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#2174131 - 02/17/11 06:25 PM Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
75% highway at 70 to 80 MPH, 25% urban.

_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2174150 - 02/17/11 06:39 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
saaber1 Offline


Registered: 11/28/07
Posts: 1877
Loc: Pacnw
Interesting to see a 10k run on this oil. I'm used to seeing DI petrol engines or race engines etc. with lower OCIs. TBN higher than I would have thought. Viscosity loss 3%. What were the earlier oils you used? Interesting that moly is 26 when virgin is around 0 and it can't really be residual form previous fill. Likewise magnesium but that could be explained from residual oil from previous fill.
_________________________
"when 5W30 is cold, ...the oil is 35 weight (5+30),...20 w 50 starts at 70 and warms up to 50"
- Kyle, auto mechanic & VP Speedline Motorsports, INTL

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#2174158 - 02/17/11 06:49 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
Saber, I'll ask the owner what the previous oils were.

CJ-4 does allow small amounts of moly. (Amsoil DEO has some)
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2174242 - 02/17/11 08:29 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
saaber1 Offline


Registered: 11/28/07
Posts: 1877
Loc: Pacnw
Originally Posted By: BobFout
CJ-4 does allow small amounts of moly. (Amsoil DEO has some)

There are a couple VOAs of the post 2008 formula on BITOG and none show moly over 3ppm. I wonder if the formula has changed? Here is one of the VOA threads: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1264593 Interestingly, Dave at Redline was unaware that they dropped moly from the formula even after it was being sold. So that VOA was a bit of an education for him too I guess. Maybe that's why we need BITOG ha ha.
_________________________
"when 5W30 is cold, ...the oil is 35 weight (5+30),...20 w 50 starts at 70 and warms up to 50"
- Kyle, auto mechanic & VP Speedline Motorsports, INTL

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#2174271 - 02/17/11 09:04 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
I'll ask him to send a VOA sample off. We'll find out!
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2174529 - 02/18/11 08:26 AM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: saaber1]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: saaber1
Interesting to see a 10k run on this oil. I'm used to seeing DI petrol engines or race engines etc. with lower OCIs. TBN higher than I would have thought. Viscosity loss 3%. What were the earlier oils you used? Interesting that moly is 26 when virgin is around 0 and it can't really be residual form previous fill. Likewise magnesium but that could be explained from residual oil from previous fill.


Mobil 1 TDT since 56K miles.
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2174838 - 02/18/11 02:33 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: saaber1]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: saaber1
Originally Posted By: BobFout
CJ-4 does allow small amounts of moly. (Amsoil DEO has some)

There are a couple VOAs of the post 2008 formula on BITOG and none show moly over 3ppm. I wonder if the formula has changed? Here is one of the VOA threads: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...rue#Post1264593 Interestingly, Dave at Redline was unaware that they dropped moly from the formula even after it was being sold. So that VOA was a bit of an education for him too I guess. Maybe that's why we need BITOG ha ha.


I heard back from Dave. RL 5w40 should have around 100 ppm of moly.
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2174928 - 02/18/11 04:43 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
SIXSPEED Offline


Registered: 08/12/10
Posts: 528
Loc: Arizona
Originally Posted By: BobFout
I heard back from Dave. RL 5w40 should have around 100 ppm of moly.

Slightly higher levels of moly and a lot more Mg than I'm used to seeing in their 5W40. I suppose the Mg is lingering from the previous fill. Looks good for a 10K+ mile sample ... very shear stable and lots of TBN life left. I believe Blackstone's universal averages are based on half the miles you had on your oil.

The most recent RL 5W40 VOA I saw was sampled 5/12/09 and had a moly concentration of 711 ppm. shocked


Edited by SIXSPEED (02/18/11 04:56 PM)

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#2174935 - 02/18/11 04:52 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
Ben99GT Offline


Registered: 02/25/05
Posts: 4358
Loc: MS
Originally Posted By: BobFout
I heard back from Dave. RL 5w40 should have around 100 ppm of moly.


Cool, so it's been tweaked a little?
_________________________
2001 F150 Supercrew 4.6 - 321,000 miles- PP 5W-20/MC FL-820S
2011 Shelby GT500 SVTPP - 705 RWHP - PP Euro 0W-40/Wix 51372XP


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#2174943 - 02/18/11 04:59 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
SIXSPEED Offline


Registered: 08/12/10
Posts: 528
Loc: Arizona
If their 5W40 formulation changed to include 100 ppm moly, that would be perfect. I was considering mixing in a quart of 10W40 to a 5W40 fill to bring up moly to about 100 ppm.

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#2174989 - 02/18/11 05:53 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: SIXSPEED]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: SIXSPEED
Originally Posted By: BobFout
I heard back from Dave. RL 5w40 should have around 100 ppm of moly.

Slightly higher levels of moly and a lot more Mg than I'm used to seeing in their 5W40. I suppose the Mg is lingering from the previous fill. Looks good for a 10K+ mile sample ... very shear stable and lots of TBN life left. I believe Blackstone's universal averages are based on half the miles you had on your oil.

The most recent RL 5W40 VOA I saw was sampled 5/12/09 and had a moly concentration of 711 ppm. shocked


This is before CJ-4 compliance, hence the huge drop in moly.
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2174992 - 02/18/11 05:57 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: SIXSPEED]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: SIXSPEED
If their 5W40 formulation changed to include 100 ppm moly, that would be perfect. I was considering mixing in a quart of 10W40 to a 5W40 fill to bring up moly to about 100 ppm.


Their 10w40 is not CJ-4, should have the full ~950 ppm of moly.
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#2175130 - 02/18/11 09:29 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
saaber1 Offline


Registered: 11/28/07
Posts: 1877
Loc: Pacnw
I would guess that they are using it as an antioxidant at those lower levels rather than as a friction modifier as used in the higher moly formulations. As I understand it, large amounts are needed to act as a friction modifier due to surface competition with the esters. As I recall from extremely limited data, I got the impression that TAN buildup seemed higher on the high-moly formulas than the no-moly formulas. This makes sense as the amount of sulphur containing additives can influence acid buildup.

Interesting that they went from zero moly to 100ppm. I wonder if TBN is also impacted by the formula change.?
_________________________
"when 5W30 is cold, ...the oil is 35 weight (5+30),...20 w 50 starts at 70 and warms up to 50"
- Kyle, auto mechanic & VP Speedline Motorsports, INTL

Top
#2175150 - 02/18/11 09:58 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: BobFout]
SIXSPEED Offline


Registered: 08/12/10
Posts: 528
Loc: Arizona
I plan to buy some RL 5W40 in the next month. I will send a sample in for a VOA; then we'll know better what's in it. The most recent RL 5W40 VOAs I've come across are from 2008 and 2009.


Edited by SIXSPEED (02/18/11 10:00 PM)

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#2175917 - 02/19/11 07:57 PM Re: Redline 5w40, 10K miles, 2.0 PD TDI [Re: saaber1]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3183
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: saaber1
I would guess that they are using it as an antioxidant at those lower levels rather than as a friction modifier as used in the higher moly formulations. As I understand it, large amounts are needed to act as a friction modifier due to surface competition with the esters. As I recall from extremely limited data, I got the impression that TAN buildup seemed higher on the high-moly formulas than the no-moly formulas. This makes sense as the amount of sulphur containing additives can influence acid buildup.

Interesting that they went from zero moly to 100ppm. I wonder if TBN is also impacted by the formula change.?


It [RL 5w40] went from many hundreds of ppm of Moly to 100 RPM. Previous VOAs (non CJ-4 5w40) still had high moly levels.
_________________________
2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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