So, let's say your vehicle is spec'd for a 5W30 or 0W20......but you live and only drive in a warm climate, perhaps Miami or Los Angeles or Las Vegas. Would you bump the "cold" number up a bit? For 5W30, I'm temped to go 10W30. Reasonable?
Warm/Hot climate- tighten the viscosity spread?
- Thread starter lomez
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yeah if you want to double the start up wear.If its spec'd for 0w20 or 5w30 use 5w30 if it makes you feel better.
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Originally Posted By: cknight49090
yeah if you want to double the start up wear.
that makes no sense....fyi. If a 5 flows adequately at 0 f. A 10 flows probably much much much more at 50 f. Thus, less wear just after startup, as the film is there, but its strength is greater.
yeah if you want to double the start up wear.
that makes no sense....fyi. If a 5 flows adequately at 0 f. A 10 flows probably much much much more at 50 f. Thus, less wear just after startup, as the film is there, but its strength is greater.
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why would you use 10w30 in something spec'd for 0w20 that doesn't make sense.
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
so, you're saying that a 5W30 flows more at 0 f. than a 10W30 does at 50 f.? Doubt that.
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
so, you're saying that a 5W30 flows more at 0 f. than a 10W30 does at 50 f.? Doubt that.
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you just want to argue huh have you read motor oil university cause I did !
Originally Posted By: cknight49090
you just want to argue huh have you read motor oil university cause I did !
actually, you don't have a clue what you're talking about. I'll wait for a response from someone who does. But thanks for the snarky response (which was completely incorrect) in the beginning.
you just want to argue huh have you read motor oil university cause I did !
actually, you don't have a clue what you're talking about. I'll wait for a response from someone who does. But thanks for the snarky response (which was completely incorrect) in the beginning.
never said I would. I said 5W30 to 10W30
Originally Posted By: lomez
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
incorrect. it has to do with flow at low temps. If low temps are not present....you can go higher.
Low temperature is sorta under 200 degrees. It's a 30 weight at operating temperature which can range from 200-300 depending on how hot you operate the car. As most wear occurs at start up which is below operating temperature, you're going to wear the engine down quicker using a thicker than recommended oil. Read the motor oil university article available from the home page. He sorta makes the point that in general a thinner oil is better than a thicker one unless you're going racing and most people aren't racing. So stop trying to out think engineers that spend millions designing engines and putting something else in that they didn't really have in mind.
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
incorrect. it has to do with flow at low temps. If low temps are not present....you can go higher.
Low temperature is sorta under 200 degrees. It's a 30 weight at operating temperature which can range from 200-300 depending on how hot you operate the car. As most wear occurs at start up which is below operating temperature, you're going to wear the engine down quicker using a thicker than recommended oil. Read the motor oil university article available from the home page. He sorta makes the point that in general a thinner oil is better than a thicker one unless you're going racing and most people aren't racing. So stop trying to out think engineers that spend millions designing engines and putting something else in that they didn't really have in mind.
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
So stop trying to out thinkengineers CAFE mandates and putting something else in that CAFE didn't really have in mind.
So stop trying to out think
Originally Posted By: lomez
For 5W30, I'm temped to go 10W30. Reasonable?
Yes, preferred actually. Some here will never admit 10-30 is a great choice in hot climates and that the "0" or "5" is all but irrelevent in hot temps.
For 5W30, I'm temped to go 10W30. Reasonable?
Yes, preferred actually. Some here will never admit 10-30 is a great choice in hot climates and that the "0" or "5" is all but irrelevent in hot temps.
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: lomez
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
incorrect. it has to do with flow at low temps. If low temps are not present....you can go higher.
Low temperature is sorta under 200 degrees. It's a 30 weight at operating temperature which can range from 200-300 depending on how hot you operate the car. As most wear occurs at start up which is below operating temperature, you're going to wear the engine down quicker using a thicker than recommended oil. Read the motor oil university article available from the home page. He sorta makes the point that in general a thinner oil is better than a thicker one unless you're going racing and most people aren't racing. So stop trying to out think engineers that spend millions designing engines and putting something else in that they didn't really have in mind.
Exactly!!!! This was my point in more detail. You don't have to live where it's -40 degrees for a 0w to be of benefit over a 5w....a 0w is usually gonna flow better than a 5 wt even if it's 50 degrees outside.
I have 2 used oil analysis with a 0w20 that shows extremely low wear metals over 10k oil changes. I live in NC and it's pretty hot here
No point in using a thicker w weight unless it's needed
Originally Posted By: lomez
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
incorrect. it has to do with flow at low temps. If low temps are not present....you can go higher.
Low temperature is sorta under 200 degrees. It's a 30 weight at operating temperature which can range from 200-300 depending on how hot you operate the car. As most wear occurs at start up which is below operating temperature, you're going to wear the engine down quicker using a thicker than recommended oil. Read the motor oil university article available from the home page. He sorta makes the point that in general a thinner oil is better than a thicker one unless you're going racing and most people aren't racing. So stop trying to out think engineers that spend millions designing engines and putting something else in that they didn't really have in mind.
