03 Santa Fe 2.4 - Bad Misfires / Won't Run/Move

[SwampSurvivor]

So I got a text that the 2003 Santa fe 2.4 wasn't running well at all. Was told that it was sputtering bad and wouldn't go above 20mph.

I got home and took a look at it. Definite misfire, seemed to idle okay.

What I observed intially:
-When taking off from a stoplight with light throttle, it wouldn't misfire
- When taking off from a stoplight full throttle or mid throttle, it would really misfire (maybe run on 2 cyls) until about 3500, then it would take off like a rocket and run great.

Cruising around, it was having a hard time running and general misfiring.

I let it sit for about 20 minutes, then took it for another drive. This time it was really bad. Started to misfire at idle and taking of was fun. It was maybe going on 1 cylinder.

One of the driveways to my apartment complex has a hill, so I tried to go up. Foot to the floor in 1st gear, it was really misfiring bad.

I was getting a lot of coughing, backfiring and pretty bad pinging. Not wanting to blow a hole in the piston I let it stall, rolled down the hill backwards, pushed it for a few blocks and drove in the other way.

When trying to start, I'll hear some knocking (sounds more like a spark knock than anything mechanical) and itll run for a second, then the tac will drop to 0 even though it's running on one or two cylinders.

To keep it running, I'd have ot press my foot to the floor where it would spark knock, back fire and cough pretty bad until an eventual death.

Right now it doesn't have enough power to move itself in gear ... the small hill I had to hold my foot to the floor for 2 minutes in 1st gear to move 30 feet.

Any ideas?

I was thinking of ...

Slipped timing belt (but wouldn't that cause it to crank funny since the valves are opening and closing at the wrong tim?)
Crankshaft Position sensor (I'm a Jeep guy, when a Jeep does this, 99% of the time it's a crank sensor)
Bad fuel pump?

 

[LeakySeals]

Yeah, sounds good. Add coils and EGR valve to the list. Start with the inexpensive fixes, see it the EGR is obstructed, working properly. Clean it and the opening. Check the coils, swap them around, check for spark. Then move on to the crank, belt.

 

[THORROMIG]

Compression Test ASAP!!!!

 

[John_K]

Wife's Sonata started some of that, it was the EGR.

John

 

[yonyon]

Overdue for tune up -> misfiring, ignored -> dead cat.

Just a guess.

Any DTCs other than P03xx misfire codes? There are a great many things that could go wrong and make it run badly.

 

[AVB]

Sounds like bad fuel, ignition timing, running lean, plug wires, or a bad ground.

 

[JTK]

Yes, be careful not to use the vehicle until you can get this addressed. Driving with a misfire will destroy the catalytic converters in short order.

I know I lost an ignition coil on my 2.7L V6 powered 2008 Santa Fe that resulted in a serious power loss and misfire. Of course it had to be on the rear bank, the intake manifold had to be removed to replace it and the "overnight" ordering of the coil took 3 days. Good times.

Joel

 

[SwampSurvivor]

I know for a fact this car has received zero maintaince since 2008.

Its not mine and I have no place to work on cars. If it were mine id be calling the wrecker and having it brought to the junkyard. Between the transmission problems, the rotten brake lines, bald tires, seizing ac compressor and bad blowers motor ... its in Bsd shape

 

[LeakySeals]

Other than the AC/blower issues, sounds like neglect has taken its toll. That includes not washing the car/undercarriage in salt/snow regions. I love buying cars cheap from neglectors and fixing them with basic maintenance. Here's what I'd do...

The AC/blower issues could be as simple as a blocked cabin air filter. Tranny fluid, coolant need to go. Drain and fills are good enough. Likely way over on the oil and filter, change it. synthetic is a good choice for neglectors. Vlean the throttle body. Change the plugs. Intake air and cabin air filter need changing. 2 bottles of techron complete fuel system cleaner for 2 tanks.

Then move on to EGR, crank, belts, etc. Dont bother replacing parts till the basic maintenance is cleared up.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

The transmission is shot. A drain/fill didn't help at all. It's the same transmission that Chrysler used on the minivans that couldn't make it 100k without failure.

Aside from the failing transmission, the other things aren't terrible. I was able to "fix" the seized AC compressor by pulling the relay.

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: Miller88
The transmission is shot. A drain/fill didn't help at all. It's the same transmission that Chrysler used on the minivans that couldn't make it 100k without failure.


The F4A51 4spd auto was never used in any Chrysler MV that I'm aware of. It's actually one of the better Mitsubishi/Hyundai transmissions.

Joel

 

[LeakySeals]

So much for my optimism for a quick fix, thats too bad. Maybe the drain was too little, too late or just plain bad design. Fix the stumbling problem, wash, wax, detail the engine and wheels, and trade it in.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

The color of the fluid that came out was darker than ANY motor oil I've ever changed. There's no doubt in my mind that the trans fluid is original.

This is just pushing me to over-maintain my vehicles more!

The Cherokee, which is around the same mileage, will be getting yet another transmission drain / fill (at least the 4th in 30k miles), a good cost of gear oil on everything underneath and I'm going to have a Crank sensor installed. It's nice "wasting" money on my vehicles fixing stuff that isn't broken, so it won't break.

 

[LeakySeals]

Changing the oil, transmission fluid, coolant, PS fluid, gear oil, filters, fuel system cleanings are standard preventative maintenance on any vehicle. Do those on time, you will see relatively few problems.

