if the mods call for 5w20 there is a reason....one reason is the bearings run cooler over 5w30 another reason is the filter stays out of by pass less often the third reason is the valve guides the thinner oil gets to places that the thick does not as often the fourth is more power with the 5w20 (you may or may not feel this) and of course gas mileage. This has been proven by ford and taught at two engine seminars that ford paid for. We are engine rebuilders and i try to go to most of these seminars.. With their r&d and all the money they put into their research and the great minds they have in the design department they know better than me. i was a thicker is better guy it only seemed to make sense but i was wrong they showed me a better way. Oh i forgot! The faster flow at all temperatures!
whats your oil filter of choice and why?
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Thats cool. But maybe ford should make an engine that will run 5/20 and not self destruct or rattle like a bag of pans rolling down the stairs in the morning..
People shouldn't have to replace the whole dang valvetrain at 100k. No im not blaming the oil just the engineers that made the 5.4 and decided it should run 20 grade. The same guys that came up with the awesome spark plug and cylinder design.
Tell us more about how awesome ford is and thier unquestionably infinite knowledge that always prevails please.
The ford house said I needed new vct solenoids, phasers and timing chain at 130k. I just switched to 5/30 and drove it another 30k. They also charge $800 to change the plugs by their tsb. I disregarded this and pulled the plugs hot and didn't break any. My point is sometimes you have to ignore ford and listen to some common sense. Especially when its about the 5.4
People shouldn't have to replace the whole dang valvetrain at 100k. No im not blaming the oil just the engineers that made the 5.4 and decided it should run 20 grade. The same guys that came up with the awesome spark plug and cylinder design.
Tell us more about how awesome ford is and thier unquestionably infinite knowledge that always prevails please.
The ford house said I needed new vct solenoids, phasers and timing chain at 130k. I just switched to 5/30 and drove it another 30k. They also charge $800 to change the plugs by their tsb. I disregarded this and pulled the plugs hot and didn't break any. My point is sometimes you have to ignore ford and listen to some common sense. Especially when its about the 5.4
Im sorry if that post seemed a little tacky. Im just mad at ford I guess. Hondas are turning 300k all over the place running 5/20 with out a hitch. Seems like ford just didnt quite get it right at first. At least when it comes to engines like mine. But when so much is hydraulic, you would think they would put some thought into it before mandating an oil that depends so much on tight clearances. And you would hope they would install parts that last instead of timing chain tensioners with poor seals that can starve the variable cam timing components causing a slew of problems.
So anyway sorry for ranting, it should have been directed at ford R&D
So anyway sorry for ranting, it should have been directed at ford R&D
Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
if the mods call for 5w20 there is a reason....one reason is the bearings run cooler over 5w30 another reason is the filter stays out of by pass less often the third reason is the valve guides the thinner oil gets to places that the thick does not as often the fourth is more power with the 5w20 (you may or may not feel this) and of course gas mileage. This has been proven by ford and taught at two engine seminars that ford paid for. We are engine rebuilders and i try to go to most of these seminars.. With their r&d and all the money they put into their research and the great minds they have in the design department they know better than me. i was a thicker is better guy it only seemed to make sense but i was wrong they showed me a better way. Oh i forgot! The faster flow at all temperatures!
Take all of the misconcetpions out of the post (e.g faster flow at all temperatures, lower bearing temperatures, blah blah), and just say "Ford said so, so it is Gospel"...
if the mods call for 5w20 there is a reason....one reason is the bearings run cooler over 5w30 another reason is the filter stays out of by pass less often the third reason is the valve guides the thinner oil gets to places that the thick does not as often the fourth is more power with the 5w20 (you may or may not feel this) and of course gas mileage. This has been proven by ford and taught at two engine seminars that ford paid for. We are engine rebuilders and i try to go to most of these seminars.. With their r&d and all the money they put into their research and the great minds they have in the design department they know better than me. i was a thicker is better guy it only seemed to make sense but i was wrong they showed me a better way. Oh i forgot! The faster flow at all temperatures!
Take all of the misconcetpions out of the post (e.g faster flow at all temperatures, lower bearing temperatures, blah blah), and just say "Ford said so, so it is Gospel"...
