Super Tech 20W50 VS Diesel rated 15W40

[repairman54]

Houston weather, I would say no lower than a 15w bottom number in the heat. I run M1 15-50w in my HD in summer heat.
No need for 0w bottom numbers at all in the south. I run 0-40w in my 1200cc 4S snowmobiles so they start in -30F winter temps.

 

[z71bill]

View attachment 160778

Sure. Kohler recommends their expensive, high margin marketing partnership oil. But if you don't run their oil, they don't recommend anything but a 30 weight. Go ahead and run 20w50 supertech if you want.

I simply said I'd never do it.

I really understand what you are saying about 50 weight. Like I indicated in the OP - I have gone on the record stating I would never use it unless the manufacturer specified it.

I started a thread a while back asking if using a lighter weight oil like 5W30 would be a better choice over something like a 15W40 when running a generator in hot outdoor temperatures - AS LONG AS YOU CHANGED THE OIL EVERDAY.

My theory was if you are running a week straight without an oil change you must use a heavy oil because it doesn't break down as fast - so it will protect your engine where a 5W30 would be toast after a few days and would cause engine failure.

Here is a link to it. We really agree more than we disagree.

Viscosity and hours between oil changes in small air cooled engines.

I have spent a fair amount of time researching oil - trying to pick one for my air cooled Honda EG2800i generator. It will likely be used for a few days straight when outside temps are in the 90-98 degree range. (Houston area hurricane driven power outage) On one hand I think - use a 5W30 full...

bobistheoilguy.com

What got me to grab the 20W50 was the forecast of some days being 99-100 degrees. How hot will my 6.5 HP air cooled Kohler get running 4 hours straight at wide open throttle?

I understand you wouldn't want to do it - but what is your concern? That the oil will be so thick it can't properly lubricate the moving parts?




Their chart really doesn't add up - If 10W50 and 10W30 are GTG then why not 10W40?

If SAE 30 is OK over 50 degrees - and 10W50 is also good then why not 15W40 above 30 degrees or 20W50 above 40 degrees?

They are just lazy and are not really trying to show all possibilities. Like they are dumbing it down to the point a person with no understanding of oil can figure it out.

I have sometimes wondered about these oil charts you find in most owners manuals.

Some like this one will say 10W30 is good for most temps but 5W30 is only for cold weather. I am asuming they are using conventional oil. Like they have not updated the chart since 1970.

I see some are now showing 5W30 synthetic for all temps.

 

[RDY4WAR]

You see no reason for a 40 weight oil but recommend 0W40 which is a 40 weight oil.

When it is over 90 degrees outside - I can't see any benefit of a 0W anything.

I don't see a reason for the 40 grade. He was discussing 40 and 50 grades that are less than stellar so I made a recommendation for a 40 grade off the shelf that's at least worth the dollar value if he's just dead set on running a 40 grade. Forget the 0W-xx rating, that particular oil (Mobil 1 FS Euro 0W-40) is about the best bang for your buck off the store shelf. It's less volatile than either of the 2 options in the OP and quite shear stable in KRL. The Euro spec add pack also has more ZDDP, more detergents, higher TBN, and better foam prevention.

Ideally, that engine would live a long and happy life, with less viscous losses, on any decent 30 grade, but convincing people to go down in viscosity usually bears no fruit no matter how valid the argument.

I've monitored the oil temps in a B&S 6.5 HP engine, and it didn't care if the ambient temp was 40°F or 95°F. The operating oil temp was 250-260°F regardless. I don't think the oil cares much how hot it is outside when it's passing through a 300°F bearing and splashing on a 450°F cylinder wall.

 

[ArthurArgentum]

better foam prevention.

but It's quite droll how the average ILSAC oil (GF-6 with a genuine API license) consistently outperforms ACEA A3 and C3 formulations in terms of ASTM D6082. It's something worth pondering why

 

[RDY4WAR]

My theory was if you are running a week straight without an oil change you must use a heavy oil because it doesn't break down as fast - so it will protect your engine where a 5W30 would be toast after a few days and would cause engine failure.

Eh... No. Sure, you get more viscosity headroom, but I would rather have an oil that starts at 11.0 cSt and ends at 11.0 cSt than one that starts at 14.0 cSt and ends at 11.0 cSt. The quality of the base oil rather than the viscosity. The engine likely doesn't care that much about viscosity. You could put a 0W-16 in it and it would likely live just fine. I focus much more on the quality of the base oil. Being air-cooled, head and cylinder temperatures will be hotter than with a water cooled engine. This means the oil is more susceptible to evaporation, piston deposits, and ring coking. In such a case, I would much rather have a 5W-30 with
Just because it's a narrower spread doesn't mean it's less volatile and more stable. It's usually the opposite as the blender can get away with cheaper, more volatile base oils and still meet the spec. It's especially true comparing conventional to synthetic. Rotella T4 15W-40 has a Noack of 11.7%. That's pathetic. Mobil 1 FS Euro 0W-40 is 8.8% despite the much wider spread. I personally use HPL PCMO 10W-20 in my small engines which is 3.4%. They run smooth and quiet. I put 0W-20 in some built kart engines that run WOT the entire race, hitting 7-8k rpm, and go a full season on an engine.

