Vehicle Mirrors

Zee09

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I feel a reaming coming on.šŸ˜
When will mirrors on vehicles be replaced with cameras either on the side windows or windshield and also the center stack. ( Heads Up)
Remember when everything had on mirror on the drivers door only?
If you drive a SD truck they drive big and ponderous only because of the tow mirrors.
Yes you can move up a trim grade and get folding mirrors but that still doesn't give you a mirror.

If the mirrorless vehicles are too far away how about the guy that has one truck- say a F250
It is the sole family vehicle. When not towing and working and using it for a family trip why doesn't the makers offer
a quick disconnect mirror system that allows you to put standard mirrors on with a key turn for security.

When you drive a rural road through a forest you fear you are going to lose those big mirrors to limbs and then you also
run into another F250 going the other way. The trucks drive small if the mirrors were compact.
 
Its pretty common on a lot of GT racecars to have a rearview camera in place of an inside mirror. Corvette Racing were one of the first to really have that system with on screen identifiers for cars coming up to tell the driver what class they were and if it was for position or not.

I think we are at the point where the price would be the same or similar. There are Super Duty trucks where the exterior mirrors are pushing and going past $1,500 for a complete assembly.
 
Its pretty common on a lot of GT racecars to have a rearview camera in place of an inside mirror. Corvette Racing were one of the first to really have that system with on screen identifiers for cars coming up to tell the driver what class they were and if it was for position or not.

I think we are at the point where the price would be the same or similar. There are Super Duty trucks where the exterior mirrors are pushing and going past $1,500 for a complete assembly.

I'd like the center stack setup and I'd be a buyer.
 
I feel a reaming coming on.šŸ˜
When will mirrors on vehicles be replaced with cameras either on the side windows or windshield and also the center stack. ( Heads Up)

Hopefully never. The last thing vehicles need is more electronic complexity and failure points with a high cost of repair to solve a problem that doesn't exist for the majority of owners.

Remember when everything had on mirror on the drivers door only?
If you drive a SD truck they drive big and ponderous only because of the tow mirrors.

You are arguing both sides here. If you choose a vehicle without a passenger's mirror, there you go, or you can add one. If you choose a vehicle with big side mirrors or add them, you chose that. Choose or modify the vehicle to be right for your unique use, NOT pretending everyone else should suffer more expense and failures to suit some niche use.

No, they do not drive any bigger or more ponderous, quite the opposite if you can see better from larger mirrors suited to the task.

Yes you can move up a trim grade and get folding mirrors but that still doesn't give you a mirror.

?? That does not make sense. If you are in a tight situation where you need the mirrors folded back, it is highly unlikely that you need to see behind you with them.

If the mirrorless vehicles are too far away how about the guy that has one truck- say a F250
It is the sole family vehicle. When not towing and working and using it for a family trip why doesn't the makers offer
a quick disconnect mirror system that allows you to put standard mirrors on with a key turn for security.

Everyone else should pay for equipment that this one guy with his one F250 family truck wants? Shouldn't that ONE guy, meaning each individual, mod their vehicle towards their needs (as long as it is legal and safe) ? However this doesn't even make sense. If using it for a family trip, how is a larger towing suited mirror a problem? It isn't.

When you drive a rural road through a forest you fear you are going to lose those big mirrors to limbs and then you also
run into another F250 going the other way. The trucks drive small if the mirrors were compact.

If you are driving through such a tight spot that you fear losing your mirrors with your NEW, approaching $100K vehicle (because you want all these new electronics to raise the price) then you should think about getting insurance to cover off-roading accidents. Otherwise, you are doing something wrong if your F250 would clear except a few inches of mirror. Driving an F250 through a dense forest just is not a common enough thing to add thousands of dollars worth of electronic mirror system to when you don't even NEED to see behind you on the fly at great speed (opposed to just turning your neck to look).

An F250 "drive small if the mirrors were compact"? That is false. If you get an F250, for most "some guy owns only one vehicle" scenarios it won't be a short bed, will have a long wheelbase so is not the vehicle to take into a densely wooded area to begin with. If it is his only vehicle why would he be risking his $100K investment on a joyride?

