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+1 You're prematurely aging your engine with every mile that you drive with coolant at that temp.
Warm-up rate for larger engines
- Thread starter rationull
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Yes, change the thermostat. You engine is more efficient at a higher temperature.
Thermostats are like spark plugs, they're so cheap if you're going to go through the trouble to pull one out you may as well put a new one in, IMO.
I like the stant "superstat" heavy duty. For something so vital for your machine's longevity and economy, many makers really cheap out these things.
I like the stant "superstat" heavy duty. For something so vital for your machine's longevity and economy, many makers really cheap out these things.
Thanks, I'll replace it this weekend then. Is there any compelling reason to go with an OEM thermostat over a stant superstat? The superstat will be a little more convenient to get what with dealership parts counters closing pretty early.
I think my Freestar takes a long time to warm up. I replaced the thermostat which helped a little. Our Jeep 4.0 and my 03 Civic warm up very quickly.
Friend with 350 chevy in a 1/2 ton has the EXACT same performance as original post describes. We tried 2 new thermostats and see the exact same thing. Sits around 160 lightly driven, but reaches ~190-200 when towing. All 3 t-stats were 195.
Keep in mind-- newer vehicles buffer the temp gauge reading. Our 02 accord would have the exact same warmup time regardless of season, per the gauge. Yet, that full climate heat output did NOT follow the gauge at all... took much longer to reach full heat at the vents than at the gauge. I think the gauge was scaled in the electronics for the normal temp position to be anything that wasn't too cold or too hot...so that needle never, ever moved. Was almost like it was on a "warmup timer."
M
Keep in mind-- newer vehicles buffer the temp gauge reading. Our 02 accord would have the exact same warmup time regardless of season, per the gauge. Yet, that full climate heat output did NOT follow the gauge at all... took much longer to reach full heat at the vents than at the gauge. I think the gauge was scaled in the electronics for the normal temp position to be anything that wasn't too cold or too hot...so that needle never, ever moved. Was almost like it was on a "warmup timer."
M
My Chevrolet does not appear to be buffered. It definitely takes longer to warm up some times vs. others. If you shut it off hot and then turn it back on a few minutes later, you can visibly see the heat soak effect in the dash gauge. When idling for a long time at a stop light, you can see the temperature raise a notch or two on the gauge before the fan comes on, then you can watch it come back down. I'd imagine the original poster's Chevy behaves the same way.
Hmm, interesting. I'm not sure whether the dash gauge is buffered or not, as I was watching my scangauge (which I assume is fed from the actual coolant temp sensor and not the gauge sender, based on behavior I've seen in my civic). I bought a 195 degree superstat from Napa today and will put it in this weekend, perhaps with a coolant flush. I guess we'll find out whether the new t-stat will make a difference or whether I'll see the same behavior as meep's friend did.
Ha, seems that my car (92 Acura Legend) just finally starts to blow some nice hot heat when I get home after a 15-20 minute mixed highway/light stop and go run. Oh, wait. When it's 0 degrees F outside, it takes awhile! This time of year around here, you have to drive for an hour before the cabin gets toasty.
Who knew draining the coolant could be such a pain? A radiator drain plug and a bottom hose that are not accessible from the bottom without some kind of strangely shaped wrench? A radiator drain that goes directly onto frame parts causing coolant to spill out in no fewer than 4 small streams at various points along the driver's side of the front end? But I digress.
I took out the thermostat yesterday and found exactly the same thing I was planning to put in, a 195 degree stant superstat. I was discouraged, but put the new one in anyway. Took it for a drive today and it's much better! Heated up to 198 within 4 miles on the freeway and stayed there. I guess the old thermostat was bad, even though it wasn't a 160 like I thought it was.
Thanks for the help, everyone!
