$55,000

[Tempest]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
If we hadn't spent a PENNY on bailouts and stimulus, I bet interest rates wouldn't be rising, some companies would have failed and been bought out, and we'd be in A LOT better circumstances.

+1

The figure in the article doesn't include the $2 trillion that the FED has put...somewhere...

 

[pickled]

Don't worry folks when the US is forced to trade in the worthless paper dollars (and sovereignty) for the new global currency all will be well again! The barter system is looking good again!

 

[JHZR2]

How about this: claim bankruptcy and let all previous obligations go to zero. If people have a hard time, well, guess what happens to them in the street?

The elite will then have fewer obligations on their hands, and less population to have to deal with.

That is bound to work, right???!?

 

[pickled]

JHZR2 I'm truly enjoying your thought pattern...[censored] original! I like soylent green myself...shhh it's people!

 

[pickled]

FYI there is a bill to audit the Federal Reserve- HR 1207. There were a number of times in this great nation's history where we did quite well without them. I bet the Fed will want to pick their auditors though LOL!!

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
If we hadn't spent a PENNY on bailouts and stimulus, I bet interest rates wouldn't be rising, some companies would have failed and been bought out, and we'd be in A LOT better circumstances.

+1

The figure in the article doesn't include the $2 trillion that the FED has put...somewhere...


This I can agree with. But Karma always found a way to come back and haunt you.

You can be out of a job because of all the bank failures may bankrupt even the FDIC.

You can bet for sure that all 3 of the major auto company will be bankrupted, and the parts supplier, and all of the car dealerships (because no one will be able to afford a car), no more import because US dollar vs Yen will go from 1:100 to probably 1:20.



I wasn't sure if this would be a bad thing other than the rich folks with lots of asset tied up will go bankrupt as well, and the retired will lose everything including their health care fund, 401k, IRA, etc. Jobs for once will come back to the US because the labor would be down to Indian/Chinese level, and every single debt out there will be deflated to nothing/affordable after the great inflation.


You can choose a deficit, or you can choose something the size of a great depression.

 

[Tempest]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
How about this: claim bankruptcy and let all previous obligations go to zero. If people have a hard time, well, guess what happens to them in the street?

The elite will then have fewer obligations on their hands, and less population to have to deal with.

That is bound to work, right???!?

That reduces the tax base and they don't like that...

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
You can choose a deficit, or you can choose something the size of a great depression.

The depression will be short (if gov. stays out of the way) and then you end up with a "clean" economy. What we are doing now will result in debt forever (future generations that did not accumulate the debt) and/or cause massive inflation...that will also cause depression and ruin the savings of the retired.

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
The depression will be short (if gov. stays out of the way) and then you end up with a "clean" economy.


How about severity? No comment on that?

Funny how recessions required stimulus in the form of tax cuts. No "let the chips fall as they may there"

Quote:
What we are doing now will result in debt forever (future generations that did not accumulate the debt)


Correction. What has already been done. The current circus remedies will surely make it worse.

Quote:
that will also cause depression and ruin the savings of the retired.


Don't you mean, "The retired that count?". Everyone I know just had any savings that they had before retirement robbed with the housing market. Demographics would have killed it anyway ..but ..no..we couldn't wait for that. Better rip them off NOW before then.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan

Don't you mean, "The retired that count?". Everyone I know just had any savings that they had before retirement robbed with the housing market. Demographics would have killed it anyway ..but ..no..we couldn't wait for that. Better rip them off NOW before then.


Why?

Frankly, they should have paid their homes off long before retirement in order to have made a smart choice, at which point, the housing market would be irrelevant.

Property taxes aside, maintenance is maintnance, and cash savings is erroded by inflation, not by the housing market.

Sounds like a potential case of poor choices?

 

[Gary Allan]

JHZR2= just about everyone's savings is in their home. The VAST MAJORITY.

Poor choices? Yes, just like the jackarse that has a Phd with no job of merit ..the business major selling shoes ..waiting for the boss to move on from "slumming it"..etc..etc. He would have been smarter going into a trade.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
The depression will be short (if gov. stays out of the way) and then you end up with a "clean" economy. What we are doing now will result in debt forever (future generations that did not accumulate the debt) and/or cause massive inflation...that will also cause depression and ruin the savings of the retired.


Maybe we can evict everyone from New York City for the cause of eminent domain and move everything to a less congested Newer York, or relocate everything from Alaska and do a land swap with Canada. That will be way more efficient to run a country that is continuous, and have all new city instead of having to fix old ones.

Let's try it and see how it works.


Maybe the recession will be shorter, but if you bankrupt most of the employers who would be employed? We have seen the great depression and its impact, I'm sure you would love to be living in the central park for a few years, and do your share to expedite the recovery.

You also forget that while we are recovering from a very deep recession, other nations could take our place as the lead economic powerhouse on the world stage. Look at Iceland and how much its currency devalued, do you really think it couldn't happen if nothing is done?

 

[Gary Allan]

But how will there be any kicking to the curb if we keep bailing things out?

Think of all those lost opportunities

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
JHZR2= just about everyone's savings is in their home. The VAST MAJORITY.

Poor choices? Yes, just like the jackarse that has a Phd with no job of merit ..the business major selling shoes ..waiting for the boss to move on from "slumming it"..etc..etc. He would have been smarter going into a trade.


No, their home is the entity in which they live. It has no value unless they sell it (or take a reverse mortgage I suppose).

Have to live someplace, so ultimately, it is kind of hard to practically turn over the entire value into cash. Unless you trade it to a nursing home that guarantees to not kick you out if you run out of money - so you have a "home" until you die.

It is like holding a penny stock. Someone may hold a million shares, that they bought at 1/1000 of a cent. if they spike to $1 per, they are a millionaire on paper, but they don't actually have anything. If it drops, they arent a millionaire anymore.

In other words, it is only savings if you sell it.

They didnt, their fault. Maybe they should have taken their profit when retiring... otherwise their home was just their holding as a residence, not a true store of "savings".

One of the big problems that formed was from people using their homes as savings to fund a lifestyle their income couldn't afford. Bad choice.

 

[Gary Allan]

All fine and good ..but the reality is that most people devote just about all of their financial worth in their home.

Yes, the equity purgers are not wise ..but again, how would one expand an economy without people spending more than they currently have? You didn't over look that fundamental element, did you??

Again, just what do you think the USA would be as an economic power house if everyone was just like you and your wife? You would have 30 year old MB's that you imported new ..a long time ago from an economy far far away. You would be Chancy Gardner's with 1982 suits in perfect shape.

So there goes the auto and fashion industry ..who are composed of frugal clones that are recycling last year's fabrics

..and the list goes on.

without the dummies ..you're not so distinctive. Your superior wisdom is only superior because of them. Remove them, and you remove your distinction. That doesn't even include the unaccounted for side effects.

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
We have seen the great depression and its impact

The Great depression was made great by government action. Many of which we are repeating today.

Your land swap thing is totally befuddling.

 

[Bowser]

The bottom line is that tax revenues cannot support the level of spending that's currently being proposed by congress and this administration.

Pay attention to a federal value-added tax, or VAT legislation, to be proposed by congress sometime this year. This is a clever means to levy a national sales tax on finished goods without the consumer knowing it.

Cap and Trade, and the repayment of TARP will be viewed as additional sources of government revenue by Pelosi and her gang.

We'll have European style taxation to get us out of this mess but with nowhere near European benefits.

 

[digitalSniperX1]

...befuddling...aww, nevermind.

Why bother man? I mean with an analogy/hypothetical like that you must limit your response to that which fits PMS bout.

In other words, nod while smiling and be silent.