2003 sienna check engine light
- Thread starter calvinnnnnnnnn
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when the tech started removing the sensor, it got harder and harder. if they forced the sensor to come off, three things can happen: the 02 sensor snaps, the threads strip or it comes off fine(less likely)
if it strips, but comes off, you cant thread in the new sensor. if the bolt snaps, you have to drill it and i dont know happens after that.
if it strips, but comes off, you cant thread in the new sensor. if the bolt snaps, you have to drill it and i dont know happens after that.
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Sounds suspiciously like a money grab to me... I've recently replaced the original O2 sensors in both my cars with no issues. I imagine the sensor is a pain to get to so trying it yourself isn't going to be fun. On old rusty hardware I'll work it both ways until it comes free, something like 1 turn out and 3/4 in, repeat until its loose.
If you have ramps have a look under there you might be able to do the whole thing from under the car.
If you have ramps have a look under there you might be able to do the whole thing from under the car.
I don't think it's a money grab. If you don't warn the customer that there is a chance that the exhaust manifold may need to be replaced who looks like the bad guy? It's not the tech's fault it's siezed and there is little he can do to keep it from getting damaged. He did the right thing by warning the customer.
my friend that works at toyota was the tech who inspected it.
Right before they put it on the lift, another tech tells me it is more likely for a sensor to seize if your car has low miles for its age.....and he was right
35k on a 2003 sienna.
Right before they put it on the lift, another tech tells me it is more likely for a sensor to seize if your car has low miles for its age.....and he was right
35k on a 2003 sienna.
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Originally Posted By: calvinnnnnnnnn
when the tech started removing the sensor, it got harder and harder. if they forced the sensor to come off, three things can happen: the 02 sensor snaps, the threads strip or it comes off fine(less likely)
if it strips, but comes off, you cant thread in the new sensor. if the bolt snaps, you have to drill it and i dont know happens after that.
sorry, i clicked the wrong quote button. i was questioning his "an air/fuel sensor is not an oxygen sensor"
oxygen sensors ARE air/fuel sensors.. thats all they do. now he could have been talking about the differences in a normal o2 sensor and a wideband o2 sensor, but these days (esp considering the cost of your OEM sensor) it seems a lot of automakers are using wideband o2 sensors in OEM applications.
in any case, i'm not sure where the part is located but i think thats pretty ridiculous. the o2 sensors should have antiseize on the threads. are they not using any type of penetrating oil?
edit: checking rock auto, the pre-cat o2 sensor is in fact a wideband model.
when the tech started removing the sensor, it got harder and harder. if they forced the sensor to come off, three things can happen: the 02 sensor snaps, the threads strip or it comes off fine(less likely)
if it strips, but comes off, you cant thread in the new sensor. if the bolt snaps, you have to drill it and i dont know happens after that.
sorry, i clicked the wrong quote button. i was questioning his "an air/fuel sensor is not an oxygen sensor"
oxygen sensors ARE air/fuel sensors.. thats all they do. now he could have been talking about the differences in a normal o2 sensor and a wideband o2 sensor, but these days (esp considering the cost of your OEM sensor) it seems a lot of automakers are using wideband o2 sensors in OEM applications.
in any case, i'm not sure where the part is located but i think thats pretty ridiculous. the o2 sensors should have antiseize on the threads. are they not using any type of penetrating oil?
edit: checking rock auto, the pre-cat o2 sensor is in fact a wideband model.
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An 03 Sienna with 35K miles may be still be covered under the 8/80 emissions warranty.
If so, have you friend the Toyota tech get paid a bit to do the work, with genuine Toyota parts.
If so, have you friend the Toyota tech get paid a bit to do the work, with genuine Toyota parts.
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
I don't think it's a money grab. If you don't warn the customer that there is a chance that the exhaust manifold may need to be replaced who looks like the bad guy? It's not the tech's fault it's siezed and there is little he can do to keep it from getting damaged. He did the right thing by warning the customer.
