WS synthetic?
- Thread starter ron17571
- Start date
- Status
Which OEM ATF is synthetic?
Originally Posted by ron17571
Am I right with Toyota WS -ATF not being synthetic? Seems strange. Thoughts?
It may be semi-synthetic at best, but if you change the ATF every 50K or so, unless towing, I don't think it matters.
Am I right with Toyota WS -ATF not being synthetic? Seems strange. Thoughts?
It may be semi-synthetic at best, but if you change the ATF every 50K or so, unless towing, I don't think it matters.
I'm gonna use Idemitsu in our GS350.
Just sayin'...
Just sayin'...
I just used PetroCan Duradrive in my AS69RC, which calls for T4. The Duradrive, even though it is a thicker viscosity fluid is suitable for use according to PC. They say with testing it was determined to work just fine in LV applications but "may" not see the same fuel economy savings. PC just came out with a Duradrive LV fluid, which meets WS. All are full synthetic.
I'm swapping out the WS in my 2018 Highlander for Signature Series Fuel-Efficient Synthetic ATF formula. Get all the break-in wear out and get a high quality synthetic in there. It's running about 200F regularly without towing.
Amsoil told me that I could run the fluid for 160,000 miles under regular duty or 80,000 miles severe duty. I will change out the 3 quart with bottom plug every 50,000 miles to keep fresh fluid in there because there is no serviceable filter or pan to remove so I want as little debris floating around as possible on this "life time" filled transmission.
Did the Diff/Transfer case last weekend with Severe Gear. There was a ton of metal filings in there so I'm glad I did it.
Amsoil told me that I could run the fluid for 160,000 miles under regular duty or 80,000 miles severe duty. I will change out the 3 quart with bottom plug every 50,000 miles to keep fresh fluid in there because there is no serviceable filter or pan to remove so I want as little debris floating around as possible on this "life time" filled transmission.
Did the Diff/Transfer case last weekend with Severe Gear. There was a ton of metal filings in there so I'm glad I did it.
Last edited:
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Which OEM ATF is synthetic?
Dexron 6?
Which OEM ATF is synthetic?
Dexron 6?
I just changed out the WS fluid today at my dads. Did a full exchange all 8+ Quarts. It's MUCH better with the Amsoil in there. Can't even feel the shifts both up/down. Really happy I dumped it. Was a royal PITA waiting for the right temperature to do the proper fill procedure with the straw etc. because it was really hot today and I couldn't get it to cool down fast enough with a fan aimed at the transmission but we got it done. It wanted to stay above the 104F required check temperature.
I'm not advocating for Amsoil necessarily but I will tell you that the WS Fluid leaves a lot to be desired in terms of shift quality after what I saw today. Drove it just shy of 100km after the change.
I'm not advocating for Amsoil necessarily but I will tell you that the WS Fluid leaves a lot to be desired in terms of shift quality after what I saw today. Drove it just shy of 100km after the change.
Last edited:
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
Last edited:
Originally Posted by SHAMUS
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
I think it is a great idea to replace the WS with synthetic. Which fluid are you planning to use?
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
I think it is a great idea to replace the WS with synthetic. Which fluid are you planning to use?
Originally Posted by StevieC
I just changed out the WS fluid today at my dads. Did a full exchange all 8+ Quarts. It's MUCH better with the Amsoil in there. Can't even feel the shifts both up/down. Really happy I dumped it. Was a royal PITA waiting for the right temperature to do the proper fill procedure with the straw etc. because it was really hot today and I couldn't get it to cool down fast enough with a fan aimed at the transmission but we got it done. It wanted to stay above the 104F required check temperature.
Surprised to see the transaxle only holds 8 quarts. The A750 in my '07 4Runner took 13-14 quarts for a full flush. Scanner shows it runs at 165-170degF during highway cruising in hot weather, with no auxiliary cooler. I've seen it get to 194degF sitting in a highway traffic jam, AC on. This is with Toyota-bottle WS fluid flushed in at 165K miles after I bought it from the original owner.
While this vehicle wasn't a good investment of the extra $$ for Amsoil trans fluid at the time, I definitely agree with your decision. New vehicle, small trans fluid capacity...good investment in better fluid that will hold up to higher temps.
I just changed out the WS fluid today at my dads. Did a full exchange all 8+ Quarts. It's MUCH better with the Amsoil in there. Can't even feel the shifts both up/down. Really happy I dumped it. Was a royal PITA waiting for the right temperature to do the proper fill procedure with the straw etc. because it was really hot today and I couldn't get it to cool down fast enough with a fan aimed at the transmission but we got it done. It wanted to stay above the 104F required check temperature.
