My whole thing with Havoline is that it's not exactly cheap. The cheapest I've seen it here is $1.99/qt. I've never seen it on sale or coupons offered.
What's up with the Havoline group think/sheep herd mentality here?
- Thread starter doitmyself
- Start date
- Status
i've used Havoline ever since i started driving, so what can i say i've had good luck with it.
I intend to keep on using it in my Explorer as well as any other slightly older vehicle i own.
In my car i plan to either run Havoline Partial Synthetic or Motorcraft Partial Syn.
I intend to keep on using it in my Explorer as well as any other slightly older vehicle i own.
In my car i plan to either run Havoline Partial Synthetic or Motorcraft Partial Syn.
Don't look at me. I have never touched a bottle of Havoline in my life. Always been a Castrol fan(20 years). More recently, a Chevron Delo user. I see no reason to use any oil outside of these 2 brands.
hehe... sorry to hyjack, but, to elaborate a little on that subject.. An isuzu rodeo/passport, is hardly an isuzu eithor... It's more like, a reverse engineered nuetered sudo-copy of it's eastern counterparts here in the states... it's full of GM parts over here, for many years, they even had gm engines in them.... then they switched to an isuzu designed gasoline engine that shares it's design ideas from many chrystler V6s... The manual auto trannies used for many years, were pure GM. Current Isuzu's, are nothing more than rebadged versions of GM products (those GM products, however, are gasoline versions of the isuzus being sold in asia, that came out years prior, pretty funny eh-?
but the same thing applies... the GM versions of the isuzu truck and suv (trailblazer and colorado), have better resale value because of the name.
if only isuzu would bring their *real* isuzu's over here, the turbo-diesel trucks/suvs, they could make a better name for themselves, and become more like havoline. lol.
Well I agree in principle with your statement, but I don't think it applies in this instance. Herd (sheep) mentality implies that people are following without question and, consequently, without reason.
That might apply to many things in our society and maybe even some on this website, but I don't think it applies here. On the contrary this forum is generally a great example of people actually using objective data to arrive at conclusions, and in this case the data - UOAs - really does show these to be first rate products, especially (but not only) when considering price. Chev Supreme is available at $0.49 a quart right now at Checker and performs as well as and sometimes better than oils costing $5+ per quart.
So I have become an advocate of these products. As long as the data continues to support it I will continue to be. I'd say that's just being rational. Irrational might be, for example, spending $5 a quart for oil that performs, oh, about as well as Havoline!
- Glenn
That might apply to many things in our society and maybe even some on this website, but I don't think it applies here. On the contrary this forum is generally a great example of people actually using objective data to arrive at conclusions, and in this case the data - UOAs - really does show these to be first rate products, especially (but not only) when considering price. Chev Supreme is available at $0.49 a quart right now at Checker and performs as well as and sometimes better than oils costing $5+ per quart.
So I have become an advocate of these products. As long as the data continues to support it I will continue to be. I'd say that's just being rational. Irrational might be, for example, spending $5 a quart for oil that performs, oh, about as well as Havoline!
- Glenn
mdocod - Yeah, both my Rodeo's had the chevy tranny. The '91 Rodeo 3.1L V6 was a chevy/GM engine with many more Chevy parts then my '97 Rodeo. The '97 3.2L V6 Isuzu engine has more Isuzu parts then Chevy - but the tranny IS from Chevy.
Truth of the matter is nothing IS as it states it IS - my sister's "Dodge" minivan is loaded with a Mitsubishi engine; the Pontiac Vibe has a Toyota 1.8L engine; my B-I-L recently informed me that the Toyota Tundra's V8 engine is a design from Chevy; the Chevy Duramax diesel is an Isuzu design; and the list goes on.
No-one manufacturer IS the actual 100% manufacturer - they're all mixed and matched at some point. And someone (manufacturer) owns stock in another company and so on.
But you're right, I wish they would bring over a 100% Isuzu 3/4 ton truck - I'd be the 1st in line
.
Whatever design my current Rodeo may have stemmed from - it's been a good one. I honestly don't know what we'll do when the time comes that this Rodeo needs replaced; it's truly been the ultimate, most problem-matic free vehicle we have had in years.
I can't say that about the latter '99 "Chevy" 3/4 truck that fell apart at 90k miles; though that was a rarity for us. We've always had good luck with Chevy.
But, I can't say I've been all that interested in the Ascender, Axiom, Trailblazer, or the Colorado.
I just don't care for the looks of the many newer SUV's/compact truck's, and that goes for Jeep, Dodge, Ford, Toyota, Honda, Chevy, Mitsubishi, etc they're not built like they use to be, and they're too pretty to take off the beaten path.
But whatever will be purchased, it will have Havoline
!
Truth of the matter is nothing IS as it states it IS - my sister's "Dodge" minivan is loaded with a Mitsubishi engine; the Pontiac Vibe has a Toyota 1.8L engine; my B-I-L recently informed me that the Toyota Tundra's V8 engine is a design from Chevy; the Chevy Duramax diesel is an Isuzu design; and the list goes on.
