A question for any Vietnam Army or Marine vet

[mikeg5]

Originally Posted By: kb01
Originally Posted By: JimR
I was in Vietnam from 69-70 with the U.S. Army's Americal Division in a place called Chu Lai which is in the central highlands. I was an infantryman assigned to the 198th Light Infantry Brigade on LZ Gator.

The temperature was stifling hot all the time and the humidity was worse. When we were on a mission we carried very heavy packs (rucksacks) along with our rifle, a lot of ammo and a steel helmet. The only way you could avoid heatstroke was to drink lots of water and keep a wet towel draped around your neck.

It was difficult to avoid sickness because our resistance was real low due to the long hours and horrific conditions. There was a lot of luck and genetics involved in not coming down with Malaria or other debilitating conditions. I arrived in Vietnam at a robust 190 lbs and when I left I weighed 150 lbs. It was a place that was not for the faint of heart.


I have an incredible amount of respect for what you and other Vietnam veterans went through. My father, father in law and uncles served and the hardships they endured are almost unbelievable to me.

I served in the Army infantry during peacetime and have doubts about whether I could have hacked it over there. I served throughout the Balkans in the 1990's and was never really in any danger but am still horrified about what we saw (and cleaned up after) in regards to what human beings are willing to do to each other. Seeing it happen to children is what really got to me.


i have read some about that IO. never knew where were there most of the time. what did you do or can you tell us?

 

[Loobed]

Originally Posted By: Hemi426
What were the weather/temps like in South Vietnam in the summertime?I've been led to believe that it was very hot and humid. How did you avoid heat sickness and sun/heat stroke with all that gear and dark green clothing on? Thank you in advance.



Go to Columbus Georgia (Ft Benning) in July or August. You will know what it was like.

 

[kb01]

Originally Posted By: mikeg5


i have read some about that IO. never knew where were there most of the time. what did you do or can you tell us?


I served on several deployments in the region in the mid 90's and then Kosovo (IRC) in '99/2000 right before getting out.

I was mechanized infantry and we were always the "heavy" battalion for our sectors. We didn't have any tanks because of the terrain and (I'm assuming) they couldn't be airlifted in, so Bradleys were designated for anti-armor purposes. My first unit was demobilized due to downsizing and we always deployed as part of task forces, attached to other units.

We mostly did a lot of presence patrols on foot and mounted in HMMWVs, setup checkpoints, guarded mosques & churches, searched buildings, manned guard towers, etc. Most of our work was guarding whoever happened to be the minority in our sector. I was never in really danger but my company lost five men in a helicopter crash. We also had to do some odd tasks, like walking children to school and escorting school buses (people would throw rocks, take pop shots at, or set up barricades otherwise). The more miserable stuff involved assisting in the clean up or securing an area after a bombing and my platoon being selected to help excavate a mass grave for about a month.

Some of it was really rewarding and when we first went into Kosovo, it felt like what I imagined my grandfather liberating Paris felt like -- We'd get swarmed by people wanting to shake our hands, kids would line up to high five us, and women would try to hug us. Other than that, it was more boring than anything -- lots of guard duty, endless patrols, lots of mud, living in a tent in winter...

Sorry for derailing the OP's thread...

 

[JimR]

Hemi426, I have never gone back to Vietnam, nor would I want to at this stage of my life. I have had no contact with old unit members and have not gone to any reunions, if there were any.

I did have email contact with the sister of one of the men who died on a mission we were on in July 1969. I had visited the Vietnam Virtual Wall online and wrote a tribute to him under his name on the wall. The sister apparently read what I had written and contacted me via the email address that I left there. She and I had a nice conversation and she did ask about the circumstances of her brother's untimely death. You never know what the Army tells the relatives of soldiers killed in action. I told her what had happened to her brother and she was happy that she was able to speak with someone who had actually observed her brother die. It was a sad time for both of us.

I still do not have closure with the visiting of the Vietnam Wall in Washington, DC. I have yet to get there. However, I did visit one of those portable "traveling walls" that go around the country while I was in Ft. Lauderdale, FL. I was able to get computer printouts of all the men that I remembered who were killed when I was there. Needless to say, even the mini Vietnam Wall was an emotional experience.

If anyone wants me to talk about specific missions or experiences in the jungle, please let me know and I will. I thank you all for listening.

 

[Hemi426]

Jim, I sincerely hope you feel up to visiting the wall someday if you feel you need to. No shame in not doing so either. I feel it could be one of those experiences which could bring closure but on the other hand it may open old wounds. Only your soul and God can tell you what to do. Now for some more questions. Were you routinely airlifted on missions via a Huey? That's something I want to do before I die is take a ride onboard a Huey. I know you guys took long walks on search and destroy missions so is it true what they say about war? I've heard it described as 23 hours of boredom then an hour of sheer terror and calamity. Did you ever have run-ins with poisonous snakes? Was Charlie a really tough adversary or was most of it the fact that he had the home turf advantage and that made him seem more skillful than he really was? Please feel free to tell me anything that you feel comfortable with about your missions. I would greatly appreciate it because I'm trying to learn all I can about the war. Thanks in advance.

