Amsoil pressure drop after 3,500 miles

[OVERKILL]

I thought Amsoil is not recommending that filter any longer?

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/hemi-oil-pressure-issues-oil-filter-related.343142/

That's the filter loading issue, they are telling you to avoid extended drains. The filter should still be fine for more typical drain intervals. This is what I was alluding to with the mention of filter loading earlier in the thread, but it doesn't explain the return of the pressure when he added a fresh quart.

 

[Circuit Rider]

That's the filter loading issue, they are telling you to avoid extended drains. The filter should still be fine for more typical drain intervals. This is what I was alluding to with the mention of filter loading earlier in the thread, but it doesn't explain the return of the pressure when he added a fresh quart.

The oil level was higher after adding a quart than before. I didn't get PRECISELY one quart out I guess.

Could that have had an impact?

It went from being midway up the hash marks to 3/4 up the hash marks.

 

[OVERKILL]

It's most likely some permanent shearing of the VM/VII additives. As they get chopped up, especially under high load, they're less effective at slowing the decrease in viscosity with increasing temps. Lower viscosity with give lower oil pressure.

A synthetic 10w-30 should have very little in the way of VII in it. Heck, AMSOIL makes one with no VII at all. VII content would need to be quite high and shear significant to produce that level of viscosity reduction. A single quart of top-up wouldn't bring the visc back up either, so that stands out as odd.

My take is that he should start with swapping the filter, if the pressure returns, we know it isn't shear. At that point, cutting open the old filter to see how plugged up it is would be the logical next step.

If the filter has no impact, send the oil off for analysis and see how much fuel is in it.

 

[OVERKILL]

The oil level was higher after adding a quart than before. I didn't get PRECISELY one quart out I guess.

Could that have had an impact?

It went from being midway up the hash marks to 3/4 up the hash marks.

No, the level, within the normal range, won't have any impact on observed pressure.

Wonder if this is one of the engine impacted by the oil pick-up o-ring issue? @clinebarger would know.

 

[Circuit Rider]

We have a winner!

I pulled out of the garage with 21 psi cold. Swapped the filter. Had 38 psi at idle pulling back into the garage.

Another EA15K50 is what I had on hand so I’ll order a wix and do a full oil change when I hit the 5k mark on the oil.

Fascinating! Thanks everyone!

I would’ve just changed the oil and wouldn’t have even CONSIDERED that the filter (which incidentally would’ve been changed as part of the oil change) was the culprit. I’m really glad I asked.

 

[BornSlippy]

That's the filter loading issue, they are telling you to avoid extended drains. The filter should still be fine for more typical drain intervals. This is what I was alluding to with the mention of filter loading earlier in the thread, but it doesn't explain the return of the pressure when he added a fresh quart.

Right. With 120K what I presume to be miles, and no maintenance history, that Amsoil is probably cleaning up some crud in the engine and loading up the filter prematurely.

 

[OVERKILL]

We have a winner!

I pulled out of the garage with 21 psi cold. Swapped the filter. Had 38 psi at idle pulling back into the garage.

Another EA15K50 is what I had on hand so I’ll order a wix and do a full oil change when I hit the 5k mark on the oil.

Fascinating! Thanks everyone!

I would’ve just changed the oil and wouldn’t have even CONSIDERED that the filter (which incidentally would’ve been changed as part of the oil change) was the culprit. I’m really glad I asked.

Nothing wrong with using the EaO, it's an excellent filter, the problem is your engine appears (please confirm with a filter tear-down) to be filling the filter with particulate, likely due to cleaning.

I'd probably use a less expensive filter changed more frequently if the filter dissection confirms my suspicions. You can step back up to the EaO once the loading starts to taper off. AMSOIL advises not using the EaO in these applications (and the HEMI) due to loading issues over extended drains. The filters are extremely efficient and these engines produce enough contamination apparently to be an issue when trying to run the filter that long.

I look forward to your filter C&P pictures!

 

[Circuit Rider]

Right. With 120K what I presume to be miles, and no maintenance history, that Amsoil is probably cleaning up some crud in the engine and loading up the filter prematurely.

Yes, miles, sorry about not clarifying.

That certainly makes sense. Pretty shocking pressure difference (almost double).

I sent Amsoil an email to suggest they review recommending that filter on 2014 models but not 2007-2013 models; which has to be a mistake. It’s the same generation.

It’s still puzzling that I saw a short lived spike in pressure after swapping some oil.

 

[Circuit Rider]

Nothing wrong with using the EaO, it's an excellent filter, the problem is your engine appears (please confirm with a filter tear-down) to be filling the filter with particulate, likely due to cleaning.

I'd probably use a less expensive filter changed more frequently if the filter dissection confirms my suspicions. You can step back up to the EaO once the loading starts to taper off. AMSOIL advises not using the EaO in these applications (and the HEMI) due to loading issues over extended drains. The filters are extremely efficient and these engines produce enough contamination apparently to be an issue when trying to run the filter that long.

I look forward to your filter C&P pictures!

Gotcha.

Hmm. Well I’ll explore it for sure.

Having an oil pressure gauge is handy here. I have an indicator on the dash, in essence, that should let me know when the filter needs to be changed again.

 

[OVERKILL]

Yes, miles, sorry about not clarifying.

That certainly makes sense. Pretty shocking pressure difference (almost double).

I sent Amsoil an email to suggest they review recommending that filter on 2014 models but not 2007-2013 models; which has to be a mistake. It’s the same generation.

It’s still puzzling that I saw a short lived spike in pressure after swapping some oil.

