What Fluid for 2001 Corolla CE? (Aisin A245E)

[PerfectGrade]

I have a 2001 Corolla CE with a 4-speed automatic transaxle, the A245E by Aisin, which is in need of a transaxle fluid change. The originally recommended fluid for this transaxle is Dexron-III as per this TSB: http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/2000/Service%20Bulletins/tc001t02%20ATF%20Fluid%20Requirements.pdf Unfortunately as you all know, stock of Dexron-III may be sparse or nonexistent in any store. Another issue that complicates things is this article/blog posting states that Dexron-VI is fully backwards compatible in GM transmissions, but does not mention if this is true for any others which used older Dexron fluids: http://www.sandyblogs.com/techlink/2009/05/dexron-vi.html It also states that licensing for Dexron III had expired back in 2006, and nothing with such a label should be trusted these days. This thread talks about backwards compatibility, and user Ken2 brings up something in regards to non-GM transmission incompatibility: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1217344

Originally Posted By: Ken2

Dexron-VI is certified backwards compatible only in GM's Hydramatic transmissions. It is not backwards compatible in Allison transmissions, and may not be in transmissions of other brands that originally called for Dex-III or Dex-II. Licensed Dexron-III is still being made, only now the spec is called Allison TES-389. I'd fully trust all the unlicensed Dexron products made by any major outfit...Chevron, Mobil, etc.

It wasn’t said in the thread that Aisin transmissions were incompatible with Dexron-VI, but It really leads me to believe that this fluid may only be for GM transmissions. In regards to this thread: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1217344 Toyota T-IV and Dexron III are NOT the same. Neither are the 2000-2002 and 2003+ A245E transaxles. This doesn’t confirm it, but both listed A245E transaxles have different part numbers. TRANSAXLE ASSY, AUTOMATIC, 2001 Corolla CE 30500 1A640 TRANSAXLE ASSY, AUTOMATIC, 2003 Corolla CE 30500 1A790 This may be perhaps due to different engine/transaxle mount locations, but also for change in clutch material. Whatever the case, we will not consider these transaxles to be the same. I have called around, and can only seem to find either the Toyota rebranded Dexron-III, Castrol Synthetic Dexron-VI, and Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF locally. Toyota’s Dexron-III (simply labeled “Toyota ATF”), is plentiful, but very expensive at $13+ per quart, all while still being a standard conventional fluid. Mobil 1’s synthetic ATF and Castrol’s Dexron-VI are $10, and $6.70 respectively. Not only are they cheaper than Toyota’s fluid, but they are fully synthetic fluids as well. What I am unsure of is whether I can actually use anything besides the Toyota fluid in the transaxle without causing a problem. Mobil 1 only has a recent Q&A covering the compatibility of its synthetic ATF with Dexron-III applications: http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Car_Care/AskMobil/Synthetic_ATF_Dexron_III.aspx

Originally Posted By: Mobil1

The new Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF will meet the requirements of Dexron III as the previous formula did. Feel confident to continue using Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF. In the product description we recommend Mobil Dexron-VI ATF for GM vehicles manufactured in 2006 and later. For vehicles older than that, Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF is still a perfect fit.

This once again states it is a fluid approved for GM vehicles which required Dexron-III, but does not specify compatibility with other transmissions which required Dexron-III as well. Here are Castrol’s claims with their fluid: http://www.castrol.com/castrol/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9012227&contentId=7028225

Originally Posted By: Castrol

• Certified and approved by General Motors for all cars and trucks that require DEXRON®–VI. Also satisfies requirements of DEXRON®, DEXRON®–III H, III, IIE, and II.

Once again, it speaks of approval for GM applications for use in transmissions requiring Dexron-VI, but does not specify if the approval for use in Dexron-III transmissions includes anything but GM as well. Just to touch on other fluids I would be able to order online, there are Royal Purple and Amsoil synthetic ATF which others have recommended. Here is Royal Purple’s Max ATF: http://www.royalpurple.com/products/max-atf-automatic-transmission-fluid/# The specifications show that it is compatible with Dexron-IIIF/G/H, but not simply Dexron-III which I believe may be different (can someone please confirm this?) Here is Amsoil’s recommendation chart for transmission fluids: http://www.amsoil.com/products/transmission/transfluid_rec.aspx For Toyota, it only shows recommended fluids for Type T, T-III, T-VI, and Toyota WS fluids, not for Dexron-III used in pre-2003 Aisin transmissions on Toyotas. Amsoil’s specifications for its Synthetic Multi-Vehicle ATF: http://www.amsoil.com/StoreFront/atf.aspx Specifications show it is recommended for GM Dexron-IIIH, but nothing mentioned for normal Dexron-III applications. It even shows it is compatible with Toyota T-III and T-IV applications, which are not a compatible fluid with the transaxle in question. I am aware that Dexron-VI is a less viscous fluid than Dexron-III, as well as a synthetic fluid, and that it shouldn’t cause a problem with use in GM Dexron-III applications because it holds its viscosity better, despite being less viscous to begin with. I just don’t know if any Dexron VI fluid may be used in the Aisin A245E. I have heard many people using the mentioned fluids, among others in their Corollas with the same transaxle. Nothing I have found has proven to be documented with the change, and following up on it. The closest I could find is this DIY thread where user Crowbar911 states that he’s using Dexron-III fluid, when it’s actually Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle ATF, once you see the photo: http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/131-8t...ter-change.html Here’s Castrol’s Import Multi-Vehicle ATF: http://www.castrol.com/castrol/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9012226&contentId=7028224 Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle ATF seems to only list its suitability in applications for GM Dexron-IIIH and prior. He has yet to report a failure with his car’s transaxle after that post in 2007. I don’t have too much money, so spending less than $13/qt. on a conventional fluid would be nice. I would like very much to use a synthetic fluid, as my brother drives this car. My brother does a lot of stop-and-go driving, goes often on long trips, and tends to delay servicing the car. I’m sure it would help reduce the amount of wear and prevent it from getting too hot. I will be doing a drain-and-fill at first so I can at least get rid of the old stuff that’s been sloshing around in his box for a while, but just a little down the road actually drop the pan so I can clean that, the screen, and the magnets. Can anyone shine any light on ANYTHING?