Exactly!!!! This was my point in more detail. You don't have to live where it's -40 degrees for a 0w to be of benefit over a 5w....a 0w is usually gonna flow better than a 5 wt even if it's 50 degrees outside.
I have 2 used oil analysis with a 0w20 that shows extremely low wear metals over 10k oil changes. I live in NC and it's pretty hot here
No point in using a thicker w weight unless it's needed
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So just because it don't get down to 0 degrees the 0wt or 5wt will be no benefit???
This is interesting to watch
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: lomez
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
incorrect. it has to do with flow at low temps. If low temps are not present....you can go higher.
Low temperature is sorta under 200 degrees. It's a 30 weight at operating temperature which can range from 200-300 depending on how hot you operate the car. As most wear occurs at start up which is below operating temperature, you're going to wear the engine down quicker using a thicker than recommended oil. Read the motor oil university article available from the home page. He sorta makes the point that in general a thinner oil is better than a thicker one unless you're going racing and most people aren't racing. So stop trying to out think engineers that spend millions designing engines and putting something else in that they didn't really have in mind.
But the person who wrote oil university is a heart surgeon not an engineer. Isn't he?
Originally Posted By: lomez
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
incorrect. it has to do with flow at low temps. If low temps are not present....you can go higher.
Low temperature is sorta under 200 degrees. It's a 30 weight at operating temperature which can range from 200-300 depending on how hot you operate the car. As most wear occurs at start up which is below operating temperature, you're going to wear the engine down quicker using a thicker than recommended oil. Read the motor oil university article available from the home page. He sorta makes the point that in general a thinner oil is better than a thicker one unless you're going racing and most people aren't racing. So stop trying to out think engineers that spend millions designing engines and putting something else in that they didn't really have in mind.
But the person who wrote oil university is a heart surgeon not an engineer. Isn't he?
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
So stop trying to out thinkengineers CAFE mandates and putting something else in that CAFE didn't really have in mind.
In a certain sense, I suppose this could go either way because this is all theory, no actual engine is really mentioned. Initially when 5w20 came out, it was speced for some engines that were originally designed for 5w30, but we'd need a specific engine to say whether it was due to CAFE or was engineered that way. I think the 0w20 engines out there are designed for that oil weight. Engineering is all about compromise, you try to protect the engine in all operating conditions and some sacrifices have to be made. I think part of it is also driving style, high performance engines that are just driven gently probably don't benefit from a thicker oil, on the other hand one that is driven hard and hot would benefit from a thicker oil. The hotter is it, the thinner the oil gets. That I believe is what the Motor Oil University article is trying to say.
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
So stop trying to out think
In a certain sense, I suppose this could go either way because this is all theory, no actual engine is really mentioned. Initially when 5w20 came out, it was speced for some engines that were originally designed for 5w30, but we'd need a specific engine to say whether it was due to CAFE or was engineered that way. I think the 0w20 engines out there are designed for that oil weight. Engineering is all about compromise, you try to protect the engine in all operating conditions and some sacrifices have to be made. I think part of it is also driving style, high performance engines that are just driven gently probably don't benefit from a thicker oil, on the other hand one that is driven hard and hot would benefit from a thicker oil. The hotter is it, the thinner the oil gets. That I believe is what the Motor Oil University article is trying to say.
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
Yes still a 30 but with lower HTHS or less protection.
The lower the viscosity at start up provides better protection. A 5w30 and a 10w30 is still a 30wt at operating temperature. It makes no sense using a 10w30 in a specd 5w30 application unless it's needed or a 5w20 in a car that specs 0w20.....
Yes still a 30 but with lower HTHS or less protection.
Your deductions are more than reasonable, but.., there is much more, not all 0W30, 5W30 and 10W30 are created equal, you need to check the HTHS of each oil you are thinking of using and compare it to the one you are using; sound crazy but the viscosities you read in bottles are a range, between this viscosity and this higher viscosity we will call them 30 for example, so what happens is the W viscosity is related to the higher viscosity, on top of that depending on the base oil and the additive pack of the oil it might be stronger or flow more. I'll give you an example, german Castrol 0W30 is far thicker than Pennzoil Platinum 10W30 at most cold starts but the ultra coldest if even then, How come it is a 0W? well that is because the "30" is in the upper range and the "30" in the Pennzoil is in the lower range so the thickening curve for the Castrol is steeper in other words is thicker for most of its curve down to the very low temperature where it matches the Pennzoil and surpasses it but at extremely low temps. So starting wear will be higher with the Castrol than with the Pennzoil from the viscosity standpoint. I have read the whole university thing understood it agree in the science but the 2 times I tried it it didn't work for me. Now to give you my humble opinion on your question yes I'll switch to a 10W30 provided that it HTHS and viscosities are higher than the 5W30 you are comparing it to. The reason as you stated the temperature is not that low to begin with so we don't need that extra cold protection but we can use the lower shearing of the oil to protect the engine when it is hotter than areas that are colder generally.
The 0W oil is the way to go. It'll be closer to operating viscosity than 10W at any given temperature, which will make it flow better whether you're starting up at -40 or +80.
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