2021 Lincoln Navigator L, 3.5L Ecoboost, 3000 Miles, Supertech Advanced 5W30 API SP

Maybe I read more into your answer than you intended, but don’t some oils lose more visc than others? Whether they shear more or retain the fuel more, dont know, but I would want to avoid those.
Fuel dilution is a function of the engine, not the oil. Viscosity loss through shear on the other hand, yes, that varies by oil. Some oils are significantly more shear resistant than others. In the case of the OP's situation, the Pennzoil product resisted shear significantly better, but the SuperTech stayed in grade because it started out heavier, despite exhibiting more absolute viscosity loss.
I jumped the gun buying the Amsoil for next time because somebody’s Ecoboost UOA showed it stayed in grade, despite starting at mere 10.3, and assume some fuel dilution (I need to find that UOA again…it’s here on BITOG somewhere, but unfortunately, i think it was a Blackstone report).
If it was a Blackstone report, you really don't know what the fuel level is. Like the OP demonstrated, the same engine can produce wildly different levels of fuel dilution just due to changes in usage profile and you don't know that has happened until you do your UOA.
I wanted to mix a little 0w40 SS, in with the 5w30 SS (ASL), to get a slightly thicker blend, but Amsoil told me I shouldn’t. They also steered me away from their (thicker) Euro 5w30, for this engine. I’m here on BITOG because dodging dilution, LSPI, IVD, chainwear, and moderately long OCI etc is daunting challenge In an Gen 1 Ecoboost.
Well, you'll never "dodge" dilution, all you can do is offset it by using a heavier lubricant, and reduce it via drive profile. That said, unless it's having a demonstrably ill effect on the engine, I wouldn't be super concerned about it. DI engines dilute, that's what they do, it's a part of their function and the OEM's are aware of that.
 
Thanks everyone for your responses!

When you have these turbo direct injected engines or direct injected engines which lets face it the auto makers are still experimenting with I think the best idea is to keep the oil changes to 3000 miles. This is what the Ford Tech on Youtube suggests and he was a Ford Master tech at a dealership who now owns his own repair business. I have found his videos detailed and suggestions correct.

I am willing to spend a little money on oil but Pennzoil is simply too expensive and sometimes its mail-order only...not available at the local Walmart. Being available at Walmart is important because sometimes we dont have time around here to scramble looking for oil or waiting for the UPS truck to show up. I want to be able to walk into my local Walmart which isnt too far from here and grab it off the shelf when I need it.

As for changing labs, I will continue to use Blackstone. I have no issues with its analysis.

So in the future I will be using this SuperTech Advanced. No issues with it at all. While the thicker oils work well we must have an eye on the fuel economy. Even if its just a half to 1 mpg better that saves thousands of dollars in the long run and also faster warmup during winter months.
 
Fuel dilution is a function of the engine, not the oil. Viscosity loss through shear on the other hand, yes, that varies by oil. Some oils are significantly more shear resistant than others. In the case of the OP's situation, the Pennzoil product resisted shear significantly better, but the SuperTech stayed in grade because it started out heavier, despite exhibiting more absolute viscosity loss.

If it was a Blackstone report, you really don't know what the fuel level is. Like the OP demonstrated, the same engine can produce wildly different levels of fuel dilution just due to changes in usage profile and you don't know that has happened until you do your UOA.

Well, you'll never "dodge" dilution, all you can do is offset it by using a heavier lubricant, and reduce it via drive profile. That said, unless it's having a demonstrably ill effect on the engine, I wouldn't be super concerned about it. DI engines dilute, that's what they do, it's a part of their function and the OEM's are aware of that.
At least for the member in DFW to consider - several good SP variants available in 10W30 …
I have M1 EP 10W30 on deck for my 5.3L GDI …
 
I would not stress over fuel dilution. Your maintenance plan seems to be working well.

The 3.5 Ecoboost in our Expedition continues to run well on Motorcraft oil changed every 5-6k. 125k miles and counting.
 
At least for the member in DFW to consider - several good SP variants available in 10W30 …
I have M1 EP 10W30 on deck for my 5.3L GDI …
Yeah, I keep looking toward 0w40, but 10w30 might be another way to skin the cat, in Texas, or summers up north. I am somewhat OK with using “normal” Walmart-sourced full Syn 5w30 in my winter OCI (less miles…usually 2500-3500 mi), but want to take the 7.5k+ summer road-trip on a single OCI; a 10w30 might withstand the fuel dil better, and/or shear less on its own. I do see freezing nighttime temps toward the very end of that trip, but they have always been >20F, in fact below 28F only once or twice, which might be a little harder on things with a 10w30, but we are not talking N. Dakota kinda stuff. Heh, the forecast is to hit 11F here in DFW just before Christmas. Yeah, we’re wimps. But nothing here is built for that; I bet my furnace runs quite a bit those nights, since my 100year old house is built like a sieve.
 
