What could have caused this?

wtd

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2,753
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southwest Mo.
My fiance's son owns a 2014 F150 with the 5.0L that has 196,000 miles on it that he bought new. He works for the railroad and travels for his job thus the high mileage but most of the mileage is highway miles.

This truck had been totally trouble free until about 190,000 miles when he started getting a slight tapping noise in the engine at certain rpms. He took it to an independent shop and they determined it was the cam phasers. He had Motorcraft cam phasers installed and at the same time had an aftermarket timing chain kit installed. Noise in the engine is now gone and the truck runs fine with no CEL.

So fast forward to last week and about 5,000 miles later, he is out of town for work and his truck starts running like crap and the CEL comes on and it feels like it's missing. He takes it to Autozone and they read the codes. One is a P032 and the other is a P0019. P032 is a cylinder 2 misfire and P0019 has to do with the cam position sensor on bank 2. He only has a couple of days left until he comes home so he keeps driving it.

He comes home and takes it back to the shop who did the repair and they don't know what is wrong. Someone(not the shop) had convinced him that the problem was a bad fuel injector on cylinder 2 so he had the shop install a new injector.

Of coarse that doesn't fix anything so he replaces the plugs which are the original ones and of coarse that doesn't fix the misfire. They also moved the coil pack around and the misfire is still in cylinder 2.

He has me put the truck on my scanner and it still shows the two codes I mentioned before but now had a P0018 code which had to do with the other cam position sensor on the same bank. Truck is idling very rough and you can tell it's misfiring. I tell him it's possible he has a compression problem in cylinder 2 since they have done and replaced pretty much everything for that cylinder. He makes an appointment at the local Ford dealer and they look at it and tell him he needs a new engine to the tune of about $9,600 and that he has low compression in four cylinders. He brought the truck home and said he is not spending the money to replace the engine. He had to go back out on the road for work so nothing has been done to the truck to verify if the compression is in fact bad. He took a different vehicle so his truck is just sitting.

So I have a few questions. If the dealer's diagnosis is correct, what could have caused this compression issue on what is supposedly a pretty durable engine. The entire time he has owned it, he has changed the oil using the OLM which usually tells him to change between 9-10 K miles. He always uses Motorcraft 5W-20. 98% of the miles on the truck has been long distance highway miles. Do you think that the long oil changes with the 5W20 oil could be the cause?

Could the cam position sensor issue have caused some type of damage to the engine resulting in low compression?

Could driving it with the misfire have caused the low compression in such a short time? Only cylinder 2 shows a misfire on the scanner. He didn't tell me if the dealer had told him what cylinders had the supposedly low compression.

What could be the cause of the P0018 & P0019 codes? Something in the original repair that went bad?



Thanks.
 
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18,168
Location
NH
Only the dealership ran a compression test? Did you get the numbers? I'd think a used engine could be swapped in by an independent for much less than the dealership. One cylinder to suddenly go low is surprising but not unheard of (chipped valve or sticky valve or the like). But to have 4 go out? I wonder if three are borderline. Any chance they are all on the same bank?
 
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down in the park
I think its an engine timing issue, maybe a cam phaser stuck or the timing is genuinely off. Possibly related to the earlier repair. I'd definitely be checking the timing first thing.
 
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3,322
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USA
Yes get the compression numbers or do a compression test yourself. If all the cylinders on one side have low compression and the other 4 are good, I'd suspect that cam is way out of time.
 
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15,575
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Santa Barbara, CA
Sounds like the engine was not properly timed when it was reassembled. Ford probably didn't do a physical compression test, they just do a relative compression and power balance test using the IDS. That would explain the cam sensor fault.
 
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Phila, PA
I agree recheck compression on all cylinders and take it from there. I would be looking more closely at the valve train. If you added 5000 miles since the previous repairs I think it is unlikely anything was done wrong.
 
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wtd

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southwest Mo.
This is the timing chain kit he bought. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078T2G134/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 The truck was at the dealer yesterday and he left last night to go back to work so I don't have any details on where the low compression cylinders were. I will text him and see if he knows. If the timing wasn't set up correctly after the repair, wouldn't that have shown up immediately instead of 5,000 miles later? No one else has done a compression check on the truck yet. He gets back into town Thursday night and is getting married on Sat so there will be no time to mess with the truck until probably next week. I'm not sure when he goes back to work.
 

wtd

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southwest Mo.
He just texted me back and it is all on one bank. Cylinders 1-4 had low compression. They said cylinder 4 was the worst. The thing that puzzles me is that the low compression is in bank 1 but the cam sensor codes are in bank 2. Why would that be?
 
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wtd

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Originally Posted by zfasts03
Were cam sprockets replaced, I don't see them as part of the kit? I bet one bank/cam jumped time.
No, the only things that were replaced that were not in that kit were the cam phasers.
 

wtd

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southwest Mo.
Originally Posted by bdcardinal
Sounds like the engine was not properly timed when it was reassembled. Ford probably didn't do a physical compression test, they just do a relative compression and power balance test using the IDS. That would explain the cam sensor fault.
You are right, they only did a relative compression test. Here are the results. Cyl 1 is 8%, 2 is 9%, 3 is 13%, 4 is 16%, 5 is 0%, 6 is0%, 7 is 0%, and 8 is 0%.
 
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3,322
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Isn't 5-6-7-8 bank 2? I wouldn't put a lot of faith in a misfire code identifying the exact cylinder when the whole engine is running real badly. Other tests like compression and cylinder drop should be done.
 
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15,575
Location
Santa Barbara, CA
I would be weary of using anything except the OEM or MMR secondary chain tensionors. The MMR ones for the Coyote are better for high RPM applications, same as their billet tensionor arms. I am willing to bet one of the chains for the low compression bank jumped a tooth, possibly due to a bad tensionor. The Coyote engine is an interference engine, not sure how much of a cushion is there for a bad timing event. You can possibly re-time and go, but there is a chance there are valves bent.
 
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1,818
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RI
I would verify valve timing before anything else. If correct a physical compression test needs to be done. You're crazy putting that timing set in that engine.
 
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