The bottom line is that the standard vehicle configuration suits the most buyers and it is up to you to make your vehicle into an off-roader if you choose to do this. Some automakers are now making certain models more off-road suited but in this there is also a utility trade off for that guy who needs his F250 to do work so it is far more differences than just the mirrors, one size does not fit all.

A work truck is the last vehicle which should have unnecessary extra expenses. Rather it should have long lifespan from low cost of ownership. If you happen to bang a mirror once in a great while, grab a used one from a junkyard for $50, and learn to drive a few inches further away from things. It beats destroying a $1000 camera and probably the side of the vehicle anyway. This is why many people choose to wait till their vehicle is older to mod and take it off-road unless or until they have multiple vehicles so each can be suited to the task.

I have no problem with a camera mirror system being optional equipment for those that want it, as long as it is not forced upon people in a bundle with other features they can't get without being stuck with the camera mirrors too.

An inability to live with existing tech is not a valid reason to want everyone else to change to suit your not being willing to learn to not hit your mirrors. ;)

PS I once worked for a Parks Department were I was driving their Silverado 2500 through semi-densely wooded areas on a daily basis so I do know a little of what I'm talking about. If you can't control your vehicle within a few inches of hitting things, you might consider a smaller vehicle for just that purpose.
 
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The first obstacle is NHTSA. A move to allow cameras in place of mirrors would require a complete overhaul of FMVSS 111. Considering the dire need for updates in other areas of the vehicle, most notably lighting, that haven't been touched in decades, I don't think anyone is expecting action on mirrors anytime soon.

With a conventional side mirror, there is only a single common failure mode: Mechanical damage (it gets knocked off). With a camera in place of a mirror, you'll have at least three common failure modes: Mechanical damage, electrical failure of the camera, or electrical failure of the display. Realistically, in all these cases the result is the same: You can't see behind you.

Based on current and historical FMVSS 111 rules, I could see an argument being made for outright replacement of the passenger side mirror with a camera and the addition of a camera to the driver side mirror, maybe reducing the size of the mirror as it will only be for redundancy at this point given an electrical fault. Maybe the addition of some other system, like side blind zone alert, could be argued as providing enough redundant support to remove both side mirrors.
 
When will mirrors on vehicles be replaced with cameras either on the side windows or windshield and also the center stack. ( Heads Up)
They're starting to show up. Some Kia models have them. Not "replaced" but in addition to. You can see side view mirror display in your dashboard when you turn on your blinker. Alas, the use of blinkers isn't all that common these days so some owners may not have even noticed they have this feature. :)

 
One critically overlooked aspect of digital mirrors: The display is not at your distance vision. In other words, you must refocus "close" to clearly see the display. As we age, our ability to focus reduces from about 10 diopters as a child to about 1 diopter at age 50 (hence the need for reading glasses for those with otherwise good distance vision). By age 60, there is often very little ability to focus and what there is can take quite some time, sometimes measured in minutes. Elderly folks behind a computer screen often can't focus at distance for 1-10 minutes!

I've used digital mirrors in the new Camaro. When "on" it's resolution is awful and, zoomed in or not, I can't tell if it's a cop car behind me. It also is not a natural quick glance at distance vision. Selecting it "off" is at most times, better. Resolution of the camera at night is positively awful.

In the aviation world, we take extraordinary steps to prevent such problems. The "HUD" or heads-up-display is configured in a very complex manner, with an overhead projector and a curved, "combiner" that passes normal outside images without distortion and provides flight information at the pilots distance vision. This is to prevent focus issues. It's not a simple matter in any way.

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Put me in the ā€œhopefully neverā€ category. Supplement the regular analog mirrors with cameras sure, theyā€™re already doing that, but I donā€™t see simple mirrors going away anytime soon.

I would love a HUD though.... Iā€™m surprised Tesla isnā€™t doing that.
 
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