Surprised to see the transaxle only holds 8 quarts. The A750 in my '07 4Runner took 13-14 quarts for a full flush. Scanner shows it runs at 165-170degF during highway cruising in hot weather, with no auxiliary cooler. I've seen it get to 194degF sitting in a highway traffic jam, AC on. This is with Toyota-bottle WS fluid flushed in at 165K miles after I bought it from the original owner.
While this vehicle wasn't a good investment of the extra $$ for Amsoil trans fluid at the time, I definitely agree with your decision. New vehicle, small trans fluid capacity...good investment in better fluid that will hold up to higher temps.
Originally Posted by SHAMUS
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
I'm calling this questionable unless he actually knew the temps. For one, he should not have been towing in OD. It is well known that the driven gearsets take a beating in OD ratios and also create a ton of heat. And,which vehicle? The gen 1 tundras are known for having weak overdrives prone to shrapnel especially with towing. I owned a gen 1 with the stronger transmission, the 5-spd. That transmission was very well cooled and high temperatures simply were not a thing. If the A/C was off, it stayed around 165 during the summer, towing 4500 lbs, or 180 with the AC on. With 6,000 lbs, it pretty much stated at 180. It would exceed that on very steep climbs, we're talking the 25mph-30mph 4,000 rpm variety, where it would spike to 220-225F.
I can't really fault WS and heat loading here.
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
I'm calling this questionable unless he actually knew the temps. For one, he should not have been towing in OD. It is well known that the driven gearsets take a beating in OD ratios and also create a ton of heat. And,which vehicle? The gen 1 tundras are known for having weak overdrives prone to shrapnel especially with towing. I owned a gen 1 with the stronger transmission, the 5-spd. That transmission was very well cooled and high temperatures simply were not a thing. If the A/C was off, it stayed around 165 during the summer, towing 4500 lbs, or 180 with the AC on. With 6,000 lbs, it pretty much stated at 180. It would exceed that on very steep climbs, we're talking the 25mph-30mph 4,000 rpm variety, where it would spike to 220-225F.
I can't really fault WS and heat loading here.
Originally Posted by SHAMUS
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
I've noticed that my Tundra, despite its "modern" six speed, will unlock the torque convertor and run in too high of a gear if I let it. Meaning, high trans temps in operation. Which it seems Aisin transmissions don't care about, at least not for a long time, but it still bugs me to no end. I just lock out gears and proactively force downshifts when I drive it; not worthwhile on short hills but long hills I think it might make a big difference over the long run.
The trans temp gauge on the dash is a joke, it's one of those normalized affairs (always reads straight up in the ok zone--any gauge that doesn't use numbers is something of a joke). I use a Scanguage instead. But due to the heat exchanger, this trans should be running at near coolant temp on the highway, that is normal for it.
On another Toyota web site, a member showed broken trans parts from towing on the highway, in overdrive. The Toyota WS fluid simple broke down destroying the trans. It could not stand the high temps. I am taking my 2017 Tacoma to a trans shop who has a proper machine to completely remove the Toyota "World Standard" (WS) fluid; including the torque converter, cooling lines to, in, and from the radiator with a REAL high quality synthetic fluid. Yeah, it will cost some bucks, but I want a trans that will truly last over 100k safely, no matter the driving conditions. By the way, the poster was a mechanic with a shop, not just some guy.
I've noticed that my Tundra, despite its "modern" six speed, will unlock the torque convertor and run in too high of a gear if I let it. Meaning, high trans temps in operation. Which it seems Aisin transmissions don't care about, at least not for a long time, but it still bugs me to no end. I just lock out gears and proactively force downshifts when I drive it; not worthwhile on short hills but long hills I think it might make a big difference over the long run.
The trans temp gauge on the dash is a joke, it's one of those normalized affairs (always reads straight up in the ok zone--any gauge that doesn't use numbers is something of a joke). I use a Scanguage instead. But due to the heat exchanger, this trans should be running at near coolant temp on the highway, that is normal for it.
Idemitsu WS Equivalent
I replaced the WS in my 2010 RX350 with MAG 1 low viscosity full synthetic ATF. I did it the simple way via several cold drain and fills as only about 2 quarts get drained that way. It shifts faster and smoother than with the WS. Plus you can get 6 packs on Amazon for around $33 Now I do another drain and fill every year, but I only drive it less than 7,000 a year.
Time for another couple drain and fills..I will look into the Idemetsu WS equivalent as I am running their motor oil.
Time for another couple drain and fills..I will look into the Idemetsu WS equivalent as I am running their motor oil.
Last edited:
- Status