When looking at oil

[Sonataman]

what is important to you and why?

I've read much the last few weeks and the HTHS, 40-100Vis, VI, shear resistence, NOACK, TBN, add packs, ester/pao etc, all sort of gets me confused.

Example- Many say they want high VI, yet RL 0w20 are middle at best compared to Toyota 0w20, but RL is labeled as very shear resistant.

I know only one thing so far for fact on this site, Pennzoil rules this place.

 

[A_Harman]

It depends on what you want the oil for.
To some extent, increasing the quantity of one characteristic will reduce the oil's performance in a different respect.

For example, high HTHS is good for high temperature lubrication under high power operation, but hurts fuel economy if you are cruising on the highway.

High VI improves oil pressure response time on cold start conditions, but can mean lower resistance to shear if the oil is put under high thermal and mechanical stress.

 

[volk06]

Originally Posted By: Sonataman

I know only one thing so far for fact on this site, Pennzoil rules this place.



It doesn't rule me and you'll find a lot of people using other products. They do put out some great oils though.

But I want an oil with a good TBN, decent cold weather performance, the HTO-6 cert (for my turbo engine) and what I view as a good additive package.

 

[bepperb]

The oil Has to have a HTHS appropriate for the engine and conditions.

It really should have KV to match.

You can't run an oil past it's TBN. Most people want an oil to match their OCI and don't go the other way around, though, so this is either a must or a maybe depending on that.

A low noack, good sheer resistance, good looking VOA's are nice to have.

And then price.

 

[rjacket]

1) Meet manufacturer spec
2) Cold start performance as most wear occurs when cold
3) Price

Most oils are good at 1 & 2 so really it comes down to 3.

I've never used Pennzoil myself mainly because rebates and deals on Valvoline and Quaker State have always made their synthetics so cheap.

 

[dave1251]

Look at my UOA on my pickup that is what I am looking for when it comes to an oil.

 

[CharlieJ]

I look for these three criteria:

1. HT/HS
2. NOACK
3. Sheer stability

I live in Florida, so cold flow specs are not that important to me.

 

[deven]

Originally Posted By: Sonataman
what is important to you and why?

I am one of the lucky ones who is able to see tear downs from different engines and different oils used. So its easy for me to choose oil. Whats important to me is minimal wear on engine after tear down and oxidative stability. I have seen plenty of tear downs where the metal has actually been discolored due to heat and oxidation but kept the engine very clean and vice versa. Right now the steller tear downs are between Royal Purple and Red Line oils. So I use them.

 

[nleksan]

Deven: I have come to the same exact conclusion as you, and for the same reason. Granted my teardowns are limited to BMW, Audi/VW, and a few other Euro motors, but the results are consistent.

 

[lonestar]

If these oils (Royal Purple & Red Line) are so good, I am certainly not saying they are not, then why the need for an engine tear down?

 

[nleksan]

In my own case, on my 328 it was to prep for the supercharger. Pulled the engine and installed, among other things...
Mahle forged pistons
Full titanium valvetrain
Additional porting
Carrillo forged connecting rods and upgraded bearings
Blueprinted and razor honed crank
ARP full kit (head/block/etc)
Camshafts (Stg3 NA to Stg4 FI)
Swaintech coating on most parts (including headers, intercooler, IC piping)
...and so on.

Stock parts came out in amazing shape.

 

[Nodak]

Originally Posted By: rjacket
1) Meet manufacturer spec
2) Cold start performance as most wear occurs when cold
3) Price

Most oils are good at 1 & 2 so really it comes down to 3.

I've never used Pennzoil myself mainly because rebates and deals on Valvoline and Quaker State have always made their synthetics so cheap.


What you said!!

_______________________

97 Prk. Ave.-5-30 QSGB and NAPA gold filter
91 Dakota 4x4-5-30 QSGB and NAPA gold filter
03 Corolla-5-30 QSUD and NAPA gold or Wix filter

 

[deven]

Originally Posted By: lonestar
If these oils (Royal Purple & Red Line) are so good, I am certainly not saying they are not, then why the need for an engine tear down?
Originally Posted By: nleksan
In my own case, on my 328 it was to prep for the supercharger. Pulled the engine and installed, among other things...
Mahle forged pistons
Full titanium valvetrain
Additional porting
Carrillo forged connecting rods and upgraded bearings
Blueprinted and razor honed crank
ARP full kit (head/block/etc)
Camshafts (Stg3 NA to Stg4 FI)
Swaintech coating on most parts (including headers, intercooler, IC piping)
...and so on.

