this month's AMSOIL magazine

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: TimVipond
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Name the motor oil companies who make ALL their own ingredients.



ExxonMobil.

They've even advertised this fact.

They mine all the minerals and refine all the elements? They don't buy any crude oil? I'm impressed!


Quote:
INTRODUCTION Exxon's Highland Uranium Operations in eastern Wyoming consists of an open pit, an underground mine and a mill complex. The geology of the deposit is reviewed in this paper, and an overview of the mining operations at both the surface and underground mines is presented. Topics discussed include geology, stripping of overburden and mining of ore in the open pit, and underground development and stoping methods. GEOLOGY The Highland uranium deposit was discovered in 1968 by Exxon Minerals Company, U.S.A., in Converse County, Wyoming, 35 miles north of Douglas. The mine is located at an elevation of about 5,200 ft in a high-plains, sagebrush-covered prairie typical of eastern Wyoming. The deposit is near the southern edge of the Powder River Basin in the Paleocene Fort Union Formation. The Fort Union Formation consists of 1,900 to 3,200 ft of sandstone, siltstone, mudstone, claystone and coal beds. Siltstone, mudstone and claystone are collectively referred to as "shale" at Highland. There are many alternating layers of shale and sandstone in the Fort Union Formation; but in the Highland area, there are only three principal sandstones, known as the Highland Sand Group, which host the uranium. The combined sand thickness is about 150 ft.


They even mine Uranium.

You really have no clue how huge this company is.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Name the motor oil companies who make ALL their own ingredients.



ExxonMobil.

They've even advertised this fact.


I understand why they say that, somehow people like the idea. To me, I would think a company like Redline, Royal Purple or Schaefer's would be best buying from the best of each ingredient. Actually at some level XOM are not exactly telling the truth. They buy ingredients. Trust me, they do.


I'll admit I like the idea. But as you very well know, I've used AMSOIL lubricants with great results and wouldn't hesitate to use them again. They are a great product! But I have also used Mobil 1 for 15 years, and have had great luck with it as well. Both are fine oils.

Pablo, some of the guys who "sell" your product (not you or Gary) really do turn these debates into a bit of a farce as I'm sure you are aware. Spewing the "first at everything" lines like the guy above really hurts AMSOIL's image in my mind. Al had a great idea and he ran with it. Porting synthetic aviation lubes to the automotive market, then modifying and getting those lubes API certified (I'm generalizing a bit here I know) was a brilliant idea. And it really did put the company on the forefront of synthetic oil in automotive applications. But they didn't "invent" synthetic oil. Far from it. And AMSOIL doesn't claim that. But some guys DO claim that, or twist the wording to make it sound that way.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


Pablo, some of the guys who "sell" your product (not you or Gary) really do turn these debates into a bit of a farce as I'm sure you are aware.


I agree, and lately I just try to avoid these threads - but when there is just "stuff" being said about Amsoil, with no basis in anything - I need to step in.

 

[TimVipond]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Name the motor oil companies who make ALL their own ingredients.



ExxonMobil.

They've even advertised this fact.


Exxon buys more oil than they pump http://money.cnn.com/2007/11/05/news/companies/exxon_oil/index.htm

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


Pablo, some of the guys who "sell" your product (not you or Gary) really do turn these debates into a bit of a farce as I'm sure you are aware.


I agree, and lately I just try to avoid these threads - but when there is just "stuff" being said about Amsoil, with no basis in anything - I need to step in.


I understand that. If more of the AMSOIL guys were like you and Gary.... I think you guys would be even bigger than you are.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: TimVipond
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Name the motor oil companies who make ALL their own ingredients.



ExxonMobil.

They've even advertised this fact.


Exxon buys more oil than they pump http://money.cnn.com/2007/11/05/news/companies/exxon_oil/index.htm


And who MAKES crude? Father Christmas? Wait, that's right, we extract it from the earth. Crude is the base. You drill it, extract it from the tar sands, or you buy it. You still have the same base product to start with. Nobody "makes" crude. So that really doesn't tie into this.

The process of refining it, creating synthetic base stocks like PAO, POE, AN's, as well as additive packages (Exxon Chemical) and then blending those products into a finished lubricant is something ExxonMobil can, and DOES do in-house. They don't buy pre-packaged basestocks, they don't buy add-packs. They blend products THEY produce to result in a final product. That is what they advertise, and as far as I know, are the only oil company who can do this.

