Trust Carfax for service records?

Status
Not open for further replies.
S

Stewart Fan

Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Messages
1,153
Location
Washington
I'm looking at buying a Jeep Wrangler. Been looking on/off for a year or so,been looking hard for the last couple months.

Its been difficult to find a clean Wrangler that's not been abused. I've finally found a nice rig that I'm probably going to buy.

Its a 2000 with 72,000 miles. The dealer is asking $11,000 and won't budge on price. That's about $1600 over blue book. He knows what he has and that it'll sell at that price.

I'm having a hard time with having to pay full price. The only thing making it any easier is that Carfax shows all the maintenance has been done at a dealer,and by the book.

What are your thoughts on paying over blue book and how accurate is carfax?
 
As far as CarFax goes, I think the errors would be on the bad side - false positives, if you will, showing an otherwise good car as having issues.

When we moved from OH to AR, the AR BMV recorded the mileage wrong on the new title. A year later, when buying a 2nd car, I paid for unlimited CarFaxes and ran the OH car. It showed as having the odo set back because of a 1 digit deletion.

I always think of KBB values as a starting point, what it all comes down to is how much do you want the car, and how bad does the dealer want to sell.

I've made what I've considered to be reasonable counter-offers and been turned down flat - and then driven by the lot 6 months later to see the car still sitting there getting very ripe. You cannot negotiate with unreasonable people.
 
There's some shady dealers/sellers that I wouldn't buy from. Go with a reputable seller. Just like ebay has a feedback score. Kind of similar.
 
Carfax and similar services are only as good as the info that is reported to them, or supposed to be. A 13 year old vehicle could have been involved in any number of accidents that were not properly reported and will not show up.
 
Originally Posted By: KB2008X
Carfax and similar services are only as good as the info that is reported to them, or supposed to be. A 13 year old vehicle could have been involved in any number of accidents that were not properly reported and will not show up.


Yep, I agree, just bought a vehicle and found that carfax tends to be more problematic in what it ommitts than in what it includes. if it shows service records it seems likely they happened, however just because it doesn't show a crash it doesn't mean there wasn't one. we ran the fax on two vehicles we knew where in minor crashes and it didn't show them on either vehicle.

Carfax is best for helping you avoid a definite avoid vehicle, but not the best for proving that a vehicle is a really great buy.
 
Originally Posted By: KB2008X
Carfax and similar services are only as good as the info that is reported to them, or supposed to be. A 13 year old vehicle could have been involved in any number of accidents that were not properly reported and will not show up.


He he I know a few of those, in fact I own one...

Carfax even states in their commercials no one can know everything...

Me, I rarely pay enough money for a vehicle that it makes any difference... Owned another that was rebuilt total, bought it for approx $4k less than one with a virgin record(and it was far nicer than some of those sluts that were being passed off as virgin Mary's)... Sold it two & half years later for $650 more than I paid for it(yes the new owner knows it's history and is ticked with the car)...
 
Originally Posted By: Chris142
That's a bad year if it has the 4.0. Heads crack and pistons break. Does it have the better dana44 rear axle?


Yes it has the D44. That's one of the reasons its been a difficult search. IIRC less than 10% of the TJs had a D44
 
I had a van legally parked and totaled, and paid for by the girl who it via her insurance. I bought it back for scrap value, fixed it and sold it three years later. I ran a Carfax on it and it came back clean. So much for Carfax.
 
A wrangler isn't that fancy or advanced of a vehicle. MSRP of a basic one is like 23k. I'm not sure 11k for a vehicle with that many miles and 13yo is all that great of a deal. I'd rather pay the extra 12k or so and get a basic new one.

Primarily because I don't want the risk and potential to be mislead right at a mileage and age that you know a lot of PM if not repairs will be coming up.

If you were going to rebuild it custom, it may not matter as much.
 
Originally Posted By: JHZR2


If you were going to rebuild it custom, it may not matter as much.


That's where this is going. The $12k difference between this and new buys a lot of parts.
 
Originally Posted By: Stewart Fan
I'm having a hard time with having to pay full price. The only thing making it any easier is that Carfax shows all the maintenance has been done at a dealer,and by the book.

What are your thoughts on paying over blue book and how accurate is carfax?


Carfax = Not All that Accurate

If you want to get the repair history, get the VIN and have another Chrysler/Jeep dealer run the VIN. They should be able to pull up something similar to Ford's OASIS report which lists the entire service history of the vehicle (as long as it was done at a dealer).
 
I'll assume that "blue book" is to mean Kelly, so there's no way I'd pay over that value in any circumstance. Kelly derives there valuations based on asking prices, not actual sales prices. That's why they are almost always rediculously high compared to real life.

Edmunds is a better gauge of what the actual market value may be, and NADA uses actual selling prices to determine their market values. What do those two say the vehicle is valued at? Those are the numbers I'd want to be under.
 
A few more thoughts on buying that Jeep. So, Carfax really isn't all that great, but even if it was you still need to check that Wrangler over carefully. Drive it for a few hours, put it on a lift, get a Jeep guy, or two, that you trust to pick it over before you buy. That's more valuable than a Carfax anyhow. I don't know the Jeep market, nor the oddities of Jeep wear and tear, but there are good Jeep internet forums that do.

Consider this, not every dealer prices every vehicle so they will sell. Some will price a vehicle high so that it stays on their lot and becomes a temporary marketing tool to draw in folks who are driving by. Red sports cars, jacked up trucks, etc. They will sell these promo vehicles, but only at a premium because they believe it is making them money just sitting in a prominent spot on the lot. Sometimes if you just wait them out and/or keep pestering them to sell it at a reasonable price, they will. Make sure the sales manager knows your name and phone number and will give you first crack at it when they get tired of it. Be crystal clear that you are a buyer, not a looky-loo.

The timing of an offer makes a difference. The sales mgr. will find genuine offers more attractive at the end of their sales month versus the beginning. He wants big numbers to show his boss.
 
Originally Posted By: threeputtpar
I'll assume that "blue book" is to mean Kelly, so there's no way I'd pay over that value in any circumstance. Kelly derives there valuations based on asking prices, not actual sales prices. That's why they are almost always rediculously high compared to real life.

Edmunds is a better gauge of what the actual market value may be, and NADA uses actual selling prices to determine their market values. What do those two say the vehicle is valued at? Those are the numbers I'd want to be under.


NADA is where I got the pricing from.
 
Originally Posted By: KB2008X
Drive it for a few hours, put it on a lift, get a Jeep guy, or two, that you trust to pick it over before you buy.



I did drive it for a couple hours,by myself with no dealer/salesman influence on the test drive.

This isn't my first Jeep. I've got a pretty good grasp on where to look and what to look for. They actually had it on one of those car stands on the lot. That made it very easy to poke and prod for an hour before I even wanted to drive it.

It was as advertised. A clean,well cared for Jeep,that drove very nicely.
 
Originally Posted By: Stewart Fan
Originally Posted By: KB2008X
Drive it for a few hours, put it on a lift, get a Jeep guy, or two, that you trust to pick it over before you buy.



I did drive it for a couple hours,by myself with no dealer/salesman influence on the test drive.

This isn't my first Jeep. I've got a pretty good grasp on where to look and what to look for. They actually had it on one of those car stands on the lot. That made it very easy to poke and prod for an hour before I even wanted to drive it.

It was as advertised. A clean,well cared for Jeep,that drove very nicely.



Then pressure them with a fair offer or wait them out.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

D
Where to take a Mercedes for an oil change when no MB dealer is nearby?
2
Replies
38
Views
1K
GON
Nick1994
Does it really make financial sense to buy used over new?
4 5 6
Replies
112
Views
7K
Stumpy
Finklejag
Tried to buy a Mitsubishi Mirage yesterday
3 4 5
Replies
91
Views
9K
incognito_2u
P
Bought a '24 Titan after long search ....
2 3 4
Replies
63
Views
2K
Rust_Belt_Pete
D
Advice on what to do about a technician who stripped my spark plugs into the head
2 3 4
Replies
66
Views
5K
thastinger
Back
Top Bottom