What qualifies a college grad as an Engineer ???

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Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
The so-called engineer also forgot about the network drops and cabling for the computers and medical equipment (ICU patient monitoring-central nurse station).
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Short presentation on how to become an engineer:

www.ieeeusa.org/careers/files/How%20To%20Become%20A%20PE.ppt

Page 4 of this presentation is the most important as it pertains to the laws of the state in which you want to be called an engineer...

========================================================
"All States have Registration Laws Governing the Practice of Engineering
Most States prohibit persons who are not registered PE’s from:
advertising, using a business card, or otherwise indicating that they are an engineer
practicing, offering to practice or by any implication holding themselves out as qualified to practice as an engineer"
 
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Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Problem is.... lots of folks use the word engineer when they are not a engineer.


Well, on the net, reality is virtual, identity is virtual...believe what you want.
 
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
BITOG community and professional engineers...
Very simple question, what qualifies a college grad to be an engineer ?

Is it a 4 year degree from an accredited college or university....(not DeVry degree mill) ?
Is it a professional state regulated Exam and license that 'officially' you become an engineer ?

Lots of educated folks on BITOG that are engineers such as JHZR2. Please state your area of engineering (speciality) and education. I need to know the difference between the two. I've met people in the past that call themselves an engineer but there is always a gray area in the meaning.

Thanks
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Was Isambard Kingdom Brunel an engineer? What qualifications did he have? I have known many 'qualified engineers' that quite frankly couldn't engineer their way out of a wet paper bag. I have also known a number of outstanding engineers that learned their art from experience, but had no formal qualifications.
 
Engineering is, and has been for some time, an unusual profession. From my own experience as BSEE, working in industry, it seems like a lot of engineers end up working in a discipline far removed from their field of studies. I knew an Industrial Engineer (in charge of production) who's degree was in Chemical. Myself and most of my coworkers that did programming weren't degreed in computer science/engineering (EE's, ME's, Math).

When I graduated in 1983, armed with my full library of National Data Books - I looked forward to designing circuits & products. Only on rare occasions have I gotten to do so - in great part due to the rapid changes in the technology and abundance of similarly educated engineers. This is something young people are never advised about - high school guidance counselors can only describe the "classic" job description and career path.
 
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Problem is.... lots of folks use the word engineer when they are not a engineer.


And in some states, like Minnesota, the use of the word Engineer is not regulated. The use of the term "Professional Engineer" is. Certain types of plans require a professional engineer prepare them.

Rules vary by local jurisdiction.
 
Originally Posted By: Touring5
Engineering is, and has been for some time, an unusual profession. From my own experience as BSEE, working in industry, it seems like a lot of engineers end up working in a discipline far removed from their field of studies. I knew an Industrial Engineer (in charge of production) who's degree was in Chemical. Myself and most of my coworkers that did programming weren't degreed in computer science/engineering (EE's, ME's, Math).

When I graduated in 1983, armed with my full library of National Data Books - I looked forward to designing circuits & products. Only on rare occasions have I gotten to do so - in great part due to the rapid changes in the technology and abundance of similarly educated engineers. This is something young people are never advised about - high school guidance counselors can only describe the "classic" job description and career path.


Yeah but whats the matter with this?

Id argue that EEs are second only to ChEs in terms of aptitude and breadth within the engineering discipline.
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So why shouldn't they be able to grasp and be agile between things theyre doing?

I personally love the fact that I do both ChE and EE.
 
An engineering degree in 4 years at an accredited school means you pretty much can perform the majority of all engineering jobs with some direction. Very few engineers graduate and require no direction.......
 
Originally Posted By: JHZR2

Id argue that EEs are second only to ChEs in terms of aptitude and breadth within the engineering discipline.

I think that ME's and EE's have the most math. ME probably more than EE's. At least they did in my day. 3 years of Calc, Advanced Calc, and DEs. All our courses (ME)...Fluid Flow, Thermo, Turbine/Pump Design, All the basic Electrical equations, Aerosols, Gas Laws. Kinematics...all Calculus from beginning to end. Just an opinion.

My son graduated in Computer engineering 18 years ago and I had as much math as he did.
 
Al,
back in 1989, we solved Finite Element Analysis using matrix manipulation and solving on paper. To not complete an exam question using the variables themselves before solution in the final step was to lose 80% of the mark for that question.

It's different now in that degree, I've had guys who went through the same course same university, just 20 years later, and it's very, very different.

Touring5,
part of the slog of getting an engineering degree is how it rewires your head circuitry if you do it and are committed to it.

I've had job offers from real estate agencies because they've found that type of wiring works for them.

But once you pass, a decent engineer will be very fluid, and have the ability to move in multiple areas.

I'm M.E., had a decade on turbines, 8 years in Construction of power stations and coal handling plants, commissioned an MDF factory, converted an open cut coal mine into an ash land fill from geotech through regulatory approvals, Plant efficiency engineer, and currently in operations management, finding new ways of positioning our fleet in the market.

Detail design was maybe 2-3% of my path so far.
 
