What are the true dangers in using non OEM coolants?

[N Heat]

And I dont mean mixing or topping off. I mean replacing the factory coolant after a thorough drain and flush.
I ask this question as a believer in Supertech/Peak clone coolant for close to 20 years. Im a person that tends to keep vehicles for 15 to 20 years and would feel like a failure if I couldnt get at least 200k without major issue. Ive dumped the factory coolant on numerous vehicles and filled with a mix of Supertech and distilled water for years without issue (that I can see). Some I still own. In particular, my 2002 Suburban, has 277k on it and has had a drain and fill every 3 years.

I say all of that to say this...I stared under the hood of our 2012 4runner today and could not pull the trigger on flushing the pretty pink coolant. I think Im having a change of heart. I dont know much about HOATS OATS or POATS or anyrhing else in these types of coolants, but theres obviously reasons why they call for specific formulas.

So what are the risks if the Toyota 4.0 doesnt play well with the Supertech? Ruined gaskets? Corrosion? Have I just been lucky and avoided issues thus far? This vehicle will be my daily driver for the next 10 years hopefully. At this point Im almost convinced to forget about the Supertech and go with the Toyota SLL.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

You can use Zerex Asian with no problem

You want to avoid anything with 2-EHA, which is a plasticizer that eats gaskets

That is Dexcool's key ingredient and the reason it's called Deathcool

Most "all makes all models" coolants have 2-EHA, including all of Prestone's (even the ones labeled for Honda/Toyota/European, in th elittle half-gallon bottle at Walmart)

Peak Global Lifetime is safe. Their new 10x coolant is also ok. Their OET is probably OK.

 

[SR5]

I had a Honda CBR600 with liquid cooled 4-cylinder engine. I changed the coolant about every 2nd year. A full DI water flush every time.

I used IAT, OAT and HOAT, whatever grabbed my fancy at the time.

A decade on, all shiny on the inside and never any leaks. Original tubes and gaskets, nothing changed.

Settled on G05 HOAT for the bike and Dexcool OAT for the car.

If your system is good, and you do a full flush, I've not had a problem swapping between coolants.

 

[dafish]

Man I wish this forum had a "like this post" button just so I could show appreciation for slacktide's insight.

Guess this will have to do:

THANKS!!

 

[FCD]

Just don't use anything with 2-Eha in a cooling system not made for it.
Anything else is usually ok

 

[CharBaby]

Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
You can use Zerex Asian with no problem

You want to avoid anything with 2-EHA, which is a plasticizer that eats gaskets

That is Dexcool's key ingredient and the reason it's called Deathcool

Most "all makes all models" coolants have 2-EHA, including all of Prestone's (even the ones labeled for Honda/Toyota/European, in th elittle half-gallon bottle at Walmart)

Peak Global Lifetime is safe. Their new 10x coolant is also ok. Their OET is probably OK.


Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
Just don't use anything with 2-Eha in a cooling system not made for it.
Anything else is usually ok


Good info!

 

[Sayjac]

Using "non OEM" which means using aftermarket AF, not an issue by itself. Using an aftermarket AF that's not the same as OE/OEM "type", could/might be. As noted, 2eha an inhibitor found in DexCool and the universal dexclones. By the latter I mean those universal AF that contain/use 2eha which is the majority including ST and Peak "Long Life" . The previously mentioned Peak Global Lifetime (PGL) and their new 10X AF are exceptions.

If you want to know the potential issues with 2eha, they are discussed in this post which comes from the SAE paper linked on the topic. The relevant section on 2eha is italicized in the post.

In this case, certainly using Toyota SLL pink from the dealer an option, if not the least expensive one. Right now though Valvoline/Zerex Asian AF red tint at WM for ~$12.50/gal seems the best option in same as oem Asian PHoat AF type.

I would add, if a vehicle specs DexCool now, then I'd have no problem using it in those vehicles.

 

[joekingcorvette]

I have used different types in different vehicles for years without any problems. I always keep it nice and clean looking.

 

[Gebo]

Somewhere I saw a pdf of the chemical analysis of 4 different coolants. I was amazed at how different the Toyota OEM was from the others. There was an abundance of Molydenum (over 1000 ppm) and Phosporus Silver and Tin as compared to the others. It also had a very high Sodium Titanium level. But the molydenum level was through the roof. Only one other brand had any molydenum and it was 2 ppm.

I don't know what damage other coolants could do as I only use Toyota Red and Pink. I don't see any reason to experiment as it has a different formulation.