I took out the thermostat yesterday and found exactly the same thing I was planning to put in, a 195 degree stant superstat. I was discouraged, but put the new one in anyway. Took it for a drive today and it's much better! Heated up to 198 within 4 miles on the freeway and stayed there. I guess the old thermostat was bad, even though it wasn't a 160 like I thought it was.
Thanks for the help, everyone!
(Cool!! Doug Hilary back!)
I only ever owned big V8's. The rule of thumb that is satisfactory is 15 miles at 45 mph or better to reach a stable temp; preferably 30 miles of driving to burn off the junk that accumulates from sitting and a cold start. That is a FULL warm-up on all components (greases, oils, coolant, etc).
Just obtaining heater temps is not enough. This was more noticeable on a carburated car than on the modern EFI ones.
Try a diesel: Seven gallon cooling system AND that they run cooler than a gasoline motor.
I only ever owned big V8's. The rule of thumb that is satisfactory is 15 miles at 45 mph or better to reach a stable temp; preferably 30 miles of driving to burn off the junk that accumulates from sitting and a cold start. That is a FULL warm-up on all components (greases, oils, coolant, etc).
Just obtaining heater temps is not enough. This was more noticeable on a carburated car than on the modern EFI ones.
Try a diesel: Seven gallon cooling system AND that they run cooler than a gasoline motor.
Originally Posted By: rationull
Who knew draining the coolant could be such a pain? A radiator drain plug and a bottom hose that are not accessible from the bottom without some kind of strangely shaped wrench? A radiator drain that goes directly onto frame parts causing coolant to spill out in no fewer than 4 small streams at various points along the driver's side of the front end? But I digress.
I took out the thermostat yesterday and found exactly the same thing I was planning to put in, a 195 degree stant superstat. I was discouraged, but put the new one in anyway. Took it for a drive today and it's much better! Heated up to 198 within 4 miles on the freeway and stayed there. I guess the old thermostat was bad, even though it wasn't a 160 like I thought it was.
Thanks for the help, everyone!
Glad to see this worked out for you...I experienced very similar symptoms on a 98 Volvo. Pulled the thermostat and found it broken (the bracket was severed!). The car was only 4 years old at the time and I was hotter than the coolant got that's for sure!
Who knew draining the coolant could be such a pain? A radiator drain plug and a bottom hose that are not accessible from the bottom without some kind of strangely shaped wrench? A radiator drain that goes directly onto frame parts causing coolant to spill out in no fewer than 4 small streams at various points along the driver's side of the front end? But I digress.
I took out the thermostat yesterday and found exactly the same thing I was planning to put in, a 195 degree stant superstat. I was discouraged, but put the new one in anyway. Took it for a drive today and it's much better! Heated up to 198 within 4 miles on the freeway and stayed there. I guess the old thermostat was bad, even though it wasn't a 160 like I thought it was.
Thanks for the help, everyone!
Glad to see this worked out for you...I experienced very similar symptoms on a 98 Volvo. Pulled the thermostat and found it broken (the bracket was severed!). The car was only 4 years old at the time and I was hotter than the coolant got that's for sure!
after about two minutes my carburarated car is more peppy when cold, not so after fully warmed up
Originally Posted By: TheTanSedan
Try a diesel: Seven gallon cooling system AND that they run cooler than a gasoline motor.
Can't agree to that, Diesel engines run at almost the same temp as their Gasoline counterparts. Sometimes a little hotter, sometimes a little cooler based on design.
The middle ground is usually 190F, problem with diesel though is in order to sufficiently heat the next combustion event they must pull heat away from the engine to do so which usually means in cold weather a very legnthy warm-up time.
Another thing is since they make such little waste heat in this respect(especially turbocharged) that keeping that heat in for the user can be a challenge. One reason semi-truckers in cold weather climates use the grill covers. Coasting down a long hill or even sitting in traffic with the heat going full blast you can watch the temp gauge start to drop. A larger cooling system helps to buffer this though. It has nothing to do with a bad thermostat either.