No-one manufacturer IS the actual 100% manufacturer - they're all mixed and matched at some point. And someone (manufacturer) owns stock in another company and so on.
But you're right, I wish they would bring over a 100% Isuzu 3/4 ton truck - I'd be the 1st in line
Whatever design my current Rodeo may have stemmed from - it's been a good one. I honestly don't know what we'll do when the time comes that this Rodeo needs replaced; it's truly been the ultimate, most problem-matic free vehicle we have had in years.
I can't say that about the latter '99 "Chevy" 3/4 truck that fell apart at 90k miles; though that was a rarity for us. We've always had good luck with Chevy.
But, I can't say I've been all that interested in the Ascender, Axiom, Trailblazer, or the Colorado.
I just don't care for the looks of the many newer SUV's/compact truck's, and that goes for Jeep, Dodge, Ford, Toyota, Honda, Chevy, Mitsubishi, etc they're not built like they use to be, and they're too pretty to take off the beaten path.
But whatever will be purchased, it will have Havoline
Although I would have to agree that for the most part a badge is just that. However Mack trucks may be the exception. While they still rely on outside vendors to supply materials, you can buy a Mack truck with Mack engine/trans/diffs/suspension - everything Mack, but it really doesn't apply since you probably wouldn't want Havoline in it.
Patrick
Patrick
Ramblin Fever,
I agree with everything that you said about which MFG makes/designs which engine except the Tundra engine. Are you sure that Chevy is involved in that Toyota design?
I agree with everything that you said about which MFG makes/designs which engine except the Tundra engine. Are you sure that Chevy is involved in that Toyota design?
quote:
My whole thing with Havoline is that it's not exactly cheap. The cheapest I've seen it here is $1.99/qt. I've never seen it on sale or coupons offered.
Wal-Mart sells it for the everyday low price of $7.00 for a 5 quart jug or $1.40 a quart.
My whole thing with Havoline is that it's not exactly cheap. The cheapest I've seen it here is $1.99/qt. I've never seen it on sale or coupons offered.
Wal-Mart sells it for the everyday low price of $7.00 for a 5 quart jug or $1.40 a quart.
Char Baby - No, I'm not 100% sure, in fact, I was kind of irritated when my brother-in-law insisted that it was involved in Chevy.
I'm definitely gonna research that one further, as I'm very interested in a Toyota Tundra - and I can't say I was all that happy with our last '99 Chevy.
I'm definitely gonna research that one further, as I'm very interested in a Toyota Tundra - and I can't say I was all that happy with our last '99 Chevy.
No Walmart within 30 miles.
Welll..I don't know why you would need to be a "real chemist" (I'm not) to do some minor origional thinking and add an oil to get something better. I have Put a quart of RedLine in with a number of other oils and frankly it improves the wear numbers. It might be a reach to assume that that is a good thing, but its the best I can do.
Oh yea, I also add powdered milk to my regular milk and cereal to get more calcium.
I'd like to take a shot at this. For some of us there are multiple reasons to love and to tout an oil. For example, I climbed aboard the GC bandwagon before it was a bandwagon and before we had seen our first UOA...why? Because I am a Euro guy and when I found out it was brewed in Germany and that it was a Castrol product brewed in Germany that is all I needed to know...at first. But the next part is important too (obviously it is the REALLY important part). What kind of UOAs does this oil produce? If it had turned out to be a loser, I would have been sorely tempted to continue using it because of its origin, but I am pretty sure I would have eventually turned somewhere else, like to Elf or Pentosin. (And, had that been the case...I should have backed off the hype. An aside at this point...am I dissing US or Asian oils...NO NO NO...I just am a Euro guy and those are the automotive products I prefer.) Meanwhile back at the ranch. One thing that would have been absurd, if the UOAs had been bad, is if I had continued to rave about the oil to those to whom the Euro thing means nothing but the wear and oil endurance over a long OCI thing is most important. So, what does it all mean. If someone is psyched over Havoline or Pennzoil or Mobil 1...fine. But if it does not prove to be a good performer, or if people make it clear, "Hey we really don't want to hear about it any more," then the talk should stop or should be taken to a Havoline or Pennzoil or Mobil 1 lovers part of the board. Now, as a prime purveyor of the GC following, I would say this: if an oil, like GC, obviously has a mystique that engenders a following, the non-GCers should not begrudge the clan their enjoyment. (The clan should be judicious about WHERE they take their talk. I try to "cross over" from the GC village only when I genuinely feel there is something that others could benefit hearing about or when I have a legitimate recommendation to make when someone asks what would be a good oil for their application....OK, OK, also when I feel like I have a "funny" comment.) But if an oil does not generate real interest, its adherents should be wise enough to leave well enough alone.
pscholte, this part right here though I find interesting. Everyone has the choice to like what they want and prefer a particular brand when it comes to any product. But what does it being European have anything to do with it? Mobil 1 is very popular in Europe, but is made here in the US or over seas plants. Motul is made in France. I guess your trying to link Europe with higher quality? If so, I think thats misleading.
