charge a few more dollars.

What will affect the sales is the price. Let's see what kind of rebates Mobil offers, they have the rebates for the other Mobil 1 oils. I would try the Annual Protection if Mobil offered a good rebate for it.


So, ok. Let's assume that XOM is saying that it is their top-tier oil (like Shell has done with Ultra). Then it would make sense for them to do two things:

1) Have a list as long as my arm of the specs it meets. Gen 2 Dexos1 would be a great start. The BMW long-life specs would also make sense. If it's such a great oil, show that it meets all the specifications a great oil should be able to meet.

2) Tell us BITOG-type folk what it does for us. Unsurpassed cleanliness? Tell us! Incredible friction reduction? Say it! Sludge removal and prevention like seen in no other oil? Let us know about it!

Right now, they're essentially saying: "We took Mobil 1 EP which is good for 1 year and 15,000 miles, and added 5,000 miles and no additional time to it. Then, we doubled the price. It doesn't really meet any more specs than EP does, and we're not saying how it might be a better oil, but trust us." Their marketing folk have fallen flat on their faces.

Now, their Annual Performance filters? We added 5,000 miles to the 15,000 mile filters, added an "A" to the end of the part number, and put them on sale for less than the previous filter.

My Walmart is flat out of the Annual Performance filter for my car, and has PLENTY of stock for 5W30 Annual Performance oil. This is a big clue on how their customer base perceives the value of their products.

Just my 2¢.

 

[jongies3]

Originally Posted By: The Critic
I guess I am one of their target customers. I drive between 20-22k/yr with a mix of city and highway driving. My weather conditions are reasonable (30-100F). My car (2011 Prius) doesn't have a turbocharger and does not see anything that is truly defined as "severe service" by Toyota.

Shouldn't be a problem for that particular car, especially if you drive it easy and it runs in hybrid mode for a good percentage of the time. Lot of times when I change the oil on a Prius that has between 10k and 15k miles on the OCI, the oil comes out a dark, golden brown still. Not that that means anything, just an observation! There are others where the oil comes out pitch black like a Cummins diesel so it ultimately comes down to engine condition and driving habits I suppose.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted By: salcuta88
If this oil is a true synthetic, like group 4/5, then the price isn't too bad and it could sell as well as Amsoil/Royal Purple/Redline. We just don't know what group oil it is yet.


I agree with this. Maybe Exxon will (but I doubt it) become more transparent and tell the consumer which base stock this oil is,unlike when they went behind the consumer's back and switched from pao to grp III and we found out when their paper got leaked a few years back.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: salcuta88
If this oil is a true synthetic, like group 4/5, then the price isn't too bad and it could sell as well as Amsoil/Royal Purple/Redline. We just don't know what group oil it is yet.

Outside of a select few on BITOG, how many other consumers out there actually care about the group thing? And how many of those are Walmart shoppers?