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#491506 - 07/31/03 05:50 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
Spector Offline


Registered: 06/10/02
Posts: 3416
Loc: Chattanooga, TN
I had used the Amsoil foam on three engines years ago. UOA on all and when the Amsoil filters either stretched out or fell apart from heat I went back to the OEM paper. The UOA for silicon content decreased! OEM air filters are king IMO!

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#491507 - 07/31/03 07:31 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
MRC01 Offline


Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 606
Loc: 98245
quote:
Originally posted by mph:
My silicon ppm improved substantially since ditching the K&N and installing a paper filter. I don't know for sure what's "good enough" and what isn't, but I'm not going back to the K&N.

Ah I should clarify. The application is a custom built race car that sees frequent autox and periodic street use. Max HP rules, all I want to do is keep big particles out of the engine. The car comes from the factory with a custom intake and K&N air filter. The K&N seems perfect for this application.

I use OEM air filters in my other cars.

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#491508 - 07/31/03 11:32 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
red2rebel Offline


Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 117
Loc: USA
A friend just received emails from both K&N and Amsoil regarding the airflow specs of their filters for a 2001 5.9L Dakota QC. Here's what they sent:

K&N = 478 cfm @ 1.5" of water pressure
Amsoil = 200 cfm @ 0.25" water pressure (approx 320 cfm @ 1.5" water pressure)

Based on the manufacturers flow data, it appears that at the same pressure the K&N flows much more air than the Amsoil foam filter. Is there anything I'm missing in that comparison?

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#491509 - 08/01/03 05:23 AM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
digitaldrifter91 Offline


Registered: 09/14/02
Posts: 1902
Loc: cali
filtration =).

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#491510 - 08/01/03 08:25 AM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
Pablo Offline


Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 47175
Loc: Duvall WA - Pacific NW USA
dd91 - [Smile] good one!

r2r - I'm willing to concede some shapes of K&N flow better than some Amsoil filters, but for the most part they are fairly close - heck look at the debatable air filter test that Bob posted - I don't understand how you arrived at:

200 cfm @ 0.25" water pressure = (approx 320 cfm @ 1.5" water pressure)? are both these figures from from Amsoil or is the part in parenthesis calculated?

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#491511 - 08/05/03 05:15 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
red2rebel Offline


Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 117
Loc: USA
Here is a weird one ...

A neighbor is interested in using the Amsoil foam element on his K&N filter. He's not too thrilled about the dirt that the K&N may not trap, so can the Amsoil foam element be bought and made to fit a K&N FIPK filter? He was thinking of surrounding the cone filter with the foam.

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#491512 - 08/05/03 06:07 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
jsharp Offline


Registered: 12/25/02
Posts: 3593
Loc: Outside smalltown, IL
quote:
Originally posted by red2rebel:
Here is a weird one ...

A neighbor is interested in using the Amsoil foam element on his K&N filter. He's not too thrilled about the dirt that the K&N may not trap, so can the Amsoil foam element be bought and made to fit a K&N FIPK filter? He was thinking of surrounding the cone filter with the foam.

K&N makes assorted types of foam pre-filters for use with their filters. Why not get one of them?

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#491513 - 08/05/03 11:14 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
guido_bossaert Offline


Registered: 08/04/03
Posts: 17
Loc: Tomahawk, Wisconsin
I have a k&n filter on my vehicle. I also purchased the k&n dry wrap which is wrapped around the original filter on the FIPK kits.
Was this wrap considered or used during these flow tests.
What error percentage exists and what boundry conditions were established prior to this extensive test.

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#491514 - 08/06/03 10:21 AM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
ALS Offline


Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 1862
Loc: Pittsburgh
From what I had read months ago I installed a OEM paper filter in the airbox of my new motor. 98% of the time my 2.3 liter (140ci) engine is running under 2500 rpms. So why would I need the increased airflow and decreased filtration that comes with the K&N that I had in my old engines airbox. Until I found this site I thought that the K&N type filters flowed far more than the OEM paper filters. This test just varified what has been stated by those smarter than me on this board. I will say that when I removed the K&N (about 4,500 miles since cleaning) the area that was down stream from the filter including the airbox lid, and plastic piping that goes to the AMM was practically spotless.

