Bump for more traffic...I'm interested in both cars as well. The 173 horses of the Kia looks nice in this segment
2013 Civic EX or 2014 KIA Forte EX??
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Originally Posted By: whip
I'm curious how many of the people that have commented have driven or owned both as the OP stated he only wanted response from those people........
Me.....hense with the civic being my choice...it's the better handling car of the two..
I'm curious how many of the people that have commented have driven or owned both as the OP stated he only wanted response from those people........
Me.....hense with the civic being my choice...it's the better handling car of the two..
Originally Posted By: Blue_Goose
Bump for more traffic...I'm interested in both cars as well. The 173 horses of the Kia looks nice in this segment
Just so you factor in that Hyundai/Kia horses are slightly smaller than some others. If their top of the line genesis type r is any indicator it is down a bit from the factory ratings. This may not apply to that particular platform you mentioned. Also they are known to fudge their mileage numbers as well, allegedly since corrected, but it tells you something...
Bump for more traffic...I'm interested in both cars as well. The 173 horses of the Kia looks nice in this segment
Just so you factor in that Hyundai/Kia horses are slightly smaller than some others. If their top of the line genesis type r is any indicator it is down a bit from the factory ratings. This may not apply to that particular platform you mentioned. Also they are known to fudge their mileage numbers as well, allegedly since corrected, but it tells you something...
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Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
[Also they are known to fudge their mileage numbers as well, allegedly since corrected, but it tells you something...
As with Fords.....
[Also they are known to fudge their mileage numbers as well, allegedly since corrected, but it tells you something...
As with Fords.....
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
[Also they are known to fudge their mileage numbers as well, allegedly since corrected, but it tells you something...
As with Fords.....
My Silverado doesn't touch the rated 21 either. Maybe 19 and some change if lucky and that is all highway 60-65
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
[Also they are known to fudge their mileage numbers as well, allegedly since corrected, but it tells you something...
As with Fords.....
My Silverado doesn't touch the rated 21 either. Maybe 19 and some change if lucky and that is all highway 60-65
I drove both and spent some extra seat time in a co-workers 2013 Civic.
I greatly prefer the Elantra over the civic. The dash layout and functionality in my opinion is much better. They drive similar with nothing the stood out. I also prefer the looks of the Hyundai but that isn't the subject at hand.
I purchased a 2013 Elantra GT and couldn't be happier with my decision. I hope I still feel this was in 10 years.
Cheers
I greatly prefer the Elantra over the civic. The dash layout and functionality in my opinion is much better. They drive similar with nothing the stood out. I also prefer the looks of the Hyundai but that isn't the subject at hand.
I purchased a 2013 Elantra GT and couldn't be happier with my decision. I hope I still feel this was in 10 years.
Cheers
Originally Posted By: dja4260
I drove both and spent some extra seat time in a co-workers 2013 Civic.
I greatly prefer the Elantra over the civic. The dash layout and functionality in my opinion is much better. They drive similar with nothing the stood out. I also prefer the looks of the Hyundai but that isn't the subject at hand.
I purchased a 2013 Elantra GT and couldn't be happier with my decision. I hope I still feel this was in 10 years.
Cheers
Your Elantra is really the i30 hatchback badge-engineered as a Elantra. It does not share much with the Elantra sedan. Between the sedan and the hatch, you got the better car.
I drove both and spent some extra seat time in a co-workers 2013 Civic.
I greatly prefer the Elantra over the civic. The dash layout and functionality in my opinion is much better. They drive similar with nothing the stood out. I also prefer the looks of the Hyundai but that isn't the subject at hand.
I purchased a 2013 Elantra GT and couldn't be happier with my decision. I hope I still feel this was in 10 years.
Cheers
Your Elantra is really the i30 hatchback badge-engineered as a Elantra. It does not share much with the Elantra sedan. Between the sedan and the hatch, you got the better car.
Originally Posted By: sciphi
Your Elantra is really the i30 hatchback badge-engineered as a Elantra. It does not share much with the Elantra sedan. Between the sedan and the hatch, you got the better car.
It shares quite a bit with the sedan. Same engine, drive train, interior. I know, I have both an Elantra Sedan and an Elantra GT (I30)
Your Elantra is really the i30 hatchback badge-engineered as a Elantra. It does not share much with the Elantra sedan. Between the sedan and the hatch, you got the better car.
It shares quite a bit with the sedan. Same engine, drive train, interior. I know, I have both an Elantra Sedan and an Elantra GT (I30)
I would test drive them both, pick your favorite as others have said.