So the old Webster definition of an Engineer is, someone that works with engines. It is now a term that has been hijacked into something it was never meant to be. It is a more appropriate word for the train driver than a person that can crunch numbers.
There have been many great inventions and discoveries by non college educated engineers. You have to think about it, what happens in a 4 year degree? The required garbage classes just fill the mind with worthless junk. This guy sums it up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bC9HSP1O7u8
Then when you finally get to the informative classes how do you learn? Does the instructor pull you aside and tutor you personally? I don't think so, you read and study and study some more. Yeah something you could do on your own anyway. Only problem is if you didn't study all the unrelated [censored] in the required beginning classes, your just plain out of luck.
Then there is the problem with people that go in saying I'm going to be an engineer, and have zero previous knowledge or experience in the field they are desiring to enter. Yeah maybe they end up in a desired engineering job, but most in that category, come out knowing little or nothing about what they are suppose to be doing their engineering on, and don't even know the simple basics of the items they are assigned to work on.
Sorry but there are a lot of non degreed engineers that have accomplished as much or more than most degreed engineers.
And besides when it comes to a machinery aspect of engineering, in the end its the machinist and mechanic that really solves the problems, not the engineer because most of them know absolutely nothing about machining and mechanics.
 
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Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: JHZR2

Id argue that EEs are second only to ChEs in terms of aptitude and breadth within the engineering discipline.

I think that ME's and EE's have the most math. ME probably more than EE's. At least they did in my day. 3 years of Calc, Advanced Calc, and DEs. All our courses (ME)...Fluid Flow, Thermo, Turbine/Pump Design, All the basic Electrical equations, Aerosols, Gas Laws. Kinematics...all Calculus from beginning to end. Just an opinion.
After diff. eqns., EE's were required to take vector calculus and after that, electromagnetics, because after that came modulation (propagation of electromagnetic waves). My EM prof was so relaxed and laid back + he could teach. Loved to smoke and drink Cokes. There was a permanent cloud in his office, about 2' down from the ceiling, spread out in all directions.

Caffeine, Nicotine and Carbo's: Necessary to surviving the engineering curriculum! And chocolate.....musn't leave out chocolate....a key survival food, that goes well with the above.
 
Originally Posted By: Exhaustgases
And besides when it comes to a machinery aspect of engineering, in the end its the machinist and mechanic that really solves the problems, not the engineer because most of them know absolutely nothing about machining and mechanics.


Does the chip on your shoulder make it easier to turn corners ?

This was mine...
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3923464/Re:_Fun_with_metallurgy_...

Another case on the same machine, I had to replace the IP turbine inlet nozzle block in a casing that had 0.25" of thermal distortion in the unbolted state, while maintaining 0.030" raadial clearances with the rotating assembly in the bolted state.

The nozzle had to be pressed/rolled into the casing in the unbolted, distorted condition, then as the casing got bolted and resumed it's shape, the nozzle still had to be supported and clamped by the casing, and attain final clearances.

I developed the machining steps to do it.

A machinist, who is now a good mate told me over a beer one day that they all thought that I was barmey, and was going to mess it up, as they couldn't fathom how the shapes changed in 3 dimensions while it would get torqued up.

(bear in mind that the boring bar was around 20' long and machining had to be withing 0.020"

If you don't understand the process, you shouldn't be in engineering.
 
Like the story my dad told me when I was a kid in high school.
He the machinist, working to a drawing with a plus minus, .0001 tolerance on it. The engineer arrives and was wondering how his part was coming, my dad asks does this dimension really need to be this close? The engineer shows a space of about a 1/4 inch between his thumb and finger and says this is good enough.
So then why did he spec .0001 ?
There is no chip on my shoulder.
 
The OP's question has no singular or simple answer as what "qualifies" one as an engineer post graduation is dependent upon the specific area in which they apply and grow their capacity for doing that kind of engineering.
And the use of the word qualify might've had context indicating binary as in "qualified" or "not qualified". "Qualified" has degree which in theory should grow with experience.

Electrical engineering encompasses a very broad range of possible fields of practice many of which are almost exclusive, having little commonality with others falling under the electrical engineering banner, even when working on the same project.

Here is a simple example. One of the many integrated circuits I have designed was computational and associated infrastructure circuitry which implemented an image processing algorithm of significant complexity. The algorithm designer is also an electrical engineer. It was his degree and his experience which qualified him to succeed at this. And it was my degree and experience which allowed me to succeed. We were not interchangeable. But equally qualified to contribute to the same product doing very different things. And I've yet to meet a new graduate from ANY electrical engineering school who could've done either. And I've worked with many graduates from what are considered the finest engineering schools in the country if not the world.
 
A guy once said he was a Chemical Engineer because he was responsible for the dyes and chemicals used at the denim jean factory he worked at.

LOL
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I love this thread, and any others, that bring out many internet chest thumpers -- because they're hilarious.

what's next -- a thread asking about ...... how to wash tomatoes ??
thanks for the laughs, guys.

o.p. -- seriously,you, and the others, forgot the obvious, in seeking an answer to your thread title. just ask engineer20.'nuff said.
 
Originally Posted By: yeti
I love this thread, and any others, that bring out many internet chest thumpers -- because they're hilarious.

what's next -- a thread asking about ...... how to wash tomatoes ??
thanks for the laughs, guys.

o.p. -- seriously,you, and the others, forgot the obvious, in seeking an answer to your thread title. just ask engineer20.'nuff said.


No I didn't:

Originally Posted By: KitaCam
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Problem is.... lots of folks use the word engineer when they are not a engineer.


Well, on the net, reality is virtual, identity is virtual...believe what you want.
 
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