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: Inline200
For my Modular I only use the FL-820S, but when I do other cars I usually go with Fram. The Fram Ultra is a great filter and would be my filter of choice with any other type of engine.
I really dont understand why ford guys are so stuck on the 820s. Yeah its a good low priced filter but there are a lot of filters with silicone ADBVs and better construction and efficiency. The real reason I think, is all the mod guys think it helps start up rattles. The reality is if you dump the 5/20 and go with 5/30 you dont even need an ADBV to keep it from rattling in the morning. The oil is the problem and the filter is not the solution
OT Really? Not in my experience. Son owned an 05 4.6L Explorer purchased new that only saw 5w20, mostly MC Syn Blend for ~5k oci's. The one time he went to a quick lube for OC they installed some aftermarket generic filter, iirc nitrile adbv, he had a start up rattle for that oci. Switched back the the FL820S next oc keeping the 5w20, start up rattle gone, never used anything but the 820S after that. While prehaps not the 'absolute best' filter out there, the FL 820S is a solid filter at a value price. It seems to work particularly well in FoMoCo vehicles, some of which may be more sensitive to a start up rattle. And now thanks to Amsoil testing, it's generally accepted that the 820S has a known solid efficiency spec of ~94%@20um, as opposed to the old vague 80%@20um that MC put out.
Your 'reality' conclusion about no adbv and 5w20, is different than my experience. Did more than 'think' the FL820S helped with start up rattle, it cured the issue. Based on the oil and 820S filter specs it's also apparently different than Ford's conclusion too. Just sayin.
Originally Posted By: Inline200
For my Modular I only use the FL-820S, but when I do other cars I usually go with Fram. The Fram Ultra is a great filter and would be my filter of choice with any other type of engine.
I really dont understand why ford guys are so stuck on the 820s. Yeah its a good low priced filter but there are a lot of filters with silicone ADBVs and better construction and efficiency. The real reason I think, is all the mod guys think it helps start up rattles. The reality is if you dump the 5/20 and go with 5/30 you dont even need an ADBV to keep it from rattling in the morning. The oil is the problem and the filter is not the solution
OT Really? Not in my experience. Son owned an 05 4.6L Explorer purchased new that only saw 5w20, mostly MC Syn Blend for ~5k oci's. The one time he went to a quick lube for OC they installed some aftermarket generic filter, iirc nitrile adbv, he had a start up rattle for that oci. Switched back the the FL820S next oc keeping the 5w20, start up rattle gone, never used anything but the 820S after that. While prehaps not the 'absolute best' filter out there, the FL 820S is a solid filter at a value price. It seems to work particularly well in FoMoCo vehicles, some of which may be more sensitive to a start up rattle. And now thanks to Amsoil testing, it's generally accepted that the 820S has a known solid efficiency spec of ~94%@20um, as opposed to the old vague 80%@20um that MC put out.
Your 'reality' conclusion about no adbv and 5w20, is different than my experience. Did more than 'think' the FL820S helped with start up rattle, it cured the issue. Based on the oil and 820S filter specs it's also apparently different than Ford's conclusion too. Just sayin.
I have ran a lot of 820s filters and the only thing that stopped my rattle was thicker oil.
But im glad it worked for you. Maybe you didn't get a lemon
But im glad it worked for you. Maybe you didn't get a lemon
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: Inline200
For my Modular I only use the FL-820S, but when I do other cars I usually go with Fram. The Fram Ultra is a great filter and would be my filter of choice with any other type of engine.
I really dont understand why ford guys are so stuck on the 820s. Yeah its a good low priced filter but there are a lot of filters with silicone ADBVs and better construction and efficiency. The real reason I think, is all the mod guys think it helps start up rattles. The reality is if you dump the 5/20 and go with 5/30 you dont even need an ADBV to keep it from rattling in the morning. The oil is the problem and the filter is not the solution
OT Really? Not in my experience. Son owned an 05 4.6L Explorer purchased new that only saw 5w20, mostly MC Syn Blend for ~5k oci's. The one time he went to a quick lube for OC they installed some aftermarket generic filter, iirc nitrile adbv, he had a start up rattle for that oci. Switched back the the FL820S next oc keeping the 5w20, start up rattle gone, never used anything but the 820S after that. While prehaps not the 'absolute best' filter out there, the FL 820S is a solid filter at a value price. It seems to work particularly well in FoMoCo vehicles, some of which may be more sensitive to a start up rattle. And now thanks to Amsoil testing, it's generally accepted that the 820S has a known solid efficiency spec of ~94%@20um, as opposed to the old vague 80%@20um that MC put out.