Stock parts came out in amazing shape.

Exactly. I own a race/modification shop and tear downs are a daily thing to replace the OEM parts to race parts. Most of my specialists that work on these cars don't need to know about oil and neither do they know the nuts and bolts about motor oil. What they do know is to trust their own pair of eyes and see first hand what oil has worked and what has failed. IMO, there is no substitute for this. I will take their recommendation in oil over someone here on BITOG who sits on the computer and analyses PDS and MSDS data to select oil because they have enough tear down experiences to know what oil has worked in that particular engine with minimal wear.

 

[BobThe]

Originally Posted By: deven
Originally Posted By: lonestar
If these oils (Royal Purple & Red Line) are so good, I am certainly not saying they are not, then why the need for an engine tear down?
Originally Posted By: nleksan
In my own case, on my 328 it was to prep for the supercharger. Pulled the engine and installed, among other things...
Mahle forged pistons
Full titanium valvetrain
Additional porting
Carrillo forged connecting rods and upgraded bearings
Blueprinted and razor honed crank
ARP full kit (head/block/etc)
Camshafts (Stg3 NA to Stg4 FI)
Swaintech coating on most parts (including headers, intercooler, IC piping)
...and so on.

Stock parts came out in amazing shape.

Exactly. I own a race/modification shop and tear downs are a daily thing to replace the OEM parts to race parts. Most of my specialists that work on these cars don't need to know about oil and neither do they know the nuts and bolts about motor oil. What they do know is to trust their own pair of eyes and see first hand what oil has worked and what has failed. IMO, there is no substitute for this. I will take their recommendation in oil over someone here on BITOG who sits on the computer and analyses PDS and MSDS data to select oil because they have enough tear down experiences to know what oil has worked in that particular engine with minimal wear.

And honestly,these sorts of statements go a long way to better my opinion of Redline and Royal Purple. Tearing down a buddies 5.0 to put new heads on it and seeing the condition of it as we tore it down sold me on Mobil1 for the longest time.

 

[nleksan]

Deven: sounds like you are the kind of guy I want doing my engine work!

 

[moto94536]

I currently have chevron supreme on my camry v6. Oil still look good at 5k. Those are 99% highway miles. I also think toyota oem oil filter keep the oil cleaner.

Toyota recommend 5k oci ( which I assume city/highway miles )..

So I am going to run 6k oci highway miles. remember chevron supreme have 8.6 TBN. very very strong.

 

[jorton]

viscosity @ -30C = thinner than average

Principal elements of the add pack are at average levels in ppm, or better.

Dino oil available in jugs at Walmart.

Per pqia analysis only Quaker State Advanced qualified.

 

[CATERHAM]

First and formost is it's HTHSV value.

If you're starting unaided in extreme cold conditions then the MRV spec' would be next otherwise it is an oil's VI.

3rd would be the add' pac' and base oil chemistry; i.e., ester content.

The RL 0W-20 vs Toyota 0W-20 comparison are two extremes of what are very different oils used in very different applications.
The PAO/POE, VII free, high moly, high ZDDP RL oil has a HTHSV of 3.0cP and 166 VI.
So right off this is not an oil for a true 20wt application.
It would be most suitable for a high stress application where a light shear stable 30wt oil is required.

The Toyota 0W-20 is the lightest readily available 20wt oil on the market. It's has a HTHSV of 2.6cP with a 216 VI and a robust AW package. It's ideally suited for where a 0W-20 oil is specified or in other applications where you want the lightest oil on start-up and maximum oil temp's are well contained. It's not a long drain oil per se although the US Toyota OCI is up to 10,000 miles.

 

[Cristobal]

For the Beast, it must be SH or better. Almost all oils are today.

It must be good for the season. For winter that means down to -15 F. as I drive up to Central Nevada, and in summer, good to 122 F or so; I have driven in all those extremes and in between. My oil usually gets changed around the first day of spring and first day of autumn, twice a year.

I want a good price. Many oils qualify, and I don't mind mixing.