 

[hr1940]

This is from a wife's point of view. Tony was in recon and their job was to light up ships carrying arms and then get out of the way because at that time a sam missile was locked on. That is all he would say about his tour over there. We did not go to any war movies or discuss his job. For a while certain sounds bothered him. The wives were treated very poorly also and at that time the majority of us did not have a support system. Later I had a supervisor that informed me she would rather see her child dead than in the military and informed me she had no use for the military or their families. I quit as soon as I could find another job. I am very proud of the men and women that have served and are serving to protect our freedom. I am and was very proud to be a Navy wife.

 

[ekpolk]

Jim:

I seem to have walked away from 29 years of USMC service (about 15 years active, the remainder in the USMCR), and I'm still not sure how I pulled that off. I suspect you understand the concept. I am, of course, after your time (80-09 for me).

Lot's of folks seem to have preconceived notions about what VietNam vets want to talk about, or not. Do whatever you feel is right for you. You earned the right to handle it however you like.

 

[Hemi426]

Yes Maam, I'm glad that you brought that up. The wife and family are often an unintentional casualty when a soldier comes back from combat. I would suppose that in many instances he or she would seem to not be the person that you married. You also bring up an excellent point that in the Vietnam-era there were no support groups for wives. I can imagine that many husbands were very moody and it must be terrifying laying next to someone when they have a flashback/nightmare in the middle of the night. The military wives deserve a lot of credit for trying to hold marriages and families together.

 

[SaturnIonVue]

I have been monitoring this thread over the time it has been open. I can understand the interest and curiosity that our younger members have for this subject, and welcome it...even though I can't and won't participate directly with comments or stories. I will say that I am still very affected by hyper vigilance and hyper startle reaction that is very embarrassing and disproportionate to any real threats in my current environment. Any loud noises, popping sounds, banging, or thumping sounds upset me, big time. Worse is when other people notice my reactions, and comment...and sometimes I feel obligated to try to explain it, which is often a waste of time as they usually have no frame of reference for that context! It is, what it is...and I live with it.

At my age, I doubt that that will ever go away. I live within about 10 miles of downtown New Orleans and have never been to any Mardi Gras parades because sudden movements and people acting out drives me straight up a wall--and once you are in a massive dense crowd like that, it is nearly impossible to leave. So I've missed about the last 20 or so seasons that I've lived here.

Having said this, to add insult to injury, about 15 or so years ago, an American psychiatric association declared that all such disorders were to be defined as a form of mental illness. Well, I can't begin to describe my visceral reaction to that wonderful pronouncement, other than to say that, that was "the unkindest cut of all" and I darn sure resent(ed) it!

Anyway, at the risk of high-jacking the thread there is something about the Vietnam Era that inquiring minds should know about, and that I doubt that one person in 100,000 knows about, or ever heard of. This is the best kept and forgotten "open secret" of the Vietnam Era: "Project 100,000."

Please Google it; read about it; understand the implications of it, and start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_100,000

I promise you, if you pursue the matter, you will be amazed, saddened, PO'ed and even vexed!

 

[JimR]

Hemi426, yes we were airlifted to just about every mission. The doors on the Huey were always open and you could actually ride with your legs dangling over the side if you wanted to. The idea was to get out of the chopper as fast as possible when you landed. The most dangerous part of the chopper landing was at the drop sight. If the enemy was waiting in ambush when the choppers touched down, it puts you in a very vulnerable position from the get go. There is momentary chaos when you are fired upon when jumping out of the chopper. This was not a great way to start your day.

Our missions were primarily "Search and Destroy" as you mentioned. The problem with search and destroy is that we set ourselves up as easy targets. We plodded through the jungle and 88% of the time, the enemy saw us first. They would lie in wait and either shoot our pointman or wait until half of the platoon walked by and then try to kill our Lieutenant. The Lt and his radioman were always in the middle of the formation and easy to spot. They figured that we would be easy prey if they were able to kill our leader. When fired upon, we would assume defensive positions, return fire and call in airstrikes if we were overwhelmed.

There were two different enemy soldiers, the Vietcong and the North Vietnamese Army (NVA) regulars. The Vietcong (VC) were local moderately trained fighters who would fight and then disappear into the jungle. The NVA were highly trained soldiers who were a very formidable opponent. They would stand and fight for long periods of time and then retreat to jungle hideaways. The NVA were fierce fighters who were as good and sometimes better than us. Unfortunately, most of our encounters were with the NVA.

Luckily, we never had any run-ins with poisonous snakes. The enemy booby traps were more dangerous than any snakes. Your pointman was always on the lookout for trip wires that triggered all kinds of horrible destructive devices. They would attach grenades to trip wires, sharpened bamboo traps to trip wires, sharpened bamboo pits that you could fall into, and sharpened bamboo sticks that you could step on. When you stepped on a bamboo stick (called a pungee stick) it would go through your boot and then through your foot. They also put feces on the pungee stick to further complicate your wound. It was not a pretty sight, luckily, I never stepped on a pungee stick. The Army finally woke up and started issuing jungle boots that had steel plates in the sole so that the pungee sticks could not penetrate.