Your 'reality' conclusion about no adbv and 5w20, is different than my experience. Did more than 'think' the FL820S helped with start up rattle, it cured the issue. Based on the oil and 820S filter specs it's also apparently different than Ford's conclusion too. Just sayin.
The 4.6 in your sons Explorer is a 2v and different from the 3v 5.4 in electrolovers truck. The 3v 5.4 and even the 3v 4.6 have a fairly common problem with ticking noises. Some people have had luck addressing the cam phasers but others jus go to a thicker oil. I think Ford even had an internal statement talking about 40w oil when customers come in with the ticking issue.
More info at the link, including the TSB:
Ford Trucks forum 3v ticking problem thread
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: Inline200
For my Modular I only use the FL-820S, but when I do other cars I usually go with Fram. The Fram Ultra is a great filter and would be my filter of choice with any other type of engine.
I really dont understand why ford guys are so stuck on the 820s. Yeah its a good low priced filter but there are a lot of filters with silicone ADBVs and better construction and efficiency. The real reason I think, is all the mod guys think it helps start up rattles. The reality is if you dump the 5/20 and go with 5/30 you dont even need an ADBV to keep it from rattling in the morning. The oil is the problem and the filter is not the solution
OT Really? Not in my experience. Son owned an 05 4.6L Explorer purchased new that only saw 5w20, mostly MC Syn Blend for ~5k oci's. The one time he went to a quick lube for OC they installed some aftermarket generic filter, iirc nitrile adbv, he had a start up rattle for that oci. Switched back the the FL820S next oc keeping the 5w20, start up rattle gone, never used anything but the 820S after that. While prehaps not the 'absolute best' filter out there, the FL 820S is a solid filter at a value price. It seems to work particularly well in FoMoCo vehicles, some of which may be more sensitive to a start up rattle. And now thanks to Amsoil testing, it's generally accepted that the 820S has a known solid efficiency spec of ~94%@20um, as opposed to the old vague 80%@20um that MC put out.
Your 'reality' conclusion about no adbv and 5w20, is different than my experience. Did more than 'think' the FL820S helped with start up rattle, it cured the issue. Based on the oil and 820S filter specs it's also apparently different than Ford's conclusion too. Just sayin.
The 4.6 in your sons Explorer is a 2v and different from the 3v 5.4 in electrolovers truck. The 3v 5.4 and even the 3v 4.6 have a fairly common problem with ticking noises. Some people have had luck addressing the cam phasers but others jus go to a thicker oil. I think Ford even had an internal statement talking about 40w oil when customers come in with the ticking issue.
More info at the link, including the TSB:
Ford Trucks forum 3v ticking problem thread
Originally Posted By: Inline200
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Inline200 said:
Quote:
The 4.6 in your sons Explorer is a 2v and different from the 3v 5.4 in electrolovers truck......
And, as electro's post that I quoted NEVER specified a specific engine but was rather apparently a generalization regarding ALL Ford 'mod' engines, that's what I addressed. Thus my response was based on the information provided. I'm sure electro appreciates you clarifying what he meant by 'mod' engine, even though that wasn't stated in the quoted post. However, I'll stand by my post regarding the modular engine with which I have experience.
But what is unfortunate imo, is that this thread has been taken off topic by another useless thin vs thick oil discussion.
*Edit timed out while I was making a correction in my previous post, thus the duplicate post to clarify my response.
The 4.6 in your sons Explorer is a 2v and different from the 3v 5.4 in electrolovers truck......
And, as electro's post that I quoted NEVER specified a specific engine but was rather apparently a generalization regarding ALL Ford 'mod' engines, that's what I addressed. Thus my response was based on the information provided. I'm sure electro appreciates you clarifying what he meant by 'mod' engine, even though that wasn't stated in the quoted post. However, I'll stand by my post regarding the modular engine with which I have experience.