 

[Sayjac]

Quote
Somewhere I saw a pdf of the chemical analysis of 4 different coolants. I was amazed at how different the Toyota OEM was from the others. There was an abundance of Molydenum (over 1000 ppm) and Phosporus Silver and Tin as compared to the others. It also had a very high Sodium Titanium level. But the molydenum level was through the roof. Only one other brand had any molydenum and it was 2 ppm..
Ummm, sounds like you're referencing an ATF analysis, not an AF analysis which is the topic. I can't recall seeing molybdenum, tin or the others mentioned in a Coolant analysis. Whatever it is, certainly not any Asian Phoat AF that I'm aware of.

 

[Gebo]

No, I'm no mistaken

It was Toyota Red

I'll see if I can find it and post it

 

[Sayjac]

I'd like to see the referenced comparison of "four different coolants" including Toyota OEM and the specific "Molydenum" and "Tin" reference. Also standard AF analyses done by PQIA can be found in the link.

https://pqia.org/antifreeze-coolant/

Just looking at a few I don't see mention of any of those ingredients in any. However as AFs use ethylene glycol and inhibitors I wouldn't expect to.

 

[Gebo]

I printed it some time ago and gave a copy to my son-in-law. Hopefully I saved one for you.

 

[Sayjac]

Hopefully you can find the print source and link it. Otherwise 'for me', unsubstantiated hearsay.

 

[FCD]

Originally Posted by Sayjac
Quote
Somewhere I saw a pdf of the chemical analysis of 4 different coolants. I was amazed at how different the Toyota OEM was from the others. There was an abundance of Molydenum (over 1000 ppm) and Phosporus Silver and Tin as compared to the others. It also had a very high Sodium Titanium level. But the molydenum level was through the roof. Only one other brand had any molydenum and it was 2 ppm..
Ummm, sounds like you're referencing an ATF analysis, not an AF analysis which is the topic. I can't recall seeing molybdenum, tin or the others mentioned in a Coolant analysis. Whatever it is, certainly not any Asian Phoat AF that I'm aware of.


Molybdenum in a coolant can be found as Molybdate is used as a corrosion inhibitor in some coolants.
Tin can also be found as it is used in solder such as that used in older all metal radiators.

 

[Sayjac]

Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
….Molybdenum in a coolant can be found as Molybdate is used as a corrosion inhibitor in some coolants.
Tin can also be found as it is used in solder such as that used in older all metal radiators.
Of course in a "Virgin" AF analysis which is what is being referenced here, Tin from a radiator would NOT show up in that analysis. And the specific reference is "molybdenum" in the analysis, not molybdate.

That said, without the specific " chemical analysis" of four AF comparison all a moot point, and hearsay to this point.
.

 

[Gebo]

Originally Posted by Sayjac
Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
….Molybdenum in a coolant can be found as Molybdate is used as a corrosion inhibitor in some coolants.
Tin can also be found as it is used in solder such as that used in older all metal radiators.
Of course in a "Virgin" AF analysis which is what is being referenced here, Tin from a radiator would NOT show up in that analysis. And the specific reference is "molybdenum" in the analysis, not molybdate.

That said, without the specific " chemical analysis" of four AF comparison all a moot point, and hearsay to this point.
.




Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
Originally Posted by Sayjac
Quote
Somewhere I saw a pdf of the chemical analysis of 4 different coolants. I was amazed at how different the Toyota OEM was from the others. There was an abundance of Molydenum (over 1000 ppm) and Phosporus Silver and Tin as compared to the others. It also had a very high Sodium Titanium level. But the molydenum level was through the roof. Only one other brand had any molydenum and it was 2 ppm..
Ummm, sounds like you're referencing an ATF analysis, not an AF analysis which is the topic. I can't recall seeing molybdenum, tin or the others mentioned in a Coolant analysis. Whatever it is, certainly not any Asian Phoat AF that I'm aware of.


Molybdenum in a coolant can be found as Molybdate is used as a corrosion inhibitor in some coolants.
Tin can also be found as it is used in solder such as that used in older all metal radiators.


FordCapriDriver, you will be proven correct. I promise. The doubting Thomas will get edumicated.

 

[Sayjac]

Who's Thomas?

Edumicated? You know what's said about talk? Tick tock.

 

[Gebo]

Well, you shall have what you asked for...BOOM

 

[Gebo]

Sayjac, I fully expect you to argue and disagree and point out issues with this analysis. I will not respond as I will let the pdf speak for itself.