 

[userfriendly]

Eh... No. Sure, you get more viscosity headroom, but I would rather have an oil that starts at 11.0 cSt and ends at 11.0 cSt than one that starts at 14.0 cSt and ends at 11.0 cSt. The quality of the base oil rather than the viscosity. The engine likely doesn't care that much about viscosity. You could put a 0W-16 in it and it would likely live just fine. I focus much more on the quality of the base oil. Being air-cooled, head and cylinder temperatures will be hotter than with a water cooled engine. This means the oil is more susceptible to evaporation, piston deposits, and ring coking. In such a case, I would much rather have a 5W-30 with
Just because it's a narrower spread doesn't mean it's less volatile and more stable. It's usually the opposite as the blender can get away with cheaper, more volatile base oils and still meet the spec. It's especially true comparing conventional to synthetic. Rotella T4 15W-40 has a Noack of 11.7%. That's pathetic. Mobil 1 FS Euro 0W-40 is 8.8% despite the much wider spread. I personally use HPL PCMO 10W-20 in my small engines which is 3.4%. They run smooth and quiet. I put 0W-20 in some built kart engines that run WOT the entire race, hitting 7-8k rpm, and go a full season on an engine.

Quite the rant for a $600 pressure washer.
You are making a case for Delo 400 SAE 30 or 40 @ $3.50 a quart.

 

[RDY4WAR]

I'm sorry that I like to treat my engines to good oil. I suppose if you view your small engines as expendable, then why come on here asking about it? Just throw the used oil from the car in it and forget about it.

 

[z71bill]

Quite the rant for a $600 pressure washer.
You are making a case for Delo 400 SAE 30 or 40 @ $3.50 a quart.

It was a close out from Sam's Club - $249

Now it is $380

Let us know you're not a robot - Sam's Club

www.samsclub.com

Some of the reviews are horrible - if I would have read them I wouldn't have bought it - impulse purchase and I figure if it lasts one more season I will be way ahead $$ VS hiring someone to do it.

I think the pump will go out before the engine wears out - but I can buy a new pump for under $100.

 

[z71bill]

I don't see a reason for the 40 grade. He was discussing 40 and 50 grades that are less than stellar so I made a recommendation for a 40 grade off the shelf that's at least worth the dollar value if he's just dead set on running a 40 grade. Forget the 0W-xx rating, that particular oil (Mobil 1 FS Euro 0W-40) is about the best bang for your buck off the store shelf. It's less volatile than either of the 2 options in the OP and quite shear stable in KRL. The Euro spec add pack also has more ZDDP, more detergents, higher TBN, and better foam prevention.

Ideally, that engine would live a long and happy life, with less viscous losses, on any decent 30 grade, but convincing people to go down in viscosity usually bears no fruit no matter how valid the argument.

I've monitored the oil temps in a B&S 6.5 HP engine, and it didn't care if the ambient temp was 40°F or 95°F. The operating oil temp was 250-260°F regardless. I don't think the oil cares much how hot it is outside when it's passing through a 300°F bearing and splashing on a 450°F cylinder wall.

I have a bunch of B&S and Pro Select (Lowes) SAE 30 small engine oil for my back up generator. I was going to crack a jug open but my impulses got the best of me when I saw 20W50 on the shelf.

I have never read anything bad about Super Tech oil.

 

[userfriendly]

I have a bunch of B&S and Pro Select (Lowes) SAE 30 small engine oil for my back up generator. I was going to crack a jug open but my impulses got the best of me when I saw 20W50 on the shelf.

I have never read anything bad about Super Tech oil.

How about a 50/50 blend of your B&S SAE30 and ST 20w50?
My JD X320 stated either 10w40 or 20w50, so I bought 6 of each in Castrol motorcycle oil and made my own 15w40.
It's all gone, so I use Duron or RT 15w40 now.

Like you said, with yard equipment the engines tend to outlast the rest of the machine.

 

[BigCahuna]

So if your only going to use the washer for what, 2-3 days a year?, you can be pretty sure any of the oils mentioned here will more that do what you need. I'd bet your washer will be done in by the pump failing someway, long before the engine quits. So if it only lasts 20 years, will you beat yourself up over it ?.,,

 

[z71bill]

So if your only going to use the washer for what, 2-3 days a year?, you can be pretty sure any of the oils mentioned here will more that do what you need. I'd bet your washer will be done in by the pump failing someway, long before the engine quits. So if it only lasts 20 years, will you beat yourself up over it ?.,,

I am 95% sure the engine will far outlive the pump - but you can buy a new pump for under $100 - 4 bolts to remove and reinstall. The pump size is very common and many companies make them.

I do not like the pump set up - it is sealed and you never change the oil. When I bought it I figured if you took it off there would be a drain but so far I have not found it.

Unlike an electric pressure washer - that shuts off every time you stop spraying - the gas ones just keeps on pumping and eventually water comes out of a relief valve. I try and just keep spraying so it doesn't happen.

Here is a pump for $70 - I would definitely replace the pump if the engine was still good.

https://www.amazon.com/TOOLCY-Shaft-Horizontal-Pressure-2500-3100PSI/dp/B0BFWDDQLJ/ref=sr_1_97?crid=D3F22TIVTEAA&keywords=pressure+washer+pump&qