Ano(the)r 0w20 - FA20 Engine Thread

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Originally Posted by bluesubie
A lot of European Subaru manuals that spec 0W-20 also allow ACEA A3 5W-30's. Your 86 manual doesn't make mention of this? The only 0W-20 that I would use in your conditions is something like Motul 300V. Otherwise, I would go with an ACEA 5W-30 even though it robs power.
I'm not sure " ROBS POWER ... " is entirely accurate. Yes, the 5w30 will be thicker, but I'm not sure the average driver could really tell the difference. If you went from a 20 to a 50 grade, then maybe one could feel a bit of a difference. I have used 20w50 in a small, high revving 4 cylinder that spec'd 5w30. The car felt slightly more sluggish when cold, but on a hot day, at operating temperature, on the race track, I don't think there was very much difference. Maybe a couple of horsepower.
 
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"- What da ***k is the right oil for this car?" A MB229.5 or a Dexos2...Or a high Moly 20 grade like Toyota 0w20. I would not use a 20 grade.
 

Albs

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Rome, Italy
Originally Posted by bluesubie
After input from BRZ owners in Japan, and the notes that you made about the oil selection there, it proved that the 0W-20 requirement was a bit of nonsense, IMO, and is strictly for fuel economy. There are lots of uoa's on ft86club on street driven cars where 0W-20 did just fine and going well beyond the recommended oil change interval. But once you take it to the track, all of the manufacturer recommendations should be thrown out the window IMO. smile2 Sorry, but you cannot have your cake and eat it too! I know that the 86 owners in the US were installing the Forester XT oil coolers but I do not know if that cut down on bearing failures?
Thanks for you input bluesubie, on yours and @Marco620 feedback i found this list of UOAs in the ft86club forum that shows pretty normal oil condition after breaking on specimen that had also done autox and track. So this is indeed a piece of evidence that 0w20 COULD be safe to use even for mi habits, of course i tend to think that thicker oils will provide best wear protection buy if the engine clearances are tight i would not go with very high hths. Still I find it fearsome to read something like that for japanese guys 0w20 is a bit of a nonsense or interviews at Penzoil regarding the new ilsac gf-6b 16w whose productor dances swiftly in order not to fully answer about the wear protection: it all just adds a sense of uncerntainty to the matter!
Originally Posted by paoester
PAO is an interesting organic chemistry subject. You could skip all the chemistry science and go by oil specifications, as in just about any oil that carries German engine oil (VW, BMW, Audi, Porsche, Mercedes) specifications is better than oils that only have A5/B5 or dexos1 or certainly SN/GF5 for your engine. Mercedes 229.6, BMW LL-01FE has about the right HTHS here. If you're willing to spend more Euros or Liras, Ravenol DXG 5w30 or anything fully synthetic Ravenol has in HTHS 3.0 to 3.3 is probably best for your engine and usage.
Thanks I read something and it seems Ravenol DXG has the right 3.0/3.1 hths value that i would not cross as 3.3 seemed to slow the car in a sensible way. I also checked Toyota specs of their 5W30 and seems like a low hths grade (2.9) so maybe at the next mandatory Toyota OCI (to keep the warranty alive) i'll ask for their 5w30. I'd search the datasheet for the 229.6 but it seems that ilsac gf-5 compliant oils are compatible to 229.71/51 rather than 229.6, an bmw long life 01 seem to have viscosities higher or equal to 3,5. Toyota 5w30 and Ravenol DXG 5w30 seems the way to go. A3 specs are also >= 3,5 hths.
Originally Posted by Marco620
I would use redline 0w20 but only lightly modified. It's hths of 2.9 would be the lowest I would let it get. I think the Redline 5w30 or Motul 300V would be my go to.
thanks for the input on ftclub, I found a huge list of 0w20 UOAs later on, and it seems that 2.9 surely is a confident value for wear protection, performing better than other 0w20 UOAs
Originally Posted by ChemLabNL
"- What da ***k is the right oil for this car?" A MB229.5 or a Dexos2...Or a high Moly 20 grade like Toyota 0w20. I would not use a 20 grade.
what's an High Moly 20 grade?
Originally Posted by geeman789
I'm not sure " ROBS POWER ... " is entirely accurate.
switching from 2.6 hths to 3.3 really made the power delivery in the earlier rpms different, with the car litterally asleep until it reaches 2000rpm, together with a slower temperature kick-in from cold, a slower oil temp cooling time and an average higher temperature at cruising speeds. PS: What's the average price per UOA in North america?
 
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Originally Posted by Albs
Still I find it fearsome to read something like that for japanese guys 0w20 is a bit of a nonsense or interviews at Penzoil regarding the new ilsac gf-6b 16w whose productor dances swiftly in order not to fully answer about the wear protection: it all just adds a sense of uncerntainty to the matter!
You are on the right way wink2
Quote
Toyota 5w30 and Ravenol DXG 5w30 seems the way to go. A3 specs are also >= 3,5 hths.
If it would be my: DXG + 15ml Redline break-in. Finito grin
 
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Originally Posted by Albs
an bmw long life 01 seem to have viscosities higher or equal to 3,5. what's an High Moly 20 grade?
That is "BMW LL-01FE" the "FE" part means HTHS is close to 3.0, not up at 3.5. (The LL-01 is at 3.5 or 3.6, true.) BMW 0w-30 and the same Mini dealership 0w-30 is LL-01FE or googled for buying over the internet. A high moly 0w-20 oil is Toyota brand 0w-20, lots of friction reducing molybdenum. I think you're on the right track selecting Ravenol DXG dexos1 5w30 for an HTHS that is not excessively higher than Subaru-Toyota's recommendation in a typical 0w-20. Your Motul choice was also good. Going to a rare all-PAO oil like the Ravenol is a small step upward. Any German engine oil specs (229.6 or LL01FE) that are around HTHS 3.0 would work since those test standards are very high. The Germans are much more strict on oil than anybody else.
 
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