TDI had an average car-sized cooling system and it would lose heat easily in the winter coasting down a long hill especially if the driver was cold!
Try a diesel: Seven gallon cooling system AND that they run cooler than a gasoline motor.
Can't agree to that, Diesel engines run at almost the same temp as their Gasoline counterparts. Sometimes a little hotter, sometimes a little cooler based on design.
The middle ground is usually 190F, problem with diesel though is in order to sufficiently heat the next combustion event they must pull heat away from the engine to do so which usually means in cold weather a very legnthy warm-up time.
Another thing is since they make such little waste heat in this respect(especially turbocharged) that keeping that heat in for the user can be a challenge. One reason semi-truckers in cold weather climates use the grill covers. Coasting down a long hill or even sitting in traffic with the heat going full blast you can watch the temp gauge start to drop. A larger cooling system helps to buffer this though. It has nothing to do with a bad thermostat either.
TDI had an average car-sized cooling system and it would lose heat easily in the winter coasting down a long hill especially if the driver was cold!
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Thermo1223
Originally Posted By: TheTanSedan
Try a diesel: Seven gallon cooling system AND that they run cooler than a gasoline motor.
Can't agree to that, Diesel engines run at almost the same temp as their Gasoline counterparts. Sometimes a little hotter, sometimes a little cooler based on design.
The middle ground is usually 190F, problem with diesel though is in order to sufficiently heat the next combustion event they must pull heat away from the engine to do so which usually means in cold weather a very legnthy warm-up time.
Another thing is since they make such little waste heat in this respect(especially turbocharged) that keeping that heat in for the user can be a challenge. One reason semi-truckers in cold weather climates use the grill covers. Coasting down a long hill or even sitting in traffic with the heat going full blast you can watch the temp gauge start to drop. A larger cooling system helps to buffer this though. It has nothing to do with a bad thermostat either.
TDI had an average car-sized cooling system and it would lose heat easily in the winter coasting down a long hill especially if the driver was cold!
You made my argument for me. Takes very little for a diesel to lose heat. At idle they lose it far too fast, and pretty well won't warm up after a cold start (even an hour or more) unless under way and under load. By contrast gas motors are notorious for overheating in prolonged idle or stop-and-go situations.
What I should have said, perhaps, is that just idling along, commuting to work is not enough to really warm up pickup diesel.
Originally Posted By: TheTanSedan
Try a diesel: Seven gallon cooling system AND that they run cooler than a gasoline motor.
Can't agree to that, Diesel engines run at almost the same temp as their Gasoline counterparts. Sometimes a little hotter, sometimes a little cooler based on design.
The middle ground is usually 190F, problem with diesel though is in order to sufficiently heat the next combustion event they must pull heat away from the engine to do so which usually means in cold weather a very legnthy warm-up time.
Another thing is since they make such little waste heat in this respect(especially turbocharged) that keeping that heat in for the user can be a challenge. One reason semi-truckers in cold weather climates use the grill covers. Coasting down a long hill or even sitting in traffic with the heat going full blast you can watch the temp gauge start to drop. A larger cooling system helps to buffer this though. It has nothing to do with a bad thermostat either.
TDI had an average car-sized cooling system and it would lose heat easily in the winter coasting down a long hill especially if the driver was cold!
You made my argument for me. Takes very little for a diesel to lose heat. At idle they lose it far too fast, and pretty well won't warm up after a cold start (even an hour or more) unless under way and under load. By contrast gas motors are notorious for overheating in prolonged idle or stop-and-go situations.
What I should have said, perhaps, is that just idling along, commuting to work is not enough to really warm up pickup diesel.
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My car`s 3 liter V6 (iron block) takes about 10 minutes to reach full operating temp. Gauge always stays a bit below the halfway point. Has a pretty cool running engine. Must have a good/efficient cooling system. Something I notice is that it actually runs cooler on the hottest days of summer in stop and go traffic.
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