But what is unfortunate imo, is that this thread has been taken off topic by another useless thin vs thick oil discussion.
*Edit timed out while I was making a correction in my previous post, thus the duplicate post to clarify my response.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Royal Purple. Money isn't the deciding factor for me on oil or filters.One of the best filters out there plus I am a fan of their products in general and use their oil.
If I couldn't get an RP for some reason and had to do an OC I would look at getting one of the following...
K&N
Mobil 1
Bosch D+
Purolator Synthetic
Agreed, I don't mind paying a bit more for an improved filter and favor either of these two.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551795#Post2551795
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=floUZGP6NZM
Royal Purple. Money isn't the deciding factor for me on oil or filters.One of the best filters out there plus I am a fan of their products in general and use their oil.
If I couldn't get an RP for some reason and had to do an OC I would look at getting one of the following...
K&N
Mobil 1
Bosch D+
Purolator Synthetic
Agreed, I don't mind paying a bit more for an improved filter and favor either of these two.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2551795#Post2551795
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=floUZGP6NZM
Hello, I go PureOne or Mobil1 or MANN or Mazda OE. The reasons, you ask? The first two for quality and value. The third for quality, value and convenience being they're for my Volvo and it's a cartridge filter which is a loss leader from the online European parts places. The last one is for my sister's new "Skyaktiv" 1998cc Mazda engine which uses thin (0W-20, I think) oil. I commend filter companies which offer no application for this engine even though they have a filter which fits. I have to conclude that there is something different about this filter. Kira
The F-150 gets Motorcraft. The Duramax gets AC Delco.
I bought a case of Motorcraft FL-500s when the truck was new. If you can get them fleet packed (no individual boxes) they are about $4.50 each.
I don't put many miles on the D-max so I buy 2 or 3 filters when they're on sale at Merchant Automotive.
I bought a case of Motorcraft FL-500s when the truck was new. If you can get them fleet packed (no individual boxes) they are about $4.50 each.
I don't put many miles on the D-max so I buy 2 or 3 filters when they're on sale at Merchant Automotive.
Given all the palaver about ABVs and noise I don't quite understand why engine designers don't mount filters "upside down" like the old SAAB engines and others. AT least the filter stays full. BTW I like Puro filters which Amazon has at good prices.
Motorcraft. Because any other oil filter causes engine rattle upon startup, on my engine.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: KevGuy
Purolator
There ya go. I fixed it for you.
Purolator
There ya go. I fixed it for you.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Motorcraft. Because any other oil filter causes engine rattle upon startup, on my engine.
I had to stop using Motorcraft filters because of start up rattle in my 4.6..I now use Bosch filters and now my engine start-up rattle days are over.
Motorcraft. Because any other oil filter causes engine rattle upon startup, on my engine.
I had to stop using Motorcraft filters because of start up rattle in my 4.6..I now use Bosch filters and now my engine start-up rattle days are over.
Originally Posted By: CROWNVIC4LIFE
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Motorcraft. Because any other oil filter causes engine rattle upon startup, on my engine.
I had to stop using Motorcraft filters because of start up rattle in my 4.6..I now use Bosch filters and now my engine start-up rattle days are over.
My dad just started using MC oil filters on his 06 Lincoln 4.6. All others caused engine rattle upon startup.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Motorcraft. Because any other oil filter causes engine rattle upon startup, on my engine.
I had to stop using Motorcraft filters because of start up rattle in my 4.6..I now use Bosch filters and now my engine start-up rattle days are over.
My dad just started using MC oil filters on his 06 Lincoln 4.6. All others caused engine rattle upon startup.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
My dad just started using MC oil filters on his 06 Lincoln 4.6. All others caused engine rattle upon startup.
The 07 4.6 Marquis is just fine with the Motorcraft filter..Just my 05 Vic has issues with start-up rattle with the Motorcraft filter..
My dad just started using MC oil filters on his 06 Lincoln 4.6. All others caused engine rattle upon startup.
The 07 4.6 Marquis is just fine with the Motorcraft filter..Just my 05 Vic has issues with start-up rattle with the Motorcraft filter..
See what I was talking about?
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