One of the caveats of the extended drains claim unfortunately, and this applies to any oil recommended for an interval beyond OEM. The assumption is that the vehicle is sufficiently mechanically fit to take advantage of the interval. When dealing with a used vehicle with an unknown maintenance history, that goes right out the window, as you've discovered.

The EaO, Royal Purple and FRAM Ultra filters are all extremely efficient. While they all have enhanced holding capacity, that's designed to handle "typical" loads produced during the prescribed drain interval, not rapid loading due to cleaning, which, it appears, is what may be happening in your case. A dissection of the filter you've removed will confirm whether this is the case or not.

Extended drain oils are more heavily fortified with dispersants and detergents in order to be able to keep things clean for their intended drain interval. This also means they are likely going to be more aggressive at cleaning than more pedestrian oils with more typical additive packages. This would exasperate the issue.

 

[Circuit Rider]

One of the caveats of the extended drains claim unfortunately, and this applies to any oil recommended for an interval beyond OEM. The assumption is that the vehicle is sufficiently mechanically fit to take advantage of the interval. When dealing with a used vehicle with an unknown maintenance history, that goes right out the window, as you've discovered.

The EaO, Royal Purple and FRAM Ultra filters are all extremely efficient. While they all have enhanced holding capacity, that's designed to handle "typical" loads produced during the prescribed drain interval, not rapid loading due to cleaning, which, it appears, is what may be happening in your case. A dissection of the filter you've removed will confirm whether this is the case or not.

Extended drain oils are more heavily fortified with dispersants and detergents in order to be able to keep things clean for their intended drain interval. This also means they are likely going to be more aggressive at cleaning than more pedestrian oils with more typical additive packages. This would exasperate the issue.

Well, one challenge here is that we’re not in the extended drain territory.

I changed the oil at 117,065 and I’m currently at 120,462. 3,397 miles. OEM drain interval is 7,500 miles. Actually; technically, the manual says to “check oil life percentage and change if needed” at 7,500 miles. These are filled with an OEM synthetic from the factory.

So we’re nowhere NEAR extended drain. But I wasn’t planning on it either. My plan was 5k mile intervals because of the mileage and the fact that I’ll be towing fairly frequently.

In theory then, it shouldn’t matter moving forward right? The theory that the Amsoil cleared out a bunch of junk certainly makes sense, but that will eventually reach equilibrium; at least in theory right?

 

[ron17571]

Certain Chevrolet engines were known for getting gunked up and plugging the oil pickup screen. Maybe the previous owner wasn't so picky about oil changes and the engine needs some serious flushing?

 

[Circuit Rider]

Certain Chevrolet engines were known for getting gunked up and plugging the oil pickup screen. Maybe the previous owner wasn't so picky about oil changes and the engine needs some serious flushing?

Could be. I need to explore the pickup screen.

 

[OVERKILL]

Well, one challenge here is that we’re not in the extended drain territory.

I changed the oil at 117,065 and I’m currently at 120,462. 3,397 miles. OEM drain interval is 7,500 miles. Actually; technically, the manual says to “check oil life percentage and change if needed” at 7,500 miles. These are filled with an OEM synthetic from the factory.

So we’re nowhere NEAR extended drain. But I wasn’t planning on it either. My plan was 5k mile intervals because of the mileage and the fact that I’ll be towing fairly frequently.

In theory then, it shouldn’t matter moving forward right? The theory that the Amsoil cleared out a bunch of junk certainly makes sense, but that will eventually reach equilibrium; at least in theory right?

Don't worry, I wasn't implying you were in fact doing extended drains, I'm simply pointing out that the premise of extended drains hinges on an engine being in perfect health, and the oil and filter you are using are both designed for extended drains. That TSB from AMSOIL on the EaO was in reference to avoiding extended drain intervals with that filter in those applications because of premature loading to the point of bypass.

An oil with strong detergent chemistry and a filthy engine can of course lead to premature filter loading, which is my suspicion with respect to your situation.

You will need to cut and inspect your next few oil filters (I'd suggest posting pictures on here for the rest of us to look at) to monitor the loading if the first C&P confirms that this is what is going on. It should taper off once sufficient cleanliness has been achieved.

 

[Dennywires]

Slap a wix or delco on that baby and fill with mobil 1

 

[nomas]

I would really like to see the inside of that filter .

 

[wpod]

What would the oil filter have to with the pressure drop?

Amsoil oil filter? an after thought?

 

[kschachn]

Please cut that filter open and post pictures here as Overkill suggested. That’s critical to this entire thread.

 

[bbhero]

One of the caveats of the extended drains claim unfortunately, and this applies to any oil recommended for an interval beyond OEM. The assumption is that the vehicle is sufficiently mechanically fit to take advantage of the interval. When dealing with a used vehicle with an unknown maintenance history, that goes right out the window, as you've discovered.

The EaO, Royal Purple and FRAM Ultra filters are all extremely efficient. While they all have enhanced holding capacity, that's designed to handle "typical" loads produced during the prescribed drain interval, not rapid loading due to cleaning, which, it appears, is what may be happening in your case. A dissection of the filter you've removed will confirm whether this is the case or not.

Extended drain oils are more heavily fortified with dispersants and detergents in order to be able to keep things clean for their intended drain interval. This also means they are likely going to be more aggressive at cleaning than more pedestrian oils with more typical additive packages. This would exasperate the issue.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This is a great post in my opinion. One of the examples why Overkill is one of the best members on here. A post that is detailed, informative and articulated extremely well.

 

[GSCJR]

I second @bbhero's sentiments. Excellent explanation @OVERKILL!