Why is Mobil 1 such a lightning rod?

[Summerwind]

My GMQ (with 8k on the clock when I got her) had recieved changes of MC5w20 up to that point, and one after I owned her. With 46k now on the clock, she has had Pennzoil conventional, and just yesterday got a fill of Pennzoil Platinum 5w20 (couldn't find any Ultra)

Looking in the oil filler hole, the mechanics that I could see couldn't be any more clean. Same result when I look in the filler hole of my 22 yr old Cutlass which has had Mobil 1 5w30 in it since her first oil change.

 

[Audi Junkie]

It's a flawed notion because they both pass the 5w cold cranking test at -25f.

 

[rclint]

Where did this synthetics are better than conventional ? All the showing going on can show some owners manual (please no german specialty engines) that recommends synthetic for every day passenger cars/trucks. Synthetics may handle heat better, however when is that needed ? we don't run air cooled engines for the most part... and from what I have seen a HD 30 will kill a multi weight synthetic on air cooled engines.. surely a synthetic should stand out here .. however I did slant the information by choosing a HD 30 (conventional !!)instead of a multi weight.

One biggy is over the road trucking choose conventional oil over synthetic 90% of the time maybe more... is synthetic is that much better then why on earth would anyone still blindly run conventional in those engines that would cost much more than our entire vehicle?

Last longer is pretty much worthless you should compare cost of each verses mile used, and also oil filter mileage, cost etc.. most of the time conventional will come out on time... most of the time meaning you will have to add extra cost of a used oil analysis, or blow some smoke how you "could" run such and such miles but you just can't bring yourself over the mark...

you did forget the very best synthetic comment "more protection" but noone knows what to do with the protection they have now using conventional hence not trusting the OLM set forth by manufactures to go the distance on conventional.. so now we are running synthetics based on conventional OLM then we start screaming how long these synthetics can go, how much heat they can handle... yet all that is being accomplished is running a OLM out to 10% maybe that was set by the manufactures R&D which makes most of our research seem pretty small all set on CONVENTIONAL

Now just so you don't think I'm one of those hung up on conventional people I'm running a synthetic (so called a group III oil anyway) in my 02 accord that says whatever oil you run synthetic or conventional follow the OCI set forth in the owners manual which is 7500 miles for me.

One more thing that may choke a few up here, when everyone is screaming how good synthetic is, chance are (90% or more) you are talking about good old fashion conventional.. I mean come one we can't have it all can we >??? I hope not to start a synthetic war, but group III was being called synthetic for along time, and Mobil 1 got all hot & bothered over Castrol moving their group III to synthetic line... so all of this bragging is probably over a conventional anyway unless you count esters (or what have you) in the add pack to deem the entire engine oil package base and all synthetic...

ok enough for today I have overdone it.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: rclint
Where did this synthetics are better than conventional ? All the showing going on can show some owners manual (please no german specialty engines) that recommends synthetic for every day passenger cars/trucks.

In Germany, Volkswagen, BMW, and Mercedes ARE everyday passenger cars/trucks.

The point about "better protection" needs to be qualified. It's better protection under certain extremes of temperature, mechanical shear, etc. Some engines produce those conditions internally just because of their design. They will benefit from synthetics. Other engines do not produce those conditions, so they will run just fine on conventionals.


Originally Posted By: rclint
is synthetic is that much better then why on earth would anyone still blindly run conventional in those engines that would cost much more than our entire vehicle?

The fact that people do something doesn't mean it makes sense.

 

[tig1]

rclint,

Good points, but I have friend that drives for Schneider trucking(the orange trucks) and they are now using semi synt of some sort. Also as we know Ford is using (MC) Semi synt oils in transmission and engine. No doubt conventional is much better today than when I started using Synt in the 70s. Also a lot of the sludger problems may have been averted(in toyotas and chryler engines because of conventional abuse) if they used a good synt. Just a thought.

 

[Audi Junkie]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d

Originally Posted By: rclint
is synthetic is that much better then why on earth would anyone still blindly run conventional in those engines that would cost much more than our entire vehicle?


The fact that people do something doesn't mean it makes sense.


Well, there is a lot of R&D behind OTR trucking and the HD oils.