Yeah, I keep looking toward 0w40, but 10w30 might be another way to skin the cat, in Texas, or summers up north. I am somewhat OK with using “normal” Walmart-sourced full Syn 5w30 in my winter OCI (less miles…usually 2500-3500 mi), but want to take the 7.5k+ summer road-trip on a single OCI; a 10w30 might withstand the fuel dil better, and/or shear less on its own. I do see freezing nighttime temps toward the very end of that trip, but they have always been >20F, in fact below 28F only once or twice, which might be a little harder on things with a 10w30, but we are not talking N. Dakota kinda stuff. Heh, the forecast is to hit 11F here in DFW just before Christmas. Yeah, we’re wimps. But nothing here is built for that; I bet my furnace runs quite a bit those nights, since my 100year old house is built like a sieve.
I can’t seem to find it - but perhaps O/K or Buster still have that (generic) Mobil formula guide
(to compare VM percentage) …
 
Edge 0w40 in my 2016 gen 1 eco since 400miles. Purrs like a kitten and starts silently. Pulls 8000lbs through the Rockies in the summer and starts at -30 outside in the winter. FL500s filters and 4000 mile oil changes.
 
I wanted to mix a little 0w40 SS, in with the 5w30 SS (ASL), to get a slightly thicker blend, but Amsoil told me I shouldn’t. They also steered me away from their (thicker) Euro 5w30, for this engine. I’m here on BITOG because dodging dilution, LSPI, IVD, chainwear, and moderately long OCI etc is daunting challenge In an Gen 1 Ecoboost.

🤨 no company would openly suggest you play garage chemist and mix your own blend. That’s why you don’t ask the company and instead, ask random dudes on an oil forum.

I say you mix whatever you want to thicken it up or go for the Euro spec.

. While the thicker oils work well we must have an eye on the fuel economy. Even if its just a half to 1 mpg better that saves thousands of dollars in the long run and also faster warmup during winter months.

There’s absolutely NO WAY you’ll see half an mpg worth from switching between 0w20 & 5w30.

My Mazda specs 0w20 and I’ve ran 0w40 in it. No change in my average MPGs during the entire interval.

Currently running 5w30 and easily beat the EPA rating for my car.
 
Oil: SuperTech (Walmart) Advanced 5W30 API SP
Vehicle: 2021 Lincoln Navigator L
Engine: 3.5L Ecoboost High Output 440 horsepower Generation 2
Miles on oil: 3000

Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5W30 is the next column over.

View attachment 124331

Great report for a TGDI, even for a NA port injected this would be a good report.
 
The best way to deal with fuel dilution is by changing the oil 3000 miles. I am now on my 3rd Lincoln Navigator and have had a 2018. 2021 and now a 2023. The 18 and 21 were both fuel dilution monsters. In the distant past I dealt with it by doing 5000 mile oil changes with 5W40 Euro and HDEO oil. However, as gas prices keep going up I switched back to 5W30. So what happens now is I use cheaper oil found at Walmart that has been proven worthy in tests and change it out at 3000 miles.

OIls like Amsoil, Redline and even Pennzoil Ultra Platinum are great oils, but they are expensive and can be hard to source. Its also quite expensive doing 3000 mile oil changes with them. Thus the cheaper SuperTech which performs very well in Blackstone tests at 3000 mile intervals is what I do. Changing it out every 3000 miles is best for this 440 horsepower beast.

Now the Ford Expedition is a different truck with a lower power/lower turbo boost. It should be more durable then the engine in the Ford Raptor/Lincoln Navigator. For a work truck you should go with the lower power option and get it with the tow package that has the heavy duty radiator. Maybe that lower power engine dilutes less and has less issues. In my experience lower power always means greater long term durability and thats what you need in a worktruck. I can tell you from experience not to play with oil change times on the 440 horsepower version of this engine. Just change it out at 3000 miles and use a full synthetic which tests well to do it. You dont need Redline or Amsoil. You dont need Pennzoil Ultra Platinum. What you need is a decent full synthetic like SuperTech and change it every 3000 miles.

Besides fuel dilution there is also the issue of sludging. Changing at higher intervals increases the chance of sludge developing which is an issue for all engines at higher miles.

Lastly, I have to point out the radiator thermostat which has gotten stuck closed in the past on these Ecoboosts. There is a new thermostat introduced in 2022 which solves these overheating problems. I suggest a 30,000 mile interval for these thermostats. Since I do all my own work on the car its just 3 bolts for me to get the thermostat out. I do it much cheaper then the dealership. If the thermostat gets stuck closed the engine will overheat but no check engine light will come on. So if it overheats a little or a lot that means problems for the engine down the line. So its important to change the thermostat at 30,000 miles.
 
Just curious, do you plan on changing AND testing the oil every 3k miles? Seems like a waste to run a cheap oil and get it tested every time versus just running a better oil. Then to add to that, you're on your 3 Navigator in 5 years...Do you plan on keeping this one forever or just 2 to 3 years like the last two? Seems like your goal here is to not save money, so I guess I'm just curious on why all the testing.

