Test drove a Chevy Volt today

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
They are nice cars, worth about $30k IMHO, will get down in price after awhile.


I find it hard to believe that the Volt is even worth 30K, when a Camry Hybrid can be purchased for well less than 30K. The Camry hybrid (I almost purchased one) is a really nice car, with considerably more room. The savings would have to make sense.

As it is, a nice volt will set you back exactly $50,000 after sales tax, dealer fees and registration costs. Sure, you get $7,500 back at the end of the year. Still, $50K is absolutely out of the "reasonable" range for an economy car. Technology or not.

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Still, $50K is absolutely out of the "reasonable" range for an economy car. Technology or not.


Not if your commute was under the range of the batteries and you didn't have to pay for gas. Electricity is still cheap.

 

[edhackett]

$50K will buy 26 years of fuel at 12K miles a year, 25 mpg, $4.00 a gallon.

Ed

 

[hattaresguy]

I don't like the new Camry I think they are pretty cheap, IMHO the Volt is a nicer car.

Not saying I would buy one, but I can see the attraction. For the money I would buy a Mercedes E320 CDI.

I know someone who has a Volt and loves it. Their commute is 32 miles round trip, so they don't have to use any gas during the week. Just on the weekends if they go somewhere.

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: edhackett
$50K will buy 26 years of fuel at 12K miles a year, 25 mpg, $4.00 a gallon.

Ed


I'm not arguing the economics of buying an electric car just to try to save money on fuel. How about people who are shopping a new car? And let's be realistic, whether you agree with the concept or not there's basically $10k off sticker after the government handout so $50k isn't a realistic starting point.

Take Volt Price - (other vehicle price), calculate from there.

 

[Cujet]

Well, here in South Florida, we have reasonable electric rates, about 12 cents per KWH for the first tier, inclusive of taxes/fees. Then it goes up to about 20 cents in tier 2. I "touch" tier 2 most months, I suppose that's by design.

So, a Volt, with 12 KWH (or slightly more) use per full charge. That's about $2.40 (or slightly more) for a full charge, for me.

Put another way, $2.40 gets me 30 miles. How far does $2.40 get me in a Prius (about the same) or a Camry Hybrid about 24 miles.

I'm not seeing the savings...

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: cchase
there's basically $10k off sticker after the government handout so $50k isn't a realistic starting point.


$7,500 is not $10,000. Plus, remember that you MUST pay sales tax on that $7,500. Here in South Florida, that's $450 worth of additional sales tax. So, your "tax rebate" is really $7,050.

In TN, CA and some other states, the combined state and local sales tax can reach 9% and your additional sales tax burden would be $675. Not exactly cheap. For a "tax rebate" of $6,825, That's not 10 grand.

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Well, here in South Florida, we have reasonable electric rates, about 12 cents per KWH for the first tier, inclusive of taxes/fees. Then it goes up to about 20 cents in tier 2. I "touch" tier 2 most months, I suppose that's by design.

So, a Volt, with 12 KWH (or slightly more) use per full charge. That's about $2.40 (or slightly more) for a full charge, for me.

Put another way, $2.40 gets me 30 miles. How far does $2.40 get me in a Prius (about the same) or a Camry Hybrid about 24 miles.

I'm not seeing the savings...



Bringing math and logic to your argument will do you no good

Silly rabbit, it's not about saving you money.

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: cchase
there's basically $10k off sticker after the government handout so $50k isn't a realistic starting point.


$7,500 is not $10,000. Plus, remember that you MUST pay sales tax on that $7,500. Here in South Florida, that's $450 worth of additional sales tax. So, your "tax rebate" is really $7,050.

In TN, CA and some other states, the combined state and local sales tax can reach 9% and your additional sales tax burden would be $675. Not exactly cheap. For a "tax rebate" of $6,825, That's not 10 grand.


The MSRP of the Volt is also 41k, not 50k, but I didn't highlight that.

If the Volt drives 30-40 miles on $2.40 for you, a Prius getting say, 40 mpg on $3.85 (or whatever gas spikes to in the near future) costs quite a bit more to run. Like, on the order of 50% more.

 

[greenjp]

The Volt is a luxury car. Not in the traditional sense where luxury = soft corinthian leather, powerful engine, performance, wood trim, etc. Rather you are getting the "luxury" of exclusivity and whiz-bang technology.

There is not rational cost or ROI justification for luxury purchases. Just as you don't need to rationalize buying a Mercedes instead of a Camry, you don't need to rationalize a Volt.

jeff

 

[LS2JSTS]

In some states you can get a special rate for off peak charging, or a flat fee for a monthly charge.

In Michigan some utilities have a $40/per month flat fee, or you can opt for a off peak rate of .07695 per kWh. That rate applies to charging M-F 11pm-9am, and all day on Sat, Sun., includes all distribution charges and excludes taxes.

 

[LS2JSTS]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Well, here in South Florida, we have reasonable electric rates, about 12 cents per KWH for the first tier, inclusive of taxes/fees. Then it goes up to about 20 cents in tier 2. I "touch" tier 2 most months, I suppose that's by design.

So, a Volt, with 12 KWH (or slightly more) use per full charge. That's about $2.40 (or slightly more) for a full charge, for me.




Your calculation here is off a bit. The required kWh for a full recharges is less than 12 kWh.

The reason is that the Volt battery never goes below @40% capacity, and never charges to full 100% capacity. The 30-40 miles you get with a "full charge" is the mileage you get by using roughly 50-60% of the batteries capacity. A full recharge for a fully depleted to 40% 16 kWh battery, assuming 10% inefficiencies, should be less than 10kWh.

 

[Cujet]

Volt owners are seeing 12.2 KWH consumption for a full charge. Don't forget the small inefficiencies of the charger and the batteries accepting the charge.

The "sticker" price was $46,142. Leather seats, $1000 paint, nav system and so on. The base model was not so nice.

I did mention the fact that it was "nice" did I not?

 

[LS2JSTS]

It appears that the battery pack is using more like 65% of the total capacity then, right? At least that appears to be the theory in that thread started by the 12 kWh guy.

Did you notice the other chart where the guys average recharge numbers were well below that. I wonder myself if there isn't two different ECM programs out there for the battery pack.