That's what I like about HD oils, they are always refining and updating their specs and formulas. Euro spec oils like BMW get stuck in a formula for a LONG time.

 

[rclint]

I agree with the over the road trucking.. still I was kind of throwing some of the same reasoning out about how something is better does not mean much even if it has some connection.. HDEO will give many/most synthetics a run for the money, and may come out on top with much less money spent... again pretty worthless in most applications as passenger cars are all about conservation now while meeting the engine specifications. Which I hope all of this will show how synthetic just "ain't always better, always more protection, and always go longer, more heat etc.. that was my point.

doodfood I agree with you some engines do require this while doing so also most of the time they will also require s oil to meet certain specifications.. but the problem is somehow this gets over to synthetic being better, and offering more protection for every engine when in fact it represents a small portion from my experience driving down the road. Don't get me wrong when I'm looking through oil specifications I also want the very best..

on edit by the way doodfood that's the second time you plomped them germaners down when I posted about the exact phrase LOL

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: rclint
doodfood I agree with you some engines do require this while doing so also most of the time they will also require s oil to meet certain specifications.. but the problem is somehow this gets over to synthetic being better, and offering more protection for every engine when in fact it represents a small portion from my experience driving down the road.

You and I, we can agree.

By the same token, I think you should be more careful in your own statements not to suggest that synthetics are no better than conventionals. They are. The only question is whether the advantages will play out in practice.


Originally Posted By: rclint
on edit by the way doodfood that's the second time you plomped them germaners down when I posted about the exact phrase LOL

Say the same thing, get the same response.

I thought you were making the point that only certain niche cars call for synthetics. My point was that there are PLENTY of cars that are designed to be daily drivers and call for synthetics. If you meant to say that those cars were rare on the US market, I'd have to say it's a different story where I live, but I can see that.

 

[Mokanic]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: d00df00d

Originally Posted By: rclint
is synthetic is that much better then why on earth would anyone still blindly run conventional in those engines that would cost much more than our entire vehicle?


The fact that people do something doesn't mean it makes sense.


Well, there is a lot of R&D behind OTR trucking and the HD oils.

That's what I like about HD oils, they are always refining and updating their specs and formulas. Euro spec oils like BMW get stuck in a formula for a LONG time.

That as well as the fact that an over-the-road tractor engine holds about 50qts. of oil AND has bypass filters. You can run conventional oil for very long intervals with a sump that big and bypass filtration.

 

[Gene K]

Originally Posted By: Mokanic
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: d00df00d

Originally Posted By: rclint
is synthetic is that much better then why on earth would anyone still blindly run conventional in those engines that would cost much more than our entire vehicle?


The fact that people do something doesn't mean it makes sense.


Well, there is a lot of R&D behind OTR trucking and the HD oils.

That's what I like about HD oils, they are always refining and updating their specs and formulas. Euro spec oils like BMW get stuck in a formula for a LONG time.

That as well as the fact that an over-the-road tractor engine holds about 50qts. of oil AND has bypass filters. You can run conventional oil for very long intervals with a sump that big and bypass filtration.


Actually most do not have bypass filters and run closer to 40 qt.

You can easily go 30,000 miles between oil changes between changes with no bypass filter. As a matter of fact Ive done it with TBN still over 50%, Soot at very low levels and very low levels of metals.

In come applications with bypass filters its not unheard of to only change synthetic oil when the engine has to be opened up to run the valves every 120,000-240,000 miles.

 

[Gene K]

Originally Posted By: tig1
rclint,

Good points, but I have friend that drives for Schneider trucking(the orange trucks) and they are now using semi synt of some sort. Also as we know Ford is using (MC) Semi synt oils in transmission and engine. No doubt conventional is much better today than when I started using Synt in the 70s. Also a lot of the sludger problems may have been averted(in toyotas and chryler engines because of conventional abuse) if they used a good synt. Just a thought.


To the best of my knowledge Ford uses Full Synthetic Axle Lube and in the case of my MTX75 and MT82 Trans at least its Full GIV PAO Based Trans Fluid.

 

[Audi Junkie]

In the right climate, I'd run the VW 2.0T on 10w30 HD and/or 15w40.