I had a 2015 Expedition and a 2019 F150 (Expy had the 3.5; F150 had the 2.7) Ran them both on what ever 5w-30 synthetic was on sale, usually magnatec or the havoline 6 qt box and never had an issue...now of course I never tested the oil at any point cause I knew I was just going to run them to 100k miles and trade them in. OCI's were on average every 3 months which was 5k miles. We just bought a used 2019 Expedition platinum with the 400hp 3.5 with 62k miles. I have no idea how it was serviced in the past as the Carfax didn't show an oil change history. Haven't decided what I'm going to run long term in in yet, but I went to Walmart to get some oil and there wasn't much to choose from, saw the royal purple and it peaked my interest as I've never ran it before so I'm going to try that out for 5k miles.
 
I operate a fleet of vehicles where each vehicle is run daily doing livery work in the NYC area. I sell these vehicles every 2-3 years depending on the mileage. The oil gets changed every 3000 miles on each vehicle because we dont need problems. I have always changed the oil every 3000 miles and Im not going to stop now.

I have an account at Blackstone and oil analysis is performed on occasion. All my vehicles I watch closely and I only buy vehicles which I personally know.

Screenshot_20230215_085630_Photo Editor.jpg
 
Just curious, do you plan on changing AND testing the oil every 3k miles? Seems like a waste to run a cheap oil and get it tested every time versus just running a better oil. Then to add to that, you're on your 3 Navigator in 5 years...Do you plan on keeping this one forever or just 2 to 3 years like the last two? Seems like your goal here is to not save money, so I guess I'm just curious on why all the testing.

I had a 2015 Expedition and a 2019 F150 (Expy had the 3.5; F150 had the 2.7) Ran them both on what ever 5w-30 synthetic was on sale, usually magnatec or the havoline 6 qt box and never had an issue...now of course I never tested the oil at any point cause I knew I was just going to run them to 100k miles and trade them in. OCI's were on average every 3 months which was 5k miles. We just bought a used 2019 Expedition platinum with the 400hp 3.5 with 62k miles. I have no idea how it was serviced in the past as the Carfax didn't show an oil change history. Haven't decided what I'm going to run long term in in yet, but I went to Walmart to get some oil and there wasn't much to choose from, saw the royal purple and it peaked my interest as I've never ran it before so I'm going to try that out for 5k miles.
What I can tell you is that the 2019 Expedition you own is most likely overheating. You will need to flush the transmission and change the filter. You will need to change the thermostat with the revised thermostat as its probably sticking closed.

We had problems with the 10R80 in the earlier models. There were failures of the 10R80 around 70000 miles. Also there was the cold start rattle which took months in thr shop to fix...cam phaser problem. So you should beware of this vehicle. After sitting all night does the vehicle start up with a mysterious rattle?

The 2023 models are perfect. Everything was fixed. The 2018-2019 had many issues.
 
What I can tell you is that the 2019 Expedition you own is most likely overheating. You will need to flush the transmission and change the filter. You will need to change the thermostat with the revised thermostat as its probably sticking closed.

We had problems with the 10R80 in the earlier models. There were failures of the 10R80 around 70000 miles. Also there was the cold start rattle which took months in thr shop to fix...cam phaser problem. So you should beware of this vehicle. After sitting all night does the vehicle start up with a mysterious rattle?

The 2023 models are perfect. Everything was fixed. The 2018-2019 had many issues.
Strange cause my brother in law has a bone stock 2019 F150 with the 3.5 with over 100k on it an it runs like a top. This used expedition we got is also very smooth, much more so than the '15 we had. The '15 always had a strange flutter/stumble at idle. Sounds like you just had bad luck or are making problems out to be more than they actually are, which happens a lot on the internet.
 
I operate a fleet of vehicles where each vehicle is run daily doing livery work in the NYC area. I sell these vehicles every 2-3 years depending on the mileage. The oil gets changed every 3000 miles on each vehicle because we dont need problems. I have always changed the oil every 3000 miles and Im not going to stop now.

I have an account at Blackstone and oil analysis is performed on occasion. All my vehicles I watch closely and I only buy vehicles which I personally know.
You do you my brotha, I'm not trying to stop you. Just trying to understand the need for all the oil analysis that's all. Sounds like your driving style and environment is harsher than mine and I'd prob be doing frequent changes if I were you too. There are millions of these engines out there, the ones with the problems are usually the neglected ones.
 
@Navi , do you have the Part number for the “upgraded“ thermostat? Of course, it might not be correct temperature for 2015 (gen 1) EB3.5, but I could check out its specs, if I knew the part#.
 
@Navi , do you have the Part number for the “upgraded“ thermostat? Of course, it might not be correct temperature for 2015 (gen 1) EB3.5, but I could check out its specs, if I knew the part#.
Look on the Rockauto website under your vehicle and look for Motorcraft under cooling, thermostat. I looked just now and it looks like that is the revised thermostat. Double check it with the part on the Ford parts website...parts.ford.com. Rockauto is oftentimes correct but I would check Ford to be sure. The Motorcraft thermostat is the same as on the Ford website, but Ford is more expensive.

As for interval of thermostat change I am going to say 40,000 miles but it depends on different factors. If you have the old thermostat I would change it.with the new one.

If you are having cooling issues...oem air filter, plugs&coils, thermostat, remove engine cover, radiator reservoir cap and flush radiator. That would be the complete solution to resolve it.
 
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