88 octane unleaded without ethanol less expensive than 87 octane with ethanol?

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I doubt that "some" Meijer stations sell it. They all sell the same and I've never seen it at a Meijer. They sell gas purely as a convenience to their customers, not for offering variety and choices of fuel.

Every Meijer gas station I have seen in Wisconsin sells E85, I have not seen any Meijer gas stations that offer E15/UNL88.
 

grampi

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I doubt that "some" Meijer stations sell it. They all sell the same and I've never seen it at a Meijer. They sell gas purely as a convenience to their customers, not for offering variety and choices of fuel.
I am going to call various stations in my area to find out if any of them do...personally, I will be surprised if any of them do. Ethanol-free gas is becoming a thing of the past...
 
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So one more time - what is the obsession with e-free gas? The slight bump in mpgs?
I don't care in cars or trucks since the tank is well sealed and it gets used up fast, but for small engines/boats/motorcycles, etc I like to use ethanol free fuel. Ethanol free fuel stores for a longer time without collecting water and doesn't cause problems in small carbs as easy
 
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I don't recall a similar obsession with MTBE-free gas (back when MTBE gas was still being sold), despite MTBE causing lower mpgs as ethanol does...

MTBE wasn’t as prone to phase separation and didn’t attract water as quickly. But I think the issues with ethanol are overblown. I think MTBE was also easier to transport (can go in most pipelines) and could be premixed at the refinery. It was also more compatible with older cars where the seals might be an issue.

Newer cars use materials that take ethanol into consideration.
 

TiGeo

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I don't care in cars or trucks since the tank is well sealed and it gets used up fast, but for small engines/boats/motorcycles, etc I like to use ethanol free fuel. Ethanol free fuel stores for a longer time without collecting water and doesn't cause problems in small carbs as easy
Makes sense there for sure.
 

TiGeo

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MTBE wasn’t as prone to phase separation and didn’t attract water as quickly. But I think the issues with ethanol are overblown. I think MTBE was also easier to transport (can go in most pipelines) and could be premixed at the refinery. It was also more compatible with older cars where the seals might be an issue.

Newer cars use materials that take ethanol into consideration.
Any modern car and can handle some E - 10% in most "normal" gas dictates it.
 

TiGeo

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I know for me I wouldn't ever run e-free in my car, the knock/det resistance is mandatory. I've run e-free race gas before but that's about it.
 
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I know for me I wouldn't ever run e-free in my car, the knock/det resistance is mandatory. I've run e-free race gas before but that's about it.

It’s possible to have higher octane non-oxygenated fuel as you noted. But it can’t just be made. There refining and cracking, but at the end they can’t just separate out high octane fuels and then figure out what to do with the rest that can’t be sold as fuel.

Ethanol has a blending octane rating of about 110 AKI. It’s kind of hard to ignore that even with with drawbacks.
 

grampi

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So one more time - what is the obsession with e-free gas? The slight bump in mpgs?
I've always read that ethanol-free gas is better for your engine. Supposedly the ethanol is hard on the fuel injectors...is this not the case?
 

TiGeo

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It’s possible to have higher octane non-oxygenated fuel as you noted. But it can’t just be made. There refining and cracking, but at the end they can’t just separate out high octane fuels and then figure out what to do with the rest that can’t be sold as fuel.

Ethanol has a blending octane rating of about 110 AKI. It’s kind of hard to ignore that even with with drawbacks.
It's the magic corn juice for me! 2.5 gal in my 14.5 gal tank is all I need for KR-free sending it!
 

TiGeo

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I've always read that ethanol-free gas is better for your engine. Supposedly the ethanol is hard on the fuel injectors...is this not the case?
Not anymore - that's old-school. Used to be the E wasn't great for carbureted engines etc. but modern cars are built to handle the more corrosive alcohol.
 
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Not anymore - that's old-school. Used to be the E wasn't great for carbureted engines etc. but modern cars are built to handle the more corrosive alcohol.

The biggest issue has always been seal materials and tubing. However, with many classic cars, these parts degraded years ago and have been replaced. I heard some used to modify their setups for racing, where they’d blend ethanol to boost octane levels

Another issue is that a lot of them are driven occasionally, and they don’t have modern, sealed fuel systems. They might have similar issues as power equipment.
 

TiGeo

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The biggest issue has always been seal materials and tubing. However, with many classic cars, these parts degraded years ago and have been replaced. I heard some used to modify their setups for racing, where they’d blend ethanol to boost octane levels

Another issue is that a lot of them are driven occasionally, and they don’t have modern, sealed fuel systems. They might have similar issues as power equipment.
Agreed, but at 10% at moist in modern fuels, I can't believe this makes any difference even in an older muscle car etc.
 
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Agreed, but at 10% at moist in modern fuels, I can't believe this makes any difference even in an older muscle car etc.

I’d think any properly cared for car over 50 years old would have had its seals and hoses replaced with modern materials. But part of the problem might be junkers that never had those replaced and they leak/fail. It might not be ideal, but new seals made from the original materials might not have serious issues - at least initially.

Still - an old car without a sealed emissions system might have problems with attracting water, especially if it’s not driven often.
 
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You can get it in Amarillo when you are on the road.
Toot n’ Totum on Soncy and the one on Georgia at 34th both have it.
For a few years I made my own E0 for my yard equipment. Took 93 E10 and added 32 oz of water. Drained the water out. Ethanol and water attract to each other but not to the gas. My yard equipment loved it. Both E10 and E0 lasted about the same amount of time. So now I run E10 every 3 months and what ever doesn’t get used I dump it in my truck.
 

TiGeo

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I fill my jug with 2 gal 87 E10 and some Stabil. What's left at end of year goes in one of the vehicles.
 

MJS

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It's interesting when people say that they lose so much fuel economy using E10 or E15 gas.

Assuming that ethanol contributes NOTHING to the combustion process (which is not true), the most you could lose is 10% running E10 vs ethanol-free.

And the most you could lose is 5% running E15 vs E10.
When E10 first came out, I had a car that consistently got 40+ mpg.

After E10, my gas mileage dropped exactly by the energy ratios of E10/E0!

I never saw 40 mpg again in that car running E10. E10 has less energy per gallon and you see it in the fuel economy!

The car was a 2004 Honda Civic HX.
 
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