 

[Trav]

That's a good point.

 

[TimVipond]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: TimVipond
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Name the motor oil companies who make ALL their own ingredients.



ExxonMobil.

They've even advertised this fact.

They mine all the minerals and refine all the elements? They don't buy any crude oil? I'm impressed!


Quote:
INTRODUCTION Exxon's Highland Uranium Operations in eastern Wyoming consists of an open pit, an underground mine and a mill complex. The geology of the deposit is reviewed in this paper, and an overview of the mining operations at both the surface and underground mines is presented. Topics discussed include geology, stripping of overburden and mining of ore in the open pit, and underground development and stoping methods. GEOLOGY The Highland uranium deposit was discovered in 1968 by Exxon Minerals Company, U.S.A., in Converse County, Wyoming, 35 miles north of Douglas. The mine is located at an elevation of about 5,200 ft in a high-plains, sagebrush-covered prairie typical of eastern Wyoming. The deposit is near the southern edge of the Powder River Basin in the Paleocene Fort Union Formation. The Fort Union Formation consists of 1,900 to 3,200 ft of sandstone, siltstone, mudstone, claystone and coal beds. Siltstone, mudstone and claystone are collectively referred to as "shale" at Highland. There are many alternating layers of shale and sandstone in the Fort Union Formation; but in the Highland area, there are only three principal sandstones, known as the Highland Sand Group, which host the uranium. The combined sand thickness is about 150 ft.


They even mine Uranium.

You really have no clue how huge this company is.
Exxon puts Uranium in their motor oil? I did not know that...

I retired as a chemist from Royal Dutch Shell Oil. They were bigger than Exxon. They were the world's largest company. So I may have a clue...

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: TimVipond

I retired as a chemist from Royal Dutch Shell Oil. They were bigger than Exxon. They were the world's largest company. So I may have a clue...


Then why do you sound like one of the AMSOIL fanboy shrills who make guys like Pablo and Gary look bad?

ExxonMobil has numerous mining operations. If you worked for Royal Dutch Shell, I'm surprised you didn't know that. Obviously my point about Uranium was that they have hands in areas most wouldn't expect... Not that they would put it in oil. I would hope you picked up on that and were just playing intentionally daft in jest.

 

[TimVipond]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: TimVipond

I retired as a chemist from Royal Dutch Shell Oil. They were bigger than Exxon. They were the world's largest company. So I may have a clue...


Then why do you sound like one of the AMSOIL fanboy shrills who make guys like Pablo and Gary look bad?
AMSOIL fanboy shrill? How does presenting facts and and asking others for facts and being polite make me a fanboy shrill and make Pablo and Gary look bad? Keep in mind I am a retired Shell scientist and maybe you will see my remarks in a different light...Pablo's employer even hires me as a consultant.

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
ExxonMobil has numerous mining operations. If you worked for Royal Dutch Shell, I'm surprised you didn't know that. Obviously my point about Uranium was that they have hands in areas most wouldn't expect... Not that they would put it in oil. I would hope you picked up on that and were just playing intentionally daft in jest.
Of course I know ExxonMobil has numerous mining operations. What makes you think I didn't know that? So does Shell. But they don't make all the ingredients that go in their motor oil either. Neither does ExxonMobil. They all purchase raw materials.

 

[ltslimjim]

Really, all companies twist words and make a sales "pitch" to get buyers. I really do not care, so as long as the technical specs and perhaps more telling, the response per application, suits my application's needs.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL

The process of refining it, creating synthetic base stocks like PAO, POE, AN's, as well as additive packages (Exxon Chemical) and then blending those products into a finished lubricant is something ExxonMobil can, and DOES do in-house. They don't buy pre-packaged basestocks, they don't buy add-packs. They blend products THEY produce to result in a final product. That is what they advertise, and as far as I know, are the only oil company who can do this.


Great info, ties into what I said earlier. Amsoil needs XOM, XOM doesn't need them. XOM is a true leader in the industry.

 

[buster]

Regarding XOM, they do all of their own formulating in-house using their own base oils and "some" additives. Infineum is owned jointly by Shell & XOM. Mobil doesn't buy "additive packages" for their oils. Amsoil may leverage their additive suppliers a lot more than XOM, but that mean anything IMO. Redline is in the same position. Roy was a chemist at Lubrizol and so was Dave. Oil formulations are changing all the time.

