Another dealership trick on front end alignment

[joekingcorvette]

Went to the Toyota dealership out of town where we purchased the new Toyota Rav 4 hybrid AWD which now has 22,000 miles accumulated. We had a couple recalls done, oil and filter changed (the last free one) and the tires rotated. Early in the game the tech comes out and says you need a new alighnment for the tune of $125.00. I told him and my wife it didn't need it and saved the money. The vehicle drives perfectly and if I see unusual tire wear I will get it aligned with the next set of new tires. I highly doubt it needed it and the stealership was just trying to get my wife to fork out some unnecessary money. Had I not been there with my wife I am sure she would have been sucked in.

 

[PontiacHO]

They all try it. That’s what those “free” oil changes are for. Get you in there for “oh, you now need” this and that. It’s a surprise they didn’t add the overused, never needed, shear profit brake fluid flush that ends up they crack 4 bleeder screws and then add a few ounces of brake fluid.

 

[Hall]

Went to the Toyota dealership out of town

Do you have Toyota dealers closer ?

They all try it.

Yeap, alignments seems to be the new upsell and places are telling people it NEEDS aligned, not checked and then aligned if out of whack. What kind of morals does it take for a tech to set a vehicle up on the alignment rack, attach all the lasers and measuring tools, and go under the vehicle and pretend to make adjustments ?

 

[PontiacHO]

If you’ve ever seen the “acceptable” variances allowed on modern alignment equipment you’ll see that a small percentage of vehicles actually get touched…just checked.

 

[fantastic]

My XC90 has 146k on it so it has plenty of use but it wore the tires out in 29k with a prior alignment done. So two alignments in about 29k miles. Hopefully with these new roads they're laying it will go further than that. Seems somewhat out of line, pun intended, but maybe it wasn't done well at the factory either. Ask them to show you the results. The bad part about that is they use a laser that is sort of just a pass or fail with little data.

 

[JunkdrawerDog]

They all try it. That’s what those “free” oil changes are for. Get you in there for “oh, you now need” this and that. It’s a surprise they didn’t add the overused, never needed, shear profit brake fluid flush that ends up they crack 4 bleeder screws and then add a few ounces of brake fluid.

The alternate take on this is they siphon the fluid from your brake fluid reservoir, replace with new and call it a flush for $125.00.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Upsells are fine as long as they are needed. But there is so much dishonesty going on. I had a set of tires put on my grand niece's Mazda 3; they told me all 4 brakes needed replacement. This was at Wheel Works (local Firestone); I've purchased at least 20 sets of tires there over the years. I bought the stuff from RockAuto; when she brought it over I pulled a tire and found the pads at 50% or better.

 

[Hall]

they told me all 4 brakes needed replacement

Plus rotors and calipers too ?

 

[JeffKeryk]

Plus rotors and calipers too ?

Don't remember; rotors probably. I would never have a shop do such easy work, regardless.

 

[dishdude]

Another trick is they keep a filthy cabin and engine air filter around and show it to you claiming it's yours. $200 later your barely dirty filters are replaced.

 

[Hall]

Another trick is they keep a filthy cabin and engine air filter around and show it to you claiming it's yours. $200 later your barely dirty filters are replaced.

Dealer told my wife her cabin filter needed replaced because it was "dirty" (and showed a picture). I had replaced the cabin filter not long before with a carbon-activated one.

 

[CKN]

The $125.00 is actually a decent price for an alignment if one needs it................

 

[CKN]

Do you have Toyota dealers closer ?

Yeap, alignments seems to be the new upsell and places are telling people it NEEDS aligned, not checked and then aligned if out of whack. What kind of morals does it take for a tech to set a vehicle up on the alignment rack, attach all the lasers and measuring tools, and go under the vehicle and pretend to make adjustments ?

Of course an before and after alignment sheet is usually provided. Are those faked too?

The conspiracies theories on this board are out of whack..........

Just another day on here.

 

[dishdude]

The $125.00 is actually a decent price for an alignment if one needs it................

It's sure an expensive price if one doesn't!

 

[Gyro Gearloose]

I don't let them touch the alignment unless there is a reason to, like irregular tire wear, darting to one side then the other, replacing tie rods, etc. My experience is 50/50 whether they improve alignment or screw something up. Sad to say, but I have the stories.

 

[dishdude]

I don't let them touch the alignment unless there is a reason to, like irregular tire wear, darting to one side then the other, replacing tie rods, etc. My experience is 50/50 whether they improve alignment or screw something up. Sad to say, but I have the stories.

Agreed. As long as it's not pulling, the tires are wearing evenly and front end components have not been replaced I have never seen the need for an alignment.

If it starts pulling, chances are you have a bad tire or someone hit a curb, in which case you're going to need more than just a random alignment.

 

[Gyro Gearloose]

Of course an before and after alignment sheet is usually provided. Are those faked too?

I will give them the benefit of the doubt there, but what I question as an ex engineer is if you can actually get repeatable alignment values down to the 0.1 degree considering that part of the system is mounted in rubber and there are some clearances in the parts, especially after 10's of thousands of miles. Educate me.

 

[dishdude]

I will give them the benefit of the doubt there, but what I question as an ex engineer is if you can actually get repeatable alignment values down to the 0.1 degree considering that part of the system is mounted in rubber and there are some clearances in the parts, especially after 10's of thousands of miles. Educate me.

Take the vehicle off the alignment rack, drive it around the lot and rerack it. The values will change slightly.

 

[The_Jeff]

Dealer told my wife her cabin filter needed replaced because it was "dirty" (and showed a picture). I had replaced the cabin filter not long before with a carbon-activated one.

I draw dirty doodles on my air filter (as well as date/mileage installed) so if a tech comes waving that thing at me in a waiting room I'll know they're really mine.

The "free" oil changes are a Toyota Care thing that Toyota (USA) pays for under warranty for the first 2yr/25k. Of course OP could have more free oil changes from the dealer, and the dealer is free to scam up more work.

And the customer doesn't need to retort to the dealer that the car isn't pulling. "No" is a complete sentence. Who cares what they think?

 

[The_Jeff]

I will give them the benefit of the doubt there, but what I question as an ex engineer is if you can actually get repeatable alignment values down to the 0.1 degree considering that part of the system is mounted in rubber and there are some clearances in the parts, especially after 10's of thousands of miles. Educate me.

To do it right you're supposed to straighten the wheels in the parking lot then take a straight shot at the alignment rack, put it in neutral, and stop with the e-brake only so you don't preload the bushings in the front end. It's absolutely not repeatable, particularly as the miles add play in bushings and other parts. Plus you've got additional error in how the guy mounts the heads to the wheel rims.