Amazing difference in oils in 05 Ford PSD

[racin4ds]

Hi Guys, I just wanted to share something I found really interesting regarding my 05 Ford PSD (6.oh). I bought the truck several years back from its original owner (older gentlemen who kept very detailed service records). He literally drove the truck off the lot and had it filled with Rotella 15W40. All service records after that showed it having a steady diet of Rotella. I now have 131,000 miles on the truck and it has been extremely reliable and a work horse. The only mods done have been full Delete of the EGR and 4" turbo back exhaust as well as a coolant flush and change to ELC Diesel spec coolant.

So after tons of reading on the 6.0 pages, looking around on here and talking to a buddy of mine that uses 2 of these trucks daily for his business, I decided to run Motorcraft 10W30 for this OCI,.. BIG MISTAKE!

Within 200 miles I now have serious symptoms of "stiction" rough running, shaking, low power etc. I pulled codes yesterday and got a cylinder 1 contribution code. Keep in mind this truck ran FLAWLESS prior to this oil change. Is it possible this oil has caused this in such short time? Why do so many others have great luck with the motorcraft oil? Once the truck is at full operating temp all is fine, it purrs like a sewing machine, which definitely tells me I have an issue with cold oil and the infamous stiction that these HEUI systems are known for.

Fellow 6.0 owners, what has your experience been with the Motorcraft oil? (Please don't suggest AMSOIL or Schaeffers, I'm not spending that kinda money on boutique oils) Is it possible this oil is causing this or is it pure bad luck/coincidence?

 

[bullwinkle]

I had an ‘03 E-350 6.0 PSD for 250,000 miles, and it would have serious issues starting below freezing (unplugged) if it had ANY oil other than full syn 5W40 in it-even after 6 new injectors, a FICM, and 2 brand new batteries. In FL, I would just run the 15W40 Rotella and forget about using anything else, it's never going to get cold enough to need anything thinner.

 

[racin4ds]

Bullwinkle- I just hear and read the stories of how much Rotella has changed and that it is NOT the oil it used to be. Actually where I'm at in Florida we get several "cold" mornings of late, It was just 28* last week. This truck has never hesitated to start when cold even when I lived in the mountains of WV, plugged in or not.

 

[rideahorse]

I am in northern Iowa. I have only run 15w-40 dino oil in mine since new. 93,000 miles. Runs perfect. Completely stock.

 

[kschachn]

That's amazing that in only 200 miles of using the oil your truck is nearly undriveable when cold. How odd.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

I agree, it seems odd. But what happens if he switches the oil back to what was used prior and the problem is gone?

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

I agree, it seems odd. But what happens if he switches the oil back to what was used prior and the problem is gone?


Highly unlikely because the code is related to fuel delivery such as a failing injector.

 

[bullwinkle]

Originally Posted by racin4ds
Bullwinkle- I just hear and read the stories of how much Rotella has changed and that it is NOT the oil it used to be. Actually where I'm at in Florida we get several "cold" mornings of late, It was just 28* last week. This truck has never hesitated to start when cold even when I lived in the mountains of WV, plugged in or not.

Well-Rotella is back on the Ford approved list (not sure if it was ever NOT on it), it's also possible that you have some other weird problem, bad fuel, HPOP issue, etc.? The 6.0 PSD I had ran great when it was right, but it was a finicky engine-seemed really easy to have issues when it started having them. Once I started using BP diesel, 5W40 Valvoline Premium Blue Extreme, and the biggest batteries that would fit in the stupid boxes on the frame under the side cargo doors (E-350 van), a lot of my weird chugging & start up smoke issues went away.

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

I agree, it seems odd. But what happens if he switches the oil back to what was used prior and the problem is gone?


Highly unlikely because the code is related to fuel delivery such as a failing injector.


You guys have to remember that the 7.3 and 6.0 use HEUI injectors where the oil plays a crucial role in injector firing and can be quite sensitive to oil/

http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/ex...igh-pressure-oil-injection-systems-work/
https://www.drivingline.com/articles/11-things-you-need-to-know-about-heui/

Not sure if it's related but it would be interesting to see what happens if the OP goes back to his usual oil.

 

[bismic1]

Take a hard look at FICM voltages - MPower andLPower

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted by itguy08
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

I agree, it seems odd. But what happens if he switches the oil back to what was used prior and the problem is gone?


Highly unlikely because the code is related to fuel delivery such as a failing injector.


You guys have to remember that the 7.3 and 6.0 use HEUI injectors where the oil plays a crucial role in injector firing and can be quite sensitive to oil/

http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/ex...igh-pressure-oil-injection-systems-work/
https://www.drivingline.com/articles/11-things-you-need-to-know-about-heui/

Not sure if it's related but it would be interesting to see what happens if the OP goes back to his usual oil.



Interesting. In any case I would think that if the system wasn't able to maintain oil volume it would impact all injectors not just one. Based upon the info provided by the OP we're assuming 10w30 is a recommended weight. I would argue that if the issue happens to be oil weight then ANY 10w40 should work whereas ANY 10w30 would also cause running issues.

Maybe injector 1 is just failing/leaking?

 

[racin4ds]

Originally Posted by bismic1
Take a hard look at FICM voltages - MPower andLPower



Both monitored continuously and are perfect. FICM is steady at 49.0 VDC.

 

[racin4ds]

Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by itguy08
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by demarpaint

Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

I agree, it seems odd. But what happens if he switches the oil back to what was used prior and the problem is gone?


Highly unlikely because the code is related to fuel delivery such as a failing injector.




Interesting. In any case I would think that if the system wasn't able to maintain oil volume it would impact all injectors not just one. Based upon the info provided by the OP we're assuming 10w30 is a recommended weight. I would argue that if the issue happens to be oil weight then ANY 10w40 should work whereas ANY 10w30 would also cause running issues.

Maybe injector 1 is just failing/leaking?


BMW- these HEUI systems are VERY dependent on oil for the entire injection system and suffer from a condition called "stiction" when cold due to excessive oil varnish and buildup on the injector spool valves. I monitor all critical values on this truck, ICP and all fuel pressures are perfect as is the oil pressure. I really don't think it is viscosity related as much as it is the actual oil itself as I've run Rotella 10W30 in it before when I lived in the mountains of WV where it got very cold...

I'm going to run this oil to around 1000 miles and give it a fair chance, but if it keeps this up, I'm going back to Rotella and will report results!

 

[racin4ds]

Small tidbit of education for those of you not familiar with this term and the ford HEUI injection (thanks to Bismic!)

 

[Dave1027]

Why did you delete the EGR? I would think doing something like that would throw off the mixture or combustion temps.

 

[HighbrowHillbill]

Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Correlation is not causation. Oil has nothing to do with it.

I agree, it seems odd. But what happens if he switches the oil back to what was used prior and the problem is gone?

I'm gonna lay my bet that his problem disappears when he switches back. Who wants in on this action?!

 

[HighbrowHillbill]

Originally Posted by Dave1027
Why did you delete the EGR? I would think doing something like that would throw off the mixture or combustion temps.

You know how I know you don't know a whole lot about diesels and the 6point oh no in general?

 

[Jimmy_Russells]

Most of my customers HEUI trucks that are starting to show stiction issues typically we move them into a synthetic 5W40 to kick the can down the road for a while. It does help, but the injectors have a lifespan typically of around 150-180k or so, maybe more if it sees a lot of highway.

I see you are in Ocala, I know the guys at Williams Diesel well, I would recommend them if you need some help.

 

[racin4ds]

Originally Posted by Dave1027
Why did you delete the EGR? I would think doing something like that would throw off the mixture or combustion temps.



Dave- it isn't the same as a gasoline engine, Diesels burn very dirty, sooty exhaust and regurgitating their own exhaust leads to more problems than good. Think of it as a smokers lungs lol....