Toyota Dynamic Force four-cylinder “electronic” oil pump

[JavierH19]

Car Care Nut saying the oil pump was electronic and calibrated for 0w-16

Care car nut is just another parts changer and big expensive diagnostic computer user who does a good job at it since he better. It's the only thing he's been doing for a long time which doesn't make him spectacular as it's expected with any career. Doesn't make his opinion the be all end all like he thinks it is. Only advice I'd take from him without debate is how to replace parts as that's all he's shown to be good for.

 

[ATex7239]

Oil pump/control and map here:
https://global.toyota/en/powertrain/engine/

Pretty broad range and nothing I'd worry about concerning grade. Since the RAV4 and Camry are always considered when replacing vehicles here, if another finds it way into the driveway, I won't fill it with the mpg grade recommended.
Its always high speed/load/temp around here

I don't bother watching youtube videos because too many are full of misinformation that clueless watchers think are facts. Many think wasting time to create a video makes the creator a reliable trusted source of info. The world is full of village idiots with cameras too. Be careful with what you absorb from a video by some self-crowned Zen master magician.





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Yeah the diagram is the linchpin here. But the Car Care Nut seems to be the most cited reason for the electronic oil pump theory. So I thought the video of him showing the oil pump and chain was important as well.

 

[Shel_B]

If that was the case, Toyota would have had to put differently calibrated oil pumps on each and every car they sold with that engine in foreign countries. (Read Australia and Russia). Where the manual says oil up to and including 15w40 can be used in the A25A-FKS 4 cylinder engine. They don't. The same oil pump is used throughout the globe on that engine.

I don't doubt that, nor do I doubt you. However, I'm curious to understand how you know that to be true.

 

[Hermann]

Care car nut is just another parts changer and big expensive diagnostic computer user who does a good job at it since he better. It's the only thing he's been doing for a long time which doesn't make him spectacular as it's expected with any career. Doesn't make his opinion the be all end all like he thinks it is. Only advice I'd take from him without debate is how to replace parts as that's all he's shown to be good for.

WOW !

 

[ATex7239]

I don't doubt that, nor do I doubt you. However, I'm curious to understand how you know that to be true.

If it weren’t the same then in those areas where higher viscosities are allowed 0w16 wouldn’t be allowed. But it is. Having a more stringent pump system only in a few areas doesn’t make anymore sense than having a less stringent pump system only in a few areas. One cannot say with intellectual honesty it’s a special pump over here and it’s also a special pump over there. It would just be making up carves outs to win an argument.

 

[kschachn]

If it weren’t the same then in those areas where higher viscosities are allowed 0w16 wouldn’t be allowed. But it is. Having a more stringent pump system only in a few areas doesn’t make anymore sense than having a less stringent pump system only in a few areas. One cannot say with intellectual honesty it’s a special pump over here and it’s also a special pump over there. It would just be making up carves outs to win an argument.

And after all this unfounded mass hysteria is exactly the intent of the CAFE regulations in regards to owner’s manual wording.

 

[Greasymechtech]

I don't doubt that, nor do I doubt you. However, I'm curious to understand how you know that to be true.

I haven't found different oil pump PN's for around the world. If you are not in the USA, check the PN for this variable oil pump in your country.

Care car nut is just another parts changer and big expensive diagnostic computer user who does a good job at it since he better. It's the only thing he's been doing for a long time which doesn't make him spectacular as it's expected with any career. Doesn't make his opinion the be all end all like he thinks it is. Only advice I'd take from him without debate is how to replace parts as that's all he's shown to be good for.

I've noticed that many youtube videos are equivalent. Parts changers!!!! Some good at it and other woefully pathetic. It is what it is.

 

[supton]

I haven't found different oil pump PN's for around the world. If you are not in the USA, check the PN for this variable oil pump in your country.

Didn't watch.

If the pump is electronically controlled, then perhaps the ECU could be regionally programmed. Bump the pressure in Region 1, drop in 2, etc.

Maybe someone with nav should hook up an oil pressure gauge and cris-cross the US-Canadian or US-Mexican border and see if the car is tracking your whereabouts, and deviously dropping pressure while in the USA to appease the CAFE overlords.

 

[ls1mike]

Virtually same like any other manufacturers do (for more than a decade).
.

Yep, GM uses a variable displacement oil pump on some stuff that is controlled by the ECM.

 

[SC Maintenance]

If the pump is electronically controlled, then perhaps the ECU could be regionally programmed. Bump the pressure in Region 1, drop in 2, etc.

Doesn't change the fact that the manual for Australia says you can use anything from 0W-16 (like in the US) all the way up to and including 15w40. I guess it has a real time viscosity sensor which is a primary control input

 

[billt460]

......I only choose to use 0w16 because I trust Toyota did their due diligence designing the engine to handle it.......

