For the last 6 oil changes on my Tacoma, I have been changing the oil (PP 5w20) at 6000 miles and the filter ("quart size" M1)every other oil change (12000 miles). I have cut & inspected all the filters and see no evidence of degradation or contaminates in the media. My question is: How about going to 18000 mile filter replacements? The motivation would be cost savings and having two easy oil changes in a cycle, as I do the work outdoors, often in cold weather.
18000 mile oil filter changes
- Thread starter richter1
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Try it and cut the filter open! M1 claims their filters are good for 15,000 miles.
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How fast do you accumulate 18k? It's a matter (mostly) of how many warm up cycles per mile.
I think that cold starts, short trips, stop and go ... degrades the oil but not the filter, am I wrong ?
JHZR2
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saab ecotec filters are good for 18k.
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Does the oil filter media get degraded with each warm up cycle?
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I think that cold starts, short trips, stop and go ... degrades the oil but not the filter, am I wrong ?
The media may be fine in terms of material integrity (though not always) ..but most of your filter loading occurs during the fuel enrichment event. That's where most of your combustion byproducts are produced. That's why you can get away with changing the filter every other time when mileage is used instead of time. Time is used where there there is either a mismatch of fuel to mileage (let's say taxi/commercial service) ..or where a major percentage of the mileage occurs in fuel enrichment.
More unpurged moisture ..more fuel ..more byproducts ..less filter life.
Does the oil filter media get degraded with each warm up cycle?
Quote:
I think that cold starts, short trips, stop and go ... degrades the oil but not the filter, am I wrong ?
The media may be fine in terms of material integrity (though not always) ..but most of your filter loading occurs during the fuel enrichment event. That's where most of your combustion byproducts are produced. That's why you can get away with changing the filter every other time when mileage is used instead of time. Time is used where there there is either a mismatch of fuel to mileage (let's say taxi/commercial service) ..or where a major percentage of the mileage occurs in fuel enrichment.
More unpurged moisture ..more fuel ..more byproducts ..less filter life.
If we apply the theory that as more stuff gets trapped in the filter the efficiency of the filter increases then it would be advantageous for your engine to continue running the filter for a longer interval. If it were me, I'd choose a slightly oversized M1 and take it to 18,000 without worry.
Please take some pictures of the current interval vs. the 18K for comparison.
Please take some pictures of the current interval vs. the 18K for comparison.
What if the filter elements pores are clogged with stuff too small to see.
It is my opinion that all new vehicle should come with a differential pressure gauge so you can tell if/when your filter needs changed.
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it wouldn't be too hard to integrate that into a PCM to merely count the incidence of elevated differential ..sensibly accounting for warm up as the filter ages.
Since some engineer decided, for no good apparent reason that I can figure, to give me a dimming dome light and a high beam indicator flashing if I leave my headlights on (in addition to the audio chime) ...on my otherwise already overcomplicated jeep ...anything is possible ..but I just don't see it getting a blip on the radar screen in the hierarchy of needs.
Since some engineer decided, for no good apparent reason that I can figure, to give me a dimming dome light and a high beam indicator flashing if I leave my headlights on (in addition to the audio chime) ...on my otherwise already overcomplicated jeep ...anything is possible ..but I just don't see it getting a blip on the radar screen in the hierarchy of needs.
I have gone over 12,000 on K&N filters and over 15 months between changes as well. IMO we are placing way too much emphasis what effect oil filter changes have on UOA and long term longevity. It is extremely rare that any good filter will become clogged with wear material in 18,000 miles, I don't even think it would in 30,000 miles. Will the drain back valve continue to work and bypass with multiple starts etc. I say yes and even if they fail IMO there is no noticeable change in the long term longevity of the engine. Do your own testing and I think you will agree, oil filters ( unlike air which are the most important filter out there) are pretty much useless!!!
I posted a question a while back about removing a filter to check weight to see if it was heavy from the first 1250 miles of an A-Rx wash cycle, and wanted to reuse the filter because it was fine. I was told not to reuse it for fear of leaks.
You guys who are running filters for 2 or more OC's, do you drain the filter and reinstall it? Or just leave it on with the dirty oil in it, drain the oil in the pan and refill?
I guess still being somewhat Old School I can't imagine leaving close to a qt of oil with 5,000-10,000 miles in the engine, and adding a fresh fill to it.
Thanks,
Frank D
You guys who are running filters for 2 or more OC's, do you drain the filter and reinstall it? Or just leave it on with the dirty oil in it, drain the oil in the pan and refill?
I guess still being somewhat Old School I can't imagine leaving close to a qt of oil with 5,000-10,000 miles in the engine, and adding a fresh fill to it.
Thanks,
Frank D
I just did almost exactly 18,000 miles on a Napa Gold 1356 (1995 Maxima with 183,000 miles) over the course of one year (10/07-10/08)with 3,000 mile oil changes--I cut open the filter and it looks fine, a little bit of pleat "waviness" in spots but the medium is fully intact and no visible loading evident. (I don't drain the filter when I change the oil) Nissan recommends 15,000 mile/12 month oil filter changes (every other time the oil is changed at 7,500 miles/6 months)
I remember the manual for my '68 Impala indicated oil filter changes at every other oil change. I believe my '73 Corolla had the same oil filter interval.
I had a tall M1 filter clog on a '93 Olds Ciera clog on a 12k oil change interval, but I was running a K&N air filter at the time.
I've been told that it is good to run the EaoM for more than one OCI, but also that it has a much higher capacity than other filters.
I had a tall M1 filter clog on a '93 Olds Ciera clog on a 12k oil change interval, but I was running a K&N air filter at the time.
I've been told that it is good to run the EaoM for more than one OCI, but also that it has a much higher capacity than other filters.
I change the oil and filter in my Accord every 6 months which is about 3500 miles for me. Wonder if I could just change the filter every other change,which would be 1 yr and 7k on the filter and 3500 on each oil change? Would a hypothetical uoa even indicate much difference? What do you guys think?
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You guys who are running filters for 2 or more OC's, do you drain the filter and reinstall it? Or just leave it on with the dirty oil in it, drain the oil in the pan and refill?
Well, not necessarily ..or always ..but yes, I use top tier filters always to the point of making the cost worth it. A 9k old filter from a fellow member was showing some minor signs of loading. I don't know the particulars of the filter's use ..but it was an "extended drain" for the user with M1. I would estimate that it would have done 15k easy without loading being to the point of concern. I tested it with heavy oil in cold temps. In a "climate averaging" view ..with some sensible oil for the season, it would have appeared less effected.
You've just got to get a grip on how much loading you're doing with your event length. Not all miles are created equal.
You guys who are running filters for 2 or more OC's, do you drain the filter and reinstall it? Or just leave it on with the dirty oil in it, drain the oil in the pan and refill?
Well, not necessarily ..or always ..but yes, I use top tier filters always to the point of making the cost worth it. A 9k old filter from a fellow member was showing some minor signs of loading. I don't know the particulars of the filter's use ..but it was an "extended drain" for the user with M1. I would estimate that it would have done 15k easy without loading being to the point of concern. I tested it with heavy oil in cold temps. In a "climate averaging" view ..with some sensible oil for the season, it would have appeared less effected.
You've just got to get a grip on how much loading you're doing with your event length. Not all miles are created equal.
richter1,
Could you post some pictures ?
I did a visual evaluation comparing filters on three different app's. It's posted here:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1160905
I would like to see yours for comparison.
Could you post some pictures ?
I did a visual evaluation comparing filters on three different app's. It's posted here:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1160905
I would like to see yours for comparison.
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