The Price is Right!

[Gary Allan]

Master Acid probably has some industrial/mechanical history that knows that those very same bearing manufacturers produce bearings of like design and composition ...used in equally demanding (or more so) services ..and do it for less $$$.

 

[moribundman]

" history that knows"
I see you've been infected.

The bearings that I get for 80 a piece are OEM SKF bearings made for my particular car. Those are the same OEM bearings with the same part number and markings in the same packaging that the dealer sells for double or triple price. Whether or not there are superior bearings isn't the issue.

 

[Gary Allan]

Suppose you're still paying double or triple what they're worth? Being bought at half the ridiculous mark up is still getting taken to the cleaners. Not that I'm saying you were ..but I think that's what MA was trying to communicate.

..as was I ...but we really see that "it's beside the point" in any event.

 

[Shannow]

have seen bearings sold from the same manufacturer at different prices depending on "quality", i.e. selected components assembled and tested as a "superior" quality bearing, and sold as such.

Sort of like CCI blue box versus Green tag. Same thing, just the excellent batches get green tag status and a higher price.

Not saying that this applies here.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Suppose you're still paying double or triple what they're worth? Being bought at half the ridiculous mark up is still getting taken to the cleaners.


So you buy at factory-direct cost, possibly at actual value? Yeah right.

I didn't ask the dealer for the parts price. If it's the same as with other parts, and I have no good reason to expect otherwise, the dealer's price will be 2 to 3 times higher than the normal retail price for the exact same bearings. So probably $150 to $185 per bearing.

Of course the part is marked up, wherever you buy it on a retail level. The manufacturer wants to earn money, the wholesaler wants a profit, and the installer wants a profit. I mark up material cost that I charge to my clients. 100% markup is the normal markup in my field. I understand markup, but I also know where the buck stops.

I don't know a way of finding the ultimate top-of-the-line bearings that may exist. I'm stuck with what's available at retail level: OEM bearings and bearings that will fit and cost $20 and last half a year. Maybe you and MA etc can buy factory-direct, but it's irrelevant to me. Even if I can find "the best bearings" the installer may want to use the bearings he is selling, not only because he is running a business, but also because of liability issues.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
have seen bearings sold from the same manufacturer at different prices depending on "quality", i.e. selected components assembled and tested as a "superior" quality bearing, and sold as such.

Sort of like CCI blue box versus Green tag. Same thing, just the excellent batches get green tag status and a higher price.

Not saying that this applies here.


Then for Pete's sake tell me how you make sure you get the best bearings you can possibly get at a reasonable price. I have yet to hear ANY advice regarding that.

By the way, at $300 cost for replacing a wheel bearing, tackling the job myself isn't worth it. I'd still like to get the best possible bearing, though. Let's hear the proper COA to achieve that goal.

 

[Shannow]

Honestly, I've never seen a motor vehicle wheel bearing that's been "bad", or will lead to a substantially shorter life.

Cars, when stationary are stationary. Brinelling doesn't occur when they are out of service, only when they are transported (in hindsight, Eathquakes could be a cause of brinelleing).

Bearings that we see fail early at work are generally run 8760 hour per annum (350,000 miles p.a. @50MPH). The bad ones last less than a year. Good ones last for decades. Out of service plant exposed to,power station vibrations oft fail early too.

If your bearing is SKF, [censored] etc. they will last a reasonable life (years), or fail very quickly (random failure/infant mortality).

I'd still get that shark jig, as it seems like a replacement for many presses and pullers...it's a good looking toy.

 

[Shannow]

[censored] was reference to a brand of the Schaeffler Group, rather than a deity or location.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
If your bearing is SKF, [censored] etc. they will last a reasonable life (years), or fail very quickly (random failure/infant mortality).

That's my take on it. I don't understand why I'm still being told by a bunch of short-armed tightwads with deep pockets that I'm still vastly overpaying. Methinks some folks like being antagonistic just because of their disdain for Audi. I can't make a single post regarding anything related to Audi without people jumping all over it. I actually love it. I'll have one Audi post coming every day from now on. It's like chumming the waters with fish guts.

Quote:
I'd still get that shark jig, as it seems like a replacement for many presses and pullers...it's a good looking toy.

Alreadygone actually mentioned a tool that's very similar to the Hub Shark. Not only can it be used to remove the old but also to install the new bearing. It's only a little bit more costly than the Hub Shark, so I'll probably buy it eventually. One can never have enough tools or rum!