 

[Artem]

I feel like the same thing is being repeated over and over for the few "hard headed" members.

I've gotten bored with this thread.

Thanks for the useful info, to those that this applies too.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: Artem
I feel like the same thing is being repeated over and over for the few "hard headed" members.

I've gotten bored with this thread.

Thanks for the useful info, to those that this applies too.


Agree heartily.

 

[TimVipond]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: Artem
I feel like the same thing is being repeated over and over for the few "hard headed" members.

I've gotten bored with this thread.

Thanks for the useful info, to those that this applies too.


Agree heartily.


Same here.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: TimVipond
AMSOIL fanboy shrill? How does presenting facts and and asking others for facts and being polite make me a fanboy shrill and make Pablo and Gary look bad? Keep in mind I am a retired Shell scientist and maybe you will see my remarks in a different light...Pablo's employer even hires me as a consultant.


I'm far from the only one who sees your posts as bad AMSOIL sales tactics. Maybe you should look back at some of your posts and see where we are coming from.

Johnny worked for Shell too. I don't see him peddling other oil brands on this site posting "first at everything" information out of context (and neither do Gary and Pablo, and they sell the stuff!). If the way I, and others have taken your remarks is not as you have intended them, it may perhaps be wise to re-visit your posting style and see if perhaps you are saying things in a manner in which they are getting misconstrued.

Quote:
Of course I know ExxonMobil has numerous mining operations. What makes you think I didn't know that? So does Shell. But they don't make all the ingredients that go in their motor oil either. Neither does ExxonMobil. They all purchase raw materials.


But the point here is none of them MAKE raw materials! Crude oil comes from the ground, so do minerals. XOM refines crude, it produces add packs and the like at Exxon Chemical. I don't know the extent of their mining operations other than that they are extensive, but I don't expect them to mine all their own minerals, just like I don't expect them to drill all their own crude. These raw materials are the same whether they are drilled, mined or purchased.

We are comparing a company who can take raw materials and through internal process, turn them into a finished lubricant. To a company who buys base stocks and additive packages and blends lubricants. There is a marked difference here!

And I am NOT saying that XOM's process results in a better product! (though some may feel that way, and that is why they advertise it). Simply that XOM has the capability to do something that the blenders cannot.

 

[buster]

Synthetics existed before Amsoil did. In fact, it was Hatco that developed Amsoil's first oil.

In terms of formulations, Amsoil followed Mobil in using PAO's, then started using Group III's like the industry was doing for awhile. Their additive system is not much different than any other oil and in many was was lagging in years past. Mg and no moly.

I think oils like RLI and Fuchs are more advanced or innovative. Amsoil seems to like to boost additive packages. Great oils, but I don't see any real advancements from them.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: buster
Synthetics existed before Amsoil did. In fact, it was Hatco that developed Amsoil's first oil.

In terms of formulations, Amsoil followed Mobil in using PAO's, then started using Group III's like the industry was doing for awhile. Their additive system is not much different than any other oil and in many was was lagging in years past. Mg and no moly.

I think oils like RLI and Fuchs are more advanced or innovative. Amsoil seems to like to boost additive packages. Great oils, but I don't see any real advancements from them.


Ah Buster, Amsoil was the first to develop an API-rated 100 percent synthetic motor oil , not the first to develop synthetic motor oil as they'd like us to believe. But you knew that! Funny thing, now decades later their top of the line SSO and ASM aren't API approved.

Originally Posted By: TimVipond
First to develop an API-rated 100 percent synthetic motor oil." XOM followed.

 

[PontiacFan]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amsoil

Mr. Amatuzio went on to formulate a synthetic motor oil for use in automobiles in a joint effort with the Hatco Corporation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil

In the early 1960s, Chevron U.S.A integrated the first commercial utilization of hydrocracking technology at its Richmond California refinery.


Although used in the aviation and aerospace industries beginning in the early 1950s, the first synthetic oil developed for automotive combustion engines and fully recognized by the American Petroleum Institute (API) was produced by the Hatco Corp.[10] in 1972 as per specific specification requirements by Albert J. Amatuzio, current President and CEO of Amsoil Inc.

I am just wondering why we never hear anything about the Hatco Corporation in Amsoil's Literature.

Hatco Corp was the 1st to produce an API Licensed Synthetic Oil, and Amsoil was the 1st to actually sell it.

Who actually mixed up the product, I think it was Hatco, and it sure seems like Big Al is taking all of the credit.