Acura Factory Fill

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Hi does anyone know what brand is used in Honda / Acura car's factory fill for their 0W-20 weight oil? Can anyone confirm if it is conventional, synthetic blend, or synthetic? thanks
 
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Honda advises Not to change the FF oil until the mm is under 10% I agree with HK i would change it out at the 30% mark. I don't know what oil Honda uses these days
 
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Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
Honda advises Not to change the FF oil until the mm is under 10%
why not listen to Honda if they specifically advice this? from having 2 honda civic of my own and having family members who have owned many acuras and hondas, i don't see how honda has been wrong, other then automatic transmissions in some cars. As far as their 4 bangers go, I would trust their advice. V6? no idea, no experience to comment on them.
 
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Like I said, the FF Idemitsu has a low virgin TBN of around 7. There are plenty of UOAs on Honda 0w20 FF that hit below 2 TBN @ 15% OLM. For example: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3044859/1/Honda_Factory_Oil,_2013_Accord What's even more alarming is the high TAN of almost 3 which means that the oil overall has turned acidic. The viscosity @ 100C is also getting very low @ around 7 cST. Factor in the high amount of wear metals due to break in, it's best to change it out sooner rather than later.
Originally Posted By: 01_celica_gt
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
Honda advises Not to change the FF oil until the mm is under 10%
why not listen to Honda if they specifically advice this? from having 2 honda civic of my own and having family members who have owned many acuras and hondas, i don't see how honda has been wrong, other then automatic transmissions in some cars. As far as their 4 bangers go, I would trust their advice. V6? no idea, no experience to comment on them.
 
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Originally Posted By: HKPolice
Like I said, the FF Idemitsu has a low virgin TBN of around 7. There are plenty of UOAs on Honda 0w20 FF that hit below 2 TBN @ 15% OLM. For example: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3044859/1/Honda_Factory_Oil,_2013_Accord What's even more alarming is the high TAN of almost 3 which means that the oil overall has turned acidic. The viscosity @ 100C is also getting very low @ around 7 cST. Factor in the high amount of wear metals due to break in, it's best to change it out sooner rather than later.
TBN retention will vary depending on the application and operating conditions. I recently had a UOA come back on Mobil 1 0w20 after 13k and the TBN was still 4....and that oil starts at around 8. Also, there was a recent post in the UOA section where the user mentioned the virgin TAN of the Amsoil product he was using...I believe it was in the 4 range. Very few oils have a starting TAN of 0....they're usually around 3.
 
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Interesting that you can't trust Honda's OLM calibration with the oil that they put in the vehicle...something's seriously wrong with the thought process here, and I don't think it's Honda's. That being said, I'm not a fan of a full length OCI on a new engine.
 
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Originally Posted By: HKPolice
Idemitsu 0w20 Full synthetic, high moly. TBN is low, recommend you change it out when OLM hits ~30%.
It's not "high moly" except by accident. Excerpts from the August 2006 edition of Honda Service News: "The engine oil looks that way because of molybdenum (that’s “moly” for short), a special lubricant applied by the factory to critical engine components during assembly. "When the engine is test-run, that molybdenum mixes with the engine oil, turning it a dark metallic color often within the first 5 minutes of running. And just how dark that engine oil turns seems to vary between vehicle models, engine types, and engine assembly plants. "What’s really important to remember here is this: Don’t change the factory-fill engine oil because it looks dark; just make sure it’s at the right fluid level. To ensure proper engine break-in, the factory-fill engine oil needs to remain in the engine until the first scheduled maintenance interval."
 
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I would change it out at 2,000-3,000 miles. I like treating the SECOND fill as the factory fill. The fill they did at the factory could be contaminated with anything, and full of sand from the Aluminum casting process. I just feel better knowing it is changed early. There is no science to back it up. If you notice that the factory fill is bugging you, change it ASAP. That is all it amounts to. And don't worry, your second fill will have plenty of junk still circulating around during the break in process, no need to feel like you wasted the factory oil.
 
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Originally Posted By: Falken
The fill they did at the factory could be contaminated with anything, and full of sand from the Aluminum casting process.
That's what oil filters are for. Plus, if there was "sand" in there, then Honda's quality-control would be about par with British Leyland in the '70s. I think not. I re-quote Honda's own engineers: To ensure proper engine break-in, the factory-fill engine oil needs to remain in the engine until the first scheduled maintenance interval. You just gave them $25,000 for some of their machinery, and now you won't listen to them when they tell you how to take care of it. That makes NO sense.
 
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Originally Posted By: Tegger
Originally Posted By: Falken
The fill they did at the factory could be contaminated with anything, and full of sand from the Aluminum casting process.
That's what oil filters are for. Plus, if there was "sand" in there, then Honda's quality-control would be about par with British Leyland in the '70s. I think not. I re-quote Honda's own engineers: To ensure proper engine break-in, the factory-fill engine oil needs to remain in the engine until the first scheduled maintenance interval. You just gave them $25,000 for some of their machinery, and now you won't listen to them when they tell you how to take care of it. That makes NO sense.
+1
 
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Originally Posted By: Vern_in_IL
I would like to see some first oil change factory oil filters cut open!
Me too
 
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Being in the market for a new car I've been perusing 2014 Honda (and other) Owners' Manuals on line. As far as I can tell, current Honda manuals make no mention of leaving the factory fill in the engine for a specified period of time. In fact, the manuals don't seem to mention a break-in process/period at all. So the prior firm advice to leave the factory fill in 'til the IOLM hit 15% may be a thing of the past.
 
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+2. Our daughter just bought a 14 Accord 4 cyl.and wife has an 07 Accord. Advised her to do as we did and follow Hondas recommendation on the FF. They've built somewhere north of 11 million Accords so think I'll go with Honda on this one
 
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Sand from the aluminum casting....what the? I needed a good laugh this morning. All those people that got 300k miles on their Honda engines must have all changed the FF early. Always good entertainment on this site
 
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Originally Posted By: bigt61
Sand from the aluminum casting....what the? I needed a good laugh this morning. All those people that got 300k miles on their Honda engines must have all changed the FF early. Always good entertainment on this site
OMG this is like totally so rude, for all you the sand in his car was from the lack of an oil filter on the engine! yes brilliant advice being given here, though it is 10 times better then other car forums, where everyone is like OMG 3000 MAX OIL CHANGE DUDE OMG! NO MATTER WHAT OMG!
 
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