I have driven the Honda Civic loaded, wasnt that impressed. Even wife said it felt like power was missing.
I have driven the Honda Civic loaded, wasnt that impressed. Even wife said it felt like power was missing.
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The Civic is using a carry over 1.8L that is efficient, but somewhat noncompetitive to it's competition in terms of power. When the previous generation Civic debuted back in 2007, having 140 horsepower and 5 forward gears was actually pretty good. Fast forward to today and now most cars have more than 140 horsepower, and 6 gears or a CVT.
To get better fuel economy, Honda has a vtec system that has two modes. A regular "power mode" that is for every day driving and actually doesn't have that much power, and a special fuel economy mode that mimics the traits of an Atkinson cycle engine for better fuel economy. However, this mode is only triggered in light cruising. Previous vtec implementations had two profiles for low and high RPM operations and were more performance oriented. Now you have a fixed SINGLE cam (intake and exhaust timing are fixed in relation to each other) and a fuel efficiency mode. This means you have neither high or low end power, but a fixed profile like an old school car.
Kia has elected to use direct injection on it's proven "Nu" 2.0L inline 4 to achieve excellent fuel economy and power at the same time. Unlike many GDI engines out there, this engine lacks EGR, which is one of the largest contributing factors to gummed up intake valves on GDI equipped vehicles. Hyundai/Kia has simply adjusted the variable valve timing to mitigate the need for this technology. You also have TWIN cams that allow independent control of the intake and exhaust valves in relation to each other. That allows for great low and high end power because of more adjustability. Also, the use of an automatic with 6 gears versus five helps out.
The Kia almost feels like a small V6 or large 4 cylinder when driven. Both engines have a 81 mm bore, but the Kia has a much larger stroke that contributes to more low end torque. The means not having to rev the crud out of an engine to get the needed passing power.
Honda and Toyota have been riding on their name for some time. Toyota releases a new for 2014 Rav-4 only to fail the most recent crash test. Honda releases the new 2012 Civic only to change it for 2013 because all the non-blind objective reviewers heavily panned it. Honda still sold 250,000+ of them. This tells me that you have a large group of people buying a name instead of shopping for the best car possible. They never looked at anything else because they wanted a Honda. Past performance is never a guarantee for future returns.
So you have two brands. One brand that is quote on quote proven and has a nice car but sells them regardless or whether the car is nice or not because of blind public perception. On the other side, you have a brand clawing for approval that is doing everything they can to impress and keep any buyer that comes along because they are a newer entity. Do you want the guy siting on his butt, or the guy working super hard to make a name?
Lastly, the Forte is listed on Ward's top 10 interiors. Motor Trend did a test on the Forte versus Mazda, Honda, Dodge, and Nissan. The Forte was the UNANIMOUS winner. Fastest acceleration, shortest stopping distance, and second best observed fuel economy AHEAD OF THE CIVIC.
I would abstain from that comments of the uninformed lemmings in the previous posts. I am an automotive journalist, and Honda and Toyota are on my s@$% list right now for passing inferior products on the American public by using their name instead of making the best product possible.
-Snake
To get better fuel economy, Honda has a vtec system that has two modes. A regular "power mode" that is for every day driving and actually doesn't have that much power, and a special fuel economy mode that mimics the traits of an Atkinson cycle engine for better fuel economy. However, this mode is only triggered in light cruising. Previous vtec implementations had two profiles for low and high RPM operations and were more performance oriented. Now you have a fixed SINGLE cam (intake and exhaust timing are fixed in relation to each other) and a fuel efficiency mode. This means you have neither high or low end power, but a fixed profile like an old school car.
Kia has elected to use direct injection on it's proven "Nu" 2.0L inline 4 to achieve excellent fuel economy and power at the same time. Unlike many GDI engines out there, this engine lacks EGR, which is one of the largest contributing factors to gummed up intake valves on GDI equipped vehicles. Hyundai/Kia has simply adjusted the variable valve timing to mitigate the need for this technology. You also have TWIN cams that allow independent control of the intake and exhaust valves in relation to each other. That allows for great low and high end power because of more adjustability. Also, the use of an automatic with 6 gears versus five helps out.
The Kia almost feels like a small V6 or large 4 cylinder when driven. Both engines have a 81 mm bore, but the Kia has a much larger stroke that contributes to more low end torque. The means not having to rev the crud out of an engine to get the needed passing power.
Honda and Toyota have been riding on their name for some time. Toyota releases a new for 2014 Rav-4 only to fail the most recent crash test. Honda releases the new 2012 Civic only to change it for 2013 because all the non-blind objective reviewers heavily panned it. Honda still sold 250,000+ of them. This tells me that you have a large group of people buying a name instead of shopping for the best car possible. They never looked at anything else because they wanted a Honda. Past performance is never a guarantee for future returns.
So you have two brands. One brand that is quote on quote proven and has a nice car but sells them regardless or whether the car is nice or not because of blind public perception. On the other side, you have a brand clawing for approval that is doing everything they can to impress and keep any buyer that comes along because they are a newer entity. Do you want the guy siting on his butt, or the guy working super hard to make a name?
Lastly, the Forte is listed on Ward's top 10 interiors. Motor Trend did a test on the Forte versus Mazda, Honda, Dodge, and Nissan. The Forte was the UNANIMOUS winner. Fastest acceleration, shortest stopping distance, and second best observed fuel economy AHEAD OF THE CIVIC.
I would abstain from that comments of the uninformed lemmings in the previous posts. I am an automotive journalist, and Honda and Toyota are on my s@$% list right now for passing inferior products on the American public by using their name instead of making the best product possible.
-Snake
One other thing, the "RESALE VALUE" crud is just that.
Lets say you have two cars. One car can be sold for $25,000 and the other can be sold for $20,000 when comparably equipped. At the end of 3 years, the first car is worth $15,000 and the second car is worth only $10,000.
Lets take a close look:
$25,000 - $15,000 = $10,000 depreciation
60% retained value
$20,000 - $10,000 = $10,000 depreciation
50% retained value
The first car had a higher retained value but the actual fiscal depreciation was the same. Also consider if you financed, the second vehicle would have a lower initial principle value and therefore accrue less INTEREST.
PEOPLE NEED TO LOOK AT OVERALL COST OF OWNERSHIP AND NOT DEPRECIATION
So the second car costs less up front and you pay less in interest. It makes sense if you stop and actually think.
Please also consider the Civic has some of the highest insurance rates because of it's rate of theft. Call your agent.
Lets say you have two cars. One car can be sold for $25,000 and the other can be sold for $20,000 when comparably equipped. At the end of 3 years, the first car is worth $15,000 and the second car is worth only $10,000.
Lets take a close look:
$25,000 - $15,000 = $10,000 depreciation
60% retained value
$20,000 - $10,000 = $10,000 depreciation
50% retained value
The first car had a higher retained value but the actual fiscal depreciation was the same. Also consider if you financed, the second vehicle would have a lower initial principle value and therefore accrue less INTEREST.
PEOPLE NEED TO LOOK AT OVERALL COST OF OWNERSHIP AND NOT DEPRECIATION
So the second car costs less up front and you pay less in interest. It makes sense if you stop and actually think.
Please also consider the Civic has some of the highest insurance rates because of it's rate of theft. Call your agent.
^^^Thanks for the KIA commercial.
Your check's in the mail...
Your check's in the mail...
Originally Posted By: SnakeOil
I would abstain from that comments of the uninformed lemmings in the previous posts. I am an automotive journalist...
You are an "automotive journalist", and everyone else is an "uninformed lemming".
Classy.
I would abstain from that comments of the uninformed lemmings in the previous posts. I am an automotive journalist...
You are an "automotive journalist", and everyone else is an "uninformed lemming".
Classy.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
^^^Thanks for the KIA commercial.
Your check's in the mail...
+1, you'll have a nice bonus this month.
^^^Thanks for the KIA commercial.
Your check's in the mail...
+1, you'll have a nice bonus this month.
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: SnakeOil
I would abstain from that comments of the uninformed lemmings in the previous posts. I am an automotive journalist...
You are an "automotive journalist", and everyone else is an "uninformed lemming".
Classy.
I guess you didn't know that SnakeOil is John Davis.
Originally Posted By: SnakeOil
I would abstain from that comments of the uninformed lemmings in the previous posts. I am an automotive journalist...
You are an "automotive journalist", and everyone else is an "uninformed lemming".
Classy.
I guess you didn't know that SnakeOil is John Davis.
Originally Posted By: glock19
I guess you didn't know that SnakeOil is John Davis.