I think any motor oil with a unique aspect will have an oportunity to spend some time in the Bitog spotlight.
We saw this with Motorcraft and the the Grp III syn blend appeal, last year.
And the same with the Trop Artic Grp II/III blend being sold thru the Dollar stores.
Walmart SuperTech oil even had a following for awhile & we would see frequent UOA's posted.
And to me, this was always a bit of a paradox - spend $20-30 on a UOA to verify the performance of a 79 cent per quart motor oil. (Yeah, I know - the fascination with seeing SuperTech perform on a similar level as M1.)
So Havoline fans will continue talking it up until that train runs out of steam.
Psst! Watch out, I heard Pennzoil is coming out with an all new sludge fighting formulation...
We saw this with Motorcraft and the the Grp III syn blend appeal, last year.
And the same with the Trop Artic Grp II/III blend being sold thru the Dollar stores.
Walmart SuperTech oil even had a following for awhile & we would see frequent UOA's posted.
And to me, this was always a bit of a paradox - spend $20-30 on a UOA to verify the performance of a 79 cent per quart motor oil. (Yeah, I know - the fascination with seeing SuperTech perform on a similar level as M1.)
So Havoline fans will continue talking it up until that train runs out of steam.
Psst! Watch out, I heard Pennzoil is coming out with an all new sludge fighting formulation...
Negative, buster...it is not a blanket statement that Euro oils are of better quality then American oils...I do believe that Euro oils are designed with conditions in mind that produce an oil that satisfies my need for my engine oil (the emphasis on "my" is not intended to be a self-centered thing, just to indicate it satisfies what I am looking for). In addition, there is the intangible aspect...in a lot of areas of quality of life, I prefer European products...it is purely subjective. For example, if you and I were using oils--mine Euro, yours American--that gave identical UOAs in the same engine, I would pick the Euro oil simply because that is what I like. If you were to pick the American brew, I would respect your choice. Put another way...I believe Lexus, Infinity and Acura are making some stellar autos, in fact, some of the best in the world...there is EVERY reason to buy one of them...despite that fact...I prefer an Audi or BMW or... It is purely my preference NOT an indication of lesser desirability for other buyers or of lesser quality.
"No Walmart within 30 miles."
You'll be thrilled to discover, Pablo, that you are about 21 miles away from the Walmart in Lynnwood, and about 27 from Renton. Now, brush up on your Spanish, and head out....
You'll be thrilled to discover, Pablo, that you are about 21 miles away from the Walmart in Lynnwood, and about 27 from Renton. Now, brush up on your Spanish, and head out....
Blue 99,
I think you summed up my thoughts, exactly. Except I think Havoline has surpassed most other "spot lights" than I have ever seen (excluding GC, of course) - to the point that this forum is drifting away from objective discussions.
I think the moderate prices and tons of moly are what are attracting the Havoline groupies. I'm even going to try it after my next UOA with Pennzoil.
Regarding UOA's - I studied the SM dino UOA's for several brands last night, and I don't see where Havoline is significantly better regarding wear metals and other factors. One poster even had seveal UOA's on his ride comparing Valvoline, Castrol, and Havoline and there wasn't too much to toot a horn to.
Where are all these great UOA's that show Havoline better than the other dino's? Step up to the plate, gentlemen, and show me some objective info.
I think you summed up my thoughts, exactly. Except I think Havoline has surpassed most other "spot lights" than I have ever seen (excluding GC, of course) - to the point that this forum is drifting away from objective discussions.
I think the moderate prices and tons of moly are what are attracting the Havoline groupies. I'm even going to try it after my next UOA with Pennzoil.
Regarding UOA's - I studied the SM dino UOA's for several brands last night, and I don't see where Havoline is significantly better regarding wear metals and other factors. One poster even had seveal UOA's on his ride comparing Valvoline, Castrol, and Havoline and there wasn't too much to toot a horn to.
Where are all these great UOA's that show Havoline better than the other dino's? Step up to the plate, gentlemen, and show me some objective info.
21 miles per the crow flying!! That's a bad mapquest joke.
MarkC - you've been to my house (thanks BTW) - think about driving to Lynnweed from here. It's 15 miles to Kirkland!
Although we did hit the IKEA yesterday. Is that Renton or what? But I think the Wallace World is way further down....and we drove at least 30 miles to IKEA.
MarkC - you've been to my house (thanks BTW) - think about driving to Lynnweed from here. It's 15 miles to Kirkland!
Although we did hit the IKEA yesterday. Is that Renton or what? But I think the Wallace World is way further down....and we drove at least 30 miles to IKEA.
- Status