I don't know how much I can type in each reply. I can keep going if you wanted to hear more.

 

[Jeff3126]

I talked with a Vietnam Veteran a little while ago. He did "search & destroy" and "long range patrol". One of the things he told me that stuck in my head was "everyone carried ammo for the '60, because that '60 was gonna keep you alive." He also told me some of the things they did with det cord, which I won't mention.

 

[Hemi426]

Jim,
I'm eternally grateful that you've shared your stories with me. You've been a treasure chest full of info that I never would have known unless I came into contact with you. I won't pester you with any more questions unless it's something important that I need to know. You've been a very gracious host to me on a subject that is so painful to so many. The large cemetery down the road from my house has a special section of buried war dead. There are about ten Vietnam KIA laid to rest there. On Monday, I will visit their graves and say a little prayer. I'll say a prayer for you too, Jim, because of your service and courage in helping fight communism and because you are a good man. God Bless you and yours, Hemi426 in Pennsylvania.

 

[JimR]

Hemi426, Jeff3126 is absolutely right, everyone carried belts of ammo for the M-60 machine gunner because he was the most important player in every firefight.

We had just finished a sweep of a suspected VC village and were feeling good about ourselves for a job well done. That day, Armored Personnel Carriers (APC's)were with us and we were able to ride aboard to rest up a bit. All of a sudden we came under small arms and rocket propelled grenade(RPG)fire from a treeline in the distance. We were ordered off the APC's so that the gunner could return fire. We jumped down into the rice paddy and found ourselves knee deep in muck. It was difficult to pull your legs out of the muck to run clear of the APC. The APC immediately started to backup as they are taught to do when taking fire. Then the unthinkable happened, the APC ran over several of our men. The first man lost his foot, a second man was cushioned by the muck but the APC broke his leg and the third man was crushed to death. Our Lt called in an airstrike and napalm was dropped on the enemy in the treeline. When the skirmish was finally over, we had the gruesome task of trying to find the man that was crushed beneath the APC. We spaced ourselves and walked in a straight line in knee deep muck. None of us wanted to be the one who found our soldier in the muck. Finally one of the guys found him under two feet of water. He was pale, wet, covered with algae and most of the blood was out of him. He was rolled up in a poncho and prepped for Medevac. In a half hours time, we had lost 17 men. The man under the APC got the worst of it. We were ordered to a designated pickup area and we returned to the base camp.

I salute all the veteran's on this upcoming Memorial Day!

 

[crinkles]

I have a lot of respect for you guys.

 

[wwillson]

Visit the wall on a warm summer night. Reach out and touch it, it will touch you in ways you couldn't imagine.

Wayne

 

[Virtuoso]

I've seen the traveling wall when it visited a town close to ours. All those names, all those people who sacrificed everything..

God bless our troops, past present and future

 

[Hemi426]

http://www.americal.org/198/

Jim,
Does any of this apply to your division or service?

 

[JimR]

Hemi426, yes it applies to the unit I was in.

More specifically, I was with Company A, 5th Battalion, 46th Infantry, 198th Light Infantry Brigade of the Americal Division.

If there is anything else you wish to know, please feel free to ask. I appreciate you and everyone else taking the time to read about some of my experiences.

 

[Bugzii]

Originally Posted By: Hemi426
First of all, Thank you for your courage and service. I'm a big Vietnam War buff and I know you guys never got the welcome home which you so richly deserved. I have a question. What were the weather/temps like in South Vietnam in the summertime?I've been led to believe that it was very hot and humid. How did you avoid heat sickness and sun/heat stroke with all that gear and dark green clothing on? Thank you in advance.


Not a vet but I've been there a few times.

Weather...

Depends where you are in the country, what altitude and which month/season.

South (ie Saigon or since '75 Ho Chi Minh City):
Summer months are actually the cooler months with some rain. Hottest months (late March to July). Very humid!!!

Central (ie Da Nang, Quy-Nhon, Nha Trang)
Summer months (June-August) are the hottest but less humidity than the south. Then the rainy season begins. Central part of the country also includes the highlands (Pleiku, DaLak, Da Lat) which are much cooler. The French used to R/R in Da Lat.

North (ie Ha Noi)
Very hot and humid during the summer months. In shallow water (river, streams) fish would die. Cold winter and beautiful spring weather. The north also has the highland (ie Sapa) towards Laos and the Chinese borders which are much cooler than the rest of the country.

Overall, it's the humidity that annoying (unless you like humidity). Much like our deep South. You should visit if you get a chance. Beautiful country through out, safe and still quite affordable. You'll be amazed how much ordinary Vietnamese people are fond of Americans.

As for the war, I suggest reading about Vietnam and its people and its history of fierce resistance against foreign invaders... China (1000 years), Mongolia (13th century), France (100 years). American policy makers (political & military) got it wrong in so many ways. The price was heavy on both sides but Vietnam (and its neighbors Laos and Cambodia) got it worse. But that another story entirely...

 

[Hemi426]

Jim,
Did you ever go on any night missions? Did you ever come close to being bombed by your own airstrikes? Were you ever attacked by the VC/NVA at night when you were sleeping? Where did you go and what did you do for R&R?