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#491515 - 08/06/03 04:51 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
red2rebel Offline


Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 117
Loc: USA
Does anyone know the OEM air flow for the filter on a 2001 5.9L Dakota QC, and the comparison to the Amsoil filter replacement for the same truck?

OEM = (flow)
Amsoil Air Filter # TS29 = (flow)

Thanks!

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#491516 - 08/06/03 08:05 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3334
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
FYI,

Amsoil has revamped their filter line, They are using a different metal support than the square holed ones pictured.

Also I'm not sure if they have changed the structure of the foam or not, I've got to do some follow up with this.

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#491517 - 08/13/03 04:47 AM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
JohnB Offline


Registered: 08/12/03
Posts: 2
Loc: Silver Spring, MD
I've run a similar test with an amsoil plate filter and stock volvo plate paper filter on a 1987 volvo 760 turbo using a Filterminder to measure pressure drop across the filter (ok, relative to ambient outside the box). The filterminder has a sprag loaded indicator that indicates maximum pressure drop achieved. Full scale is 10" Hg.

No air filter = no pressure drop recorded pushing over 15psi of air into a 2.4liter engine at 5500 rpm. Slightly modified volvo, really sucks through the box.

New volvo paper air filter indicated roughly 5" Hg drop at full throttle/5500 rpm. No difference in boost pressure although it might have spooled up a little slower. Remember turbos are boost controlled, the turbo just sucks harder and heats up the air more.

New amsoil foam filter showed zero pressure drop on the filter minder at same test conditions. Guess which filter I'm using? At 30K miles the filterminder barely moved off the stopp, maybe 1" Hg. I didn't bother to clean it.

I think the secondary filter used in the air filter test is interesting. It demonstrated that any filter lets some (a LOT of coloring stuff) particles through on the first pass, even the original paper filter didn't stop stuff that the second paper did. Also, it's interesting that the environment where the test was done had to be pretty dirty...here in Washington DC/MD/VA I can run a paper filter for 5000 miles and it's essentially as clean as the day I put it in.

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#491518 - 08/13/03 04:55 AM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
JohnB Offline


Registered: 08/12/03
Posts: 2
Loc: Silver Spring, MD
I think amsoil HAS changed their filter/foam stuff...I've had three 'lifetime' air filters replaced in the last several years, they were over 5 years old.

Seems the old foam tended to break down under high heat....the one on the Saab almost crumbled when I took it off my K&N filter (I used the amsoil as a sock to avoid having to clean the K&N) after three years. I punted and eliminated the K&N and put back the stock saab filter box. Miserable box alone sucks 5" of Hg even without the filter, BTW.

But the good news is that amsoil KNOWS the older foam breaks down and simply sent me replacements. The new ones have lasted much better.

Fair disclosure: I'm a lifetime amsoil dealer.

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#491519 - 08/15/03 07:39 AM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
AnthonyS Offline


Registered: 07/11/03
Posts: 34
Loc: Silverdale, WA
Actually, the environment where this test was run is very very clean! I don't live in a dirty dusty region like parts of New Mexico, Texas, Arizona or any other myriad of southwestern and midwestern states. The soil here is usually too damp to become airborne easily, and the vegetation grows so thick that it holds all the soil down too. I live about 50 miles from rainforest as the crow flies. Water has a strong tendency to hold dirt down and prevent it from going airbornes. All of the filtration tests were completed during the rainy season and not the relatively dusty summer.

Air filters pass lots of dirt, end of story. What most fail to understand is that any two filters in series will trap a whole lot more dirt than a single filter.

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#491520 - 08/15/03 10:16 PM Re: Air Flow Tests on Napa Gold, Amsoil,Jackson Racing,K&N, and Baldwin
ALS Offline


Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 1862
Loc: Pittsburgh
Anthony I was thinking the same thing. I was looking the other day under the hood and trying to figure how to build a inline low restriction air box or a airbox disk with a filter between my intercooler and throttle body. Anything can be built but at what cost. I want to keep it under $50. That is what I like about Home Depot they have all kinds of neat stuff that has multiple uses.

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