 

[phenix78_99]

I have been registered here for a while and only post when I can add something to the thread. That being said, this is what you want for your trans: http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/atd.aspx Please read the product description and see that it meets the Dexron III spec your trans calls for in your car. It is a syn which you wanted, and it's service life is fantastic, so you get your money's worth. BTW I am not a sponsor or salesman, so if you wisely decide this is for you, look Pablo up here. I use AMSOIL products with success, though.

 

[PerfectGrade]

Thanks for your reply, phenix78_99. I checked out the Amsoil's Torque Drive Synthetic ATF, and while it does meet Dexron-IIIH requirements, it is rather expensive at just over $15/qt even through Pablo's referral. I however appreciate the recommendation. I have also become aware that any Dexron-III with a letter suffix (such as "H") is actually a revision of Dexron-III made for all Dexron-III applications. I will edit the OP later in order to reflect this. I have also come to think while how most, if not all ATF labels stating that their fluids are suitable for applications requiring Dexron-III in GM vehicles, does it mean it should be suitable in non-GM vehicles calling for Dexron-III fluids regardless? I am beginning to lean towards just trying a drain and fill without dropping the pan using Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF. The fluid in the transaxle right now is just whatever the last shop put in. I cannot confirm if it's multi-vehicle or Dexron III or later, or conventional or synthetic. Will this cause a problem?

 

[weebl]

The first post in this thread talks about DexII, and alternataives, albeit in context of Allison transmissions in GM trucks: http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=302701 Still, I think you may be able to gain something of benefit here. This is what I took from it: 1. Dexron III(h) is no longer licenced by GM. 2. A licenced fluid can generally be accepted as meeting the standard, and will satisfy warranty requirements. 3. A non-licenced fluid may claim to meet the specs, but it is up to you as the consumer to trust (or not trust) the claim of the marketer. For vehicles under warranty, it won't satisfy warranty requirements. 4. A TES-389 licenced fuild will pass the minimum standards that were used to licence Dexron III(h) when it existed. Your vehicle is not under warranty, therefore that is not an issue. It comes down to you being able to trust the company you are buying the fluid from. A major brand would be one I personally feel comfortable trusting (but I would personally tend to shy away from a multi-vehicle formulation). Alternately, there is the TES-389 standard that still exists and would give you a suitable fluid as well.

 

[PerfectGrade]

Weebl, thank you for the link. It contained a lot of the information I was wondering about. Since the Dexron-III standard was set purely by fluid performance, and not by content, maybe any newer Dexron fluid should work. I've decided that I'm going to go with Castrol Transmax Dexron-VI for a drain and fill because it's cheaper than Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF and readily available. Not to mention it's not a multi-vehicle formulation which you said you tend to shy away from as well. Castrol is also a name I think I can trust. I'm going to see how that goes, and report back on whether it works or has adverse effects on the car's operation. If it doesn't end up working, maybe something meeting TES-389 might be something to try. Thanks again, weebl.

 

[wiswind]

I have a 2003 Sienna that calls for a Dexron III for the transmsision. I have Redline D4 ATF in there right now. I would also have confidence in the Amsoil, Mobil 1 ATF, Royal Purple....and a number of other Synthetic fluids that are listed as being good for vehicles that call for the Dexron III specification. A synthetic fluid will give you improved heat tolerance (heat is the main cause of ATF breakdown) and much improved cold flow performance. The Asin transmissions seem to be pretty reliable.

 

[Twisty_Bits]

I have been running Dex VI fluid in my 1997 Toyota Avalon Aisin transmission calling for Dex II for about 4 years. Shifts very well with out any problems.

 

[phATL]

PerfectGrade, I'm interested to know what type of fluid you ended up going with and how it turned out - any noticable issues/problems or is it smooth shifting? I, too, am having trouble finding regular old Dexron III and and looking for a replacement that will work will with my 1999 Camry. I am considering Valvoline MaxLife (http://www.valvoline.com/products/consum...ission-fluid/37) which is a DexronVI synthetic fluid and the label says it can be used in Dexron III applications (specifically, GM Dexron III applications). But before moving forward, I would like more peace of mind that Dexron VI is indeed backwards compatible with Toyota Dexron III applications and won't cause any major issues. Many thanks!