An internet screen name is faceless. I don't know most of the people on this board personally, and frankly, the identity of the person is of little interest to me. I used the term "classy" sarcastically, to indicate a statement that I felt was without tact. And I stand by my comment that the use of the term "uninformed lemmings" was, at best, without tact.
I do wish we knew each other better here. I envision this board as a group of car guys and car gals standing around a room talking. I believe that some of what is typed on this board wouldn't be said in person. Knowledgeable or not, if someone walked into a room and announced, "disregard the opinions of all of these uninformed lemmings," that person would receive a few cross looks, to say the least.
I guess you didn't know that SnakeOil is John Davis.
An internet screen name is faceless. I don't know most of the people on this board personally, and frankly, the identity of the person is of little interest to me. I used the term "classy" sarcastically, to indicate a statement that I felt was without tact. And I stand by my comment that the use of the term "uninformed lemmings" was, at best, without tact.
I do wish we knew each other better here. I envision this board as a group of car guys and car gals standing around a room talking. I believe that some of what is typed on this board wouldn't be said in person. Knowledgeable or not, if someone walked into a room and announced, "disregard the opinions of all of these uninformed lemmings," that person would receive a few cross looks, to say the least.
We have a 2012 Civic and the wife gets 35+mpg I can get 40+mpg on same routes, get 41+mpg at 70mph with a/c and cruise. 42k now and its a great vehicle. I wouldn't buy any make that cannot meet their mpg claims. Check the stats on fuelly.com.
http://www.fuelly.com/car/kia/forte
http://www.fuelly.com/car/honda/civic
http://www.fuelly.com/car/kia/forte
http://www.fuelly.com/car/honda/civic
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: glock19
I guess you didn't know that SnakeOil is John Davis.
An internet screen name is faceless. I don't know most of the people on this board personally, and frankly, the identity of the person is of little interest to me. I used the term "classy" sarcastically, to indicate a statement that I felt was without tact. And I stand by my comment that the use of the term "uninformed lemmings" was, at best, without tact.
I do wish we knew each other better here. I envision this board as a group of car guys and car gals standing around a room talking. I believe that some of what is typed on this board wouldn't be said in person. Knowledgeable or not, if someone walked into a room and announced, "disregard the opinions of all of these uninformed lemmings," that person would receive a few cross looks, to say the least.
Just a joke, I highly doubt SnakeOil is the host of Motor Week.
Originally Posted By: glock19
I guess you didn't know that SnakeOil is John Davis.
An internet screen name is faceless. I don't know most of the people on this board personally, and frankly, the identity of the person is of little interest to me. I used the term "classy" sarcastically, to indicate a statement that I felt was without tact. And I stand by my comment that the use of the term "uninformed lemmings" was, at best, without tact.
I do wish we knew each other better here. I envision this board as a group of car guys and car gals standing around a room talking. I believe that some of what is typed on this board wouldn't be said in person. Knowledgeable or not, if someone walked into a room and announced, "disregard the opinions of all of these uninformed lemmings," that person would receive a few cross looks, to say the least.
Just a joke, I highly doubt SnakeOil is the host of Motor Week.
Originally Posted By: mikefxu
We have a 2012 Civic and the wife gets 35+mpg I can get 40+mpg on same routes, get 41+mpg at 70mph with a/c and cruise. 42k now and its a great vehicle. I wouldn't buy any make that cannot meet their mpg claims. Check the stats on fuelly.com.
http://www.fuelly.com/car/kia/forte
http://www.fuelly.com/car/honda/civic
I have a 2013 Civic and I can get 46mpg on my way to Los Angeles if I baby it. I'm getting about 34-36mpg city if I baby it as well (without [censored] people off). The 2013 model supposedly has stiffer suspension, interior noise reduction, etc... etc... I'm very happy with this vehicle - coming from a sunfire tho, so it's a pretty big upgrade for me.
We have a 2012 Civic and the wife gets 35+mpg I can get 40+mpg on same routes, get 41+mpg at 70mph with a/c and cruise. 42k now and its a great vehicle. I wouldn't buy any make that cannot meet their mpg claims. Check the stats on fuelly.com.
http://www.fuelly.com/car/kia/forte
http://www.fuelly.com/car/honda/civic
I have a 2013 Civic and I can get 46mpg on my way to Los Angeles if I baby it. I'm getting about 34-36mpg city if I baby it as well (without [censored] people off). The 2013 model supposedly has stiffer suspension, interior noise reduction, etc... etc... I'm very happy with this vehicle - coming from a sunfire tho, so it's a pretty big upgrade for me.
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