Would the manifold have to be replaced though? I'd think its an expensive part? $300+? I'd assume that it would be reparable for far less than that too?
A bead of weld and a quick run with a tap? Not as easy as that?
I don't think it's a money grab. If you don't warn the customer that there is a chance that the exhaust manifold may need to be replaced who looks like the bad guy? It's not the tech's fault it's siezed and there is little he can do to keep it from getting damaged. He did the right thing by warning the customer.
Would the manifold have to be replaced though? I'd think its an expensive part? $300+? I'd assume that it would be reparable for far less than that too?
A bead of weld and a quick run with a tap? Not as easy as that?
The manifold may have a pre-cat in it, making it pricey. Again, it's worth checking if the 8/80 emissions warranty is still in effect.
Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that. A weld is probably going to be too hard to tap and by welding on it while it is in the car you run the risk of frying a computer or sensor. Plus you physically might not be able to get to it with a welder. The labor could quickly add up to almost the cost of a new manifold.
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that. A weld is probably going to be too hard to tap and by welding on it while it is in the car you run the risk of frying a computer or sensor. Plus you physically might not be able to get to it with a welder. The labor could quickly add up to almost the cost of a new manifold.
like i said.. the manifolds cost $170 or $180 depending on which side of the motor you're buying. labor is going to cost much more than the manifolds no matter what.
Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that. A weld is probably going to be too hard to tap and by welding on it while it is in the car you run the risk of frying a computer or sensor. Plus you physically might not be able to get to it with a welder. The labor could quickly add up to almost the cost of a new manifold.
like i said.. the manifolds cost $170 or $180 depending on which side of the motor you're buying. labor is going to cost much more than the manifolds no matter what.
I would agree.
crossing fingers- calling toyota to see if emissions warranty is still active!
they said air/fuel not covered but on my manual it says sensors are covered. since they said my sensor was seized to my exhaust manifold, would that be covered by warranty since exhaust manifold is mentioned in the warranty?
take a look at my warranty:
take a look at my warranty:
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It says the cat is covered for 8/80 but what about everything else?
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
It says the cat is covered for 8/80 but what about everything else?
Under other parts used in above systems, it lists sensors, switches, etc. Arguably I guess you can say oxygen sensors fall under this category.
It says the cat is covered for 8/80 but what about everything else?
Under other parts used in above systems, it lists sensors, switches, etc. Arguably I guess you can say oxygen sensors fall under this category.
The O2 sensor is part of the air fuel mixture feedback system that is listed as covered if I read the document correctly.
I was looking for your post......must not have looked hard enough......wanted to get back to you on which sensor came up for my '03.
I damaged the front oxygen sensor on my '03 sienna.......while changing the thermostat......wires are zip tied to the radiator hose and got pulled.....looked good, but CEL with code for heater circuit.
I entered my VIN on the toyotapartszone site.....and came up with the more expensive sensor that you listed.....
I bought it from Rockauto for $136.
I replaced mine last night.......did not look like much, if anything on the threads.
New sensor came with a small packet of antiseize.
Old sensor took some gentle "convincing" but came off.
Soaking the threads with something like "P Blaster" is an idea....but I am sure that the TOYOTA tech. already thought of that.
The 8/80 warranty is 8 years from when the vehicle ENTERED SERVICE, not when it was built......again, your friend at the TOYOTA dealership will be able to tell you if it is covered.
List price on the Sensor is $213.
If the Toyota is going to be a part of your life for a while.....I would recommend you bookmark the toyotapartszone site in your favorites......not always the cheapest, but they have the BEST parts breakdown that I have found.......WITH the Toyota part numbers.
I gave them my business because they were close to cheapest....gave me the best information.....and gave me confidence in getting the correct part.
I damaged the front oxygen sensor on my '03 sienna.......while changing the thermostat......wires are zip tied to the radiator hose and got pulled.....looked good, but CEL with code for heater circuit.
I entered my VIN on the toyotapartszone site.....and came up with the more expensive sensor that you listed.....