To your point of fixing what isnt broken: I agree. Many people I know change their thermostats, waterpumps, and radiator caps to stave off potential overheating. I'm in the camp that says changing your coolant more often will extend the life of those parts indefinitely. At 216k my Camry has all original cooling parts, but I change the coolant every 30k. Sure, thats premature, but is far cheaper than replacing parts.

 

[Propflux01]

Sounds to me like coil pac or crank sensor. I take it the CEL is illuminated?

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Spark plugs and Coolant are bi-yearly thing, usually in the fall.

My Cherokee ran a bit hot for a while when I first got it. I obviously didn't put the first 93k miles on it. Last summer (my first summer with it), it started to overheat. I replaced the entire cooling system (I think the water pump was bad). I can now sit in a traffic jam in 97 degree heat with the A/C full blast and not have to worry about overheating or blowing out a line.

When my 2011 Focus with "lifetime" plugs hits 2 years old, it's getting new spark plugs. The coolant is also going to get changed even though it has the extended life coolant. I'm going to pull apart my drum brakes before winter on it and spray them with silicone spray, replace the front brake pads (they're no where near worn but when I go to put in new pads in old calipers they always hang) ... Plus it's worth the piece of mind to me.

It's fustrating when a car with only 130k is junk because people don't maintain them.

The Hyundai has a pretty beefy transmission cooler on it, I'm sure with regular fluid changes the transmission would be in okay shape. If the transmission wasn't bad, the rest of it I could get fixed (if it was mine) on my own or have someone do it for dirt cheap.

I could have the brake lines replaced for $100, the blower motor I could do on a sunday in my parking lot (the hood wouldn't be open ...), timing belt and other more serious maintenance stuff I have a trusted mechanic with a good rate for.

I think this car fell victim to two though processes: The first "It's over 100k and is bad so we're going to forget about it until its dead" and "It's just a spare car so we don't need to keep it up to date"

 

[Bladecutter]

Honestly, if you know the Sante Fe hasn't been maintained in 6 years, just start with the plugs, coils, wires, and check the air filter to see if it didn't get sucked into the intake.

Once all of those check out, or get replaced, then see if it still runs badly.

BC.

 

[Propflux01]

Originally Posted By: Miller88
The Hyundai has a pretty beefy transmission cooler on it, I'm sure with regular fluid changes the transmission would be in okay shape. If the transmission wasn't bad, the rest of it I could get fixed (if it was mine) on my own or have someone do it for dirt cheap.

timing belt and other more serious maintenance stuff I have a trusted mechanic with a good rate for.


The fluid it uses, SPlll, actually turns dark pretty quick anyhow, it it common with this fluid. you didn't mention if the CEL was on (I'm thinking it is), you should be able to pull codes on it. As for the timing belt, it is actually relatively easy to do. Just get teh belt from Hyundai, and replace the idler pullys and tensioner as well. Takes about 3 hours for someone that has never done one and has average mechanical skills.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: Miller88

The Hyundai has a pretty beefy transmission cooler on it, I'm sure with regular fluid changes the transmission would be in okay shape.



Ah, if only a trans cooler were all we needed to guarantee transmission life and performance.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: Miller88

The Hyundai has a pretty beefy transmission cooler on it, I'm sure with regular fluid changes the transmission would be in okay shape.



Ah, if only a trans cooler were all we needed to guarantee transmission life and performance.



It got my Taurus transmission to 75k with no problems. It did not, however, keep the car from rusting in two, quite literally, at 75k miles. Gotta love Ford and their ability to rust like no other.

Originally Posted By: Bladecutter
Honestly, if you know the Sante Fe hasn't been maintained in 6 years, just start with the plugs, coils, wires, and check the air filter to see if it didn't get sucked into the intake.

Once all of those check out, or get replaced, then see if it still runs badly.

BC.


The air filter is the *only* think I'm willing to bet that has been done in the last few years. Took a look at the plugs, definitely the original. Original plugs in an aluminum head scare me.


Originally Posted By: Tim H.
Originally Posted By: Miller88
The Hyundai has a pretty beefy transmission cooler on it, I'm sure with regular fluid changes the transmission would be in okay shape. If the transmission wasn't bad, the rest of it I could get fixed (if it was mine) on my own or have someone do it for dirt cheap.

timing belt and other more serious maintenance stuff I have a trusted mechanic with a good rate for.


The fluid it uses, SPlll, actually turns dark pretty quick anyhow, it it common with this fluid. you didn't mention if the CEL was on (I'm thinking it is), you should be able to pull codes on it. As for the timing belt, it is actually relatively easy to do. Just get teh belt from Hyundai, and replace the idler pullys and tensioner as well. Takes about 3 hours for someone that has never done one and has average mechanical skills.


CEL is blinking. I don't own a code scanner and it can't power itself to get anywhere.

I am starting to lean towards slipped timing belt. I unplugged the fuel pump relay and started cranking and it had some not-so-nice noises coming from the hood.

I'm thinking if we can't get it towed out of the parking lot by a company, I may be renting a tow dolly and pulling it behind the Cherokee. The apartment complex we're in says no working on vehicles period ... I've been pushing it by doing a bit of small things on the cherokee (changing electric fan, starter, drive shaft, etc).