 

[Shannow]

Doesn't the hub shark also do bearing and hub installation ?

As to enough tools, they are like books.

Can never have enough, and should never lend them.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Doesn't the hub shark also do bearing and hub installation ?

Apparently it does do both. Interesting. Not sure if other folks were using an older model, because they only used it for bearing removal. Harborfreight (discount tools of questionable origin and quality) sells a Hub Shark copy for $79, but probably it will break.

Alreadygone mentioned a problem with this type tool and the need for a "bearing knife." Someone else said he didn't like the Hub Shark because, unlike a press, it didn't allow much control when installing the bearing.

 

[Shannow]

I reckon threaded jacks give as much or more control than hydraulic.

Threads are slow, and you can see stuff moving (and back out) hydraulics you can get in all sorts of trouble before you know it.

But in both, cleanliness (clean and bur free) is next to Krishnaness before pressing in terms of successful outcomes.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Threads are slow, and you can see stuff moving (and back out)

The Hub Shark is intended to be used with an impact wrench. I suppose a breaker bar may be a better option.

Originally Posted By: Shannow
cleanliness (clean and bur free) is next to Krishnaness before pressing in terms of successful outcomes.

This may be the reason why the dealer wants to replace the hub in any case (I presume they want to do that, otherwise there is no way to end up with a cost of $900 per wheel). I do know that the failure rate on the 12v is high after DIY installation -- the number of wheel bearing failure related posts on Audiworld demonstrates this clearly.

 

[Shannow]

I'd agree with the failure rate after DIY being high, as the bearing needs to be mounted completely true.

Doing it in situ with the hub still mounted makes it all the more harder to inspect and clean up before mount up.

Rattle guns are a disassembly tool IMHO.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Rattle guns are a disassembly tool IMHO.

I don't have one and I don't want one.

Weighing pros and cons I do believe I'm best off going for the lousy $300 job with the still overpriced OEM parts. I'll get the bearing R&R tool kit eventually, because I'm sure I'll hang on to the Audi until it falls apart. I'll leave it at this, since I'm now getting a headache.

 

[alreadygone]

"Harborfreight (discount tools of questionable origin and quality) sells a Hub Shark copy for $79, but probably it will break."

Throw-away handtools do have their place, but for a high load bearing tool, even if only used occasionally, stay away from this crappola.

Bob

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
So you buy at factory-direct cost, possibly at actual value? Yeah right.
(playing along)

Where did I say that? I merely suggested that a given bearing may cost substantially more or less depending on what market it is sold in. Product costs vary, as you pointed out, with the number of hands they pass through. If you're a larger facility, that's supplied by one major parts/material supplier in a given industrial center, that supplier is probably dealing directly with the manufacturer.

I never claimed that you paid too much. I merely suggested why someone may have that opinion. I would have expect you, of all people, to have seen that distinction. You're not one for leading others, or yourself, in false impressions, are you?

I'm very disappointed in you, mori. Self flogging is in order...

Quote:
Methinks some folks like being antagonistic just because of their disdain for Audi. I can't make a single post regarding anything related to Audi without people jumping all over it.


This certainly doesn't include me. My observations on the Bentley board merely give me the impressions that they're rather expensive to fix when broken. They're rather complex and sophisticated machines compared to many. Most don't get out of a car as much as they can deliver in driving experience. It's as simple as that.

add a flog or two for that...

 

[GROUCHO MARX]

Mori, please buy that $100k Audi. I would love to see the responses.

 

[moribundman]

Actually, Groucho, I won't even tell people here what new car I bought earlier this year. You once told me I had shared too much info, and I am heeding your words. My new wheels would be labeled overly complex, expensive to maintain etc by those who don't even own the same car. The Audi got too small for business, but I liked it way too much to give it away. Not to mention having the automotive equivalent of a whipping boy is of advantage in the city. It's the nicest beater by far and wide and I hope to keep it until gas costs 8 bucks a gallon.

 

[JHZR2]

no please do... I want to see a pic!

I own and love my saab and MB diesel. Two cars that many folks dislike for a reason or another... So what? Who cares, let people say stuff. If you have a neat new car clue us in, its exciting!

Maybe that crown vic is yours... no wait, its simplistic nd old tech. What did you get???

JMH