I bought it from Rockauto for $136.
I replaced mine last night.......did not look like much, if anything on the threads.
New sensor came with a small packet of antiseize.
Old sensor took some gentle "convincing" but came off.
Soaking the threads with something like "P Blaster" is an idea....but I am sure that the TOYOTA tech. already thought of that.
The 8/80 warranty is 8 years from when the vehicle ENTERED SERVICE, not when it was built......again, your friend at the TOYOTA dealership will be able to tell you if it is covered.
List price on the Sensor is $213.
If the Toyota is going to be a part of your life for a while.....I would recommend you bookmark the toyotapartszone site in your favorites......not always the cheapest, but they have the BEST parts breakdown that I have found.......WITH the Toyota part numbers.
I gave them my business because they were close to cheapest....gave me the best information.....and gave me confidence in getting the correct part.
The discussion on Air/Fuel sensor and oxygen sensor is a bit of confusion caused by multiple terms for the same part.
The Air/Fuel sensor IS an oxygen sensor......but it is a "wide range" oxygen sensor.
My '96 windstar seems to use the exact same sensor for all 4 locations......2 upstream and 2 downstream.....
The only difference is the length of the leads.
The 2003 Sienna being discussed here uses the same sensor in the 2 upstream postions......the difference between the 2 is about 2 inches in lead length.
The downstream sensor IS a completely different sensor.
The confusion came up where 1 toyota website (Toyotaparts123) was leading us to 1 upstream sensor, as verified in the pictorial diagram and the parts list......but another toyota website (toyotapartszone) was giving us another, more expensive oxygen sensor for the same application.
In my case, because the toyotapartszone website was using the VIN to drill down to the parts.....I went with it.
Rockauto had the best price.......but they listed both sensors in question on the toyota websites.......as well as a number of other oxygen sensors.
Particularly when one is replacing only 1 of the upstream sensors.......it is important that it be of the same operating charactoristics as the other bank's sensor.
Given the location of the bank 1 sensor.....getting to it with a torch to weld in a new bung in the manifold would most likely require removal of the rear exhaust manifold.......I am guessing that the cost of the manifold is small as compared to the labor cost involved in removal and installation......add in the labor welding in a new bung.......you might as well put in a new manifold that you KNOW is going to hold.
I am giving the TOYOTA technician, who is a friend of the poster, credit for knowing what they are doing.
It is sad that the job grew beyond a simple look up the part.....order and replace.
The Air/Fuel sensor IS an oxygen sensor......but it is a "wide range" oxygen sensor.
My '96 windstar seems to use the exact same sensor for all 4 locations......2 upstream and 2 downstream.....
The only difference is the length of the leads.
The 2003 Sienna being discussed here uses the same sensor in the 2 upstream postions......the difference between the 2 is about 2 inches in lead length.
The downstream sensor IS a completely different sensor.
The confusion came up where 1 toyota website (Toyotaparts123) was leading us to 1 upstream sensor, as verified in the pictorial diagram and the parts list......but another toyota website (toyotapartszone) was giving us another, more expensive oxygen sensor for the same application.
In my case, because the toyotapartszone website was using the VIN to drill down to the parts.....I went with it.
Rockauto had the best price.......but they listed both sensors in question on the toyota websites.......as well as a number of other oxygen sensors.
Particularly when one is replacing only 1 of the upstream sensors.......it is important that it be of the same operating charactoristics as the other bank's sensor.
Given the location of the bank 1 sensor.....getting to it with a torch to weld in a new bung in the manifold would most likely require removal of the rear exhaust manifold.......I am guessing that the cost of the manifold is small as compared to the labor cost involved in removal and installation......add in the labor welding in a new bung.......you might as well put in a new manifold that you KNOW is going to hold.
I am giving the TOYOTA technician, who is a friend of the poster, credit for knowing what they are doing.
It is sad that the job grew beyond a simple look up the part.....order and replace.
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