I think it is more a case of how they can get away with using it without damaging anything. I can't think of anything in the "design" of the engine itself that would require changing, in order for it to handle 0W-16. Or what using it would improve, for that matter. (Other than CAFE mileage stats).

Metal inside engines expand and contract at similar rates. And all require similar hot running clearances. This regardless of what the 17 year old at Jiffy Lube pumps into the housewife's crankcase, while he's on the phone arguing with his girlfriend.

 

[wemay]

Care car nut is just another parts changer and big expensive diagnostic computer user who does a good job at it since he better. It's the only thing he's been doing for a long time which doesn't make him spectacular as it's expected with any career. Doesn't make his opinion the be all end all like he thinks it is. Only advice I'd take from him without debate is how to replace parts as that's all he's shown to be good for.

This

 

[ATex7239]

I think it is more a case of how they can get away with using it without damaging anything. I can't think of anything in the "design" of the engine itself that would require changing, in order for it to handle 0W-16. Or what using it would improve, for that matter. (Other than CAFE mileage stats).

Metal inside engines expand and contract at similar rates. And all require similar hot running clearances. This regardless of what the 17 year old at Jiffy Lube pumps into the housewife's crankcase, while he's on the phone arguing with his girlfriend.

The diagram at start of the thread has a lot of other good info on the design. The engine appears to be designed with heat dissipation and high thermal efficiency in mind. Yes in any engineering endeavor there will always be trade offs on what is best and what you can “get away with.” I cannot remember which thread I said it on but if engineers were the sole decision makers on projects they’d all be over engineered, over budget, and over due.

 

[charbaby]

No Camrys were ever RWD. The car that the Camry replaced was RWD, the Corona.

OK, you got me there^^^ The car may have been under another name waaaaay back then.
This is from Wikipedia:

Development of the V10 series Camry and Vista began in August 1977 following the 1973 oil crisis and would later cover the 1979 crisis.[18][19]Automobile manufacturers were making the inexorable move to downsized, lighter, more fuel efficient cars with better aerodynamic performance.[20][21]The industry also began wide-scale switching from the rear-wheel-drive layout to the lighter and more compact front-wheel-drive in the interest of increased fuel economy.[22][23]

 

[0W-16]

Yeah the diagram is the linchpin here. But the Car Care Nut seems to be the most cited reason for the electronic oil pump theory. So I thought the video of him showing the oil pump and chain was important as well.

The dude's from Iraq. English is not his native language.

 

[nthach]

I think in the USA they were called Cressida. I used to love that car and it had the same 5M-GE engine that the 1982-1985 Supra had. Front engine, rear drive, and Toyota quality of the 80s.

The Cressida is the US/Canadian/Australian version of the Mark II, itself based on the Crown but with a longer wheelbase, Cressidas had IRS + MacPherson front suspension on the sedans, live axle on the wagon. The Corona was a smaller Crown, bigger than the then-RWD Corolla.

If we were to liken it to the modern Toyota lineup, the Cressida would be comparable to the Lexus GS, the Corona would slot in where the Camry is.

 

[ATex7239]

The dude's from Iraq. English is not his native language.

If we are ending at that as the final conclusion (he was grossly wrong because he has difficulty convening the English language) then no one should ever listen to him again. I don’t think is a valid conclusion.

 

[kschachn]

I think it is more a case of how they can get away with using it without damaging anything. I can't think of anything in the "design" of the engine itself that would require changing, in order for it to handle 0W-16. Or what using it would improve, for that matter. (Other than CAFE mileage stats).

Metal inside engines expand and contract at similar rates. And all require similar hot running clearances. This regardless of what the 17 year old at Jiffy Lube pumps into the housewife's crankcase, while he's on the phone arguing with his girlfriend.

If the engine is damaged by a 40-grade, imagine all the damage that will occur from every start below about 100C.

What a truly worthless design that would be.

 

[ragtoplvr]

What we do not know is the size and length of the oil galleys how long on cold start it takes oil at a specific pressure to flow in sufficient quantity to protect the bearings etc.
We also do not know if the computer puts out full pressure at idle after cold start for a few seconds to fast prime the passages, I think that would be wise but did the engineers?
There have also been cases where pump shaft and drive gear failed alleged to be very cold SAE 40 or 50 oil putting excess load on the pump but that was years ago, on old V8 and not scientific.

 

[kschachn]

What we do not know is the size and length of the oil galleys and how long on cold start at takes oil at a specific pressure to flow in sufficient quantity to protect the bearings etc.
We also do not know if the computer puts out full pressure at idle to fast prime the passages, I think that would be wise but did the engineers?
There have also been cases where pump shaft and drive gear failed alleged to be very cold SAE 40 or 50 oil putting excess load on the pump but that was years ago and not scientific.

Yes but see what the problem is there is just how viscous any grade is when cold especially when the winter rating is being disregarded.

And how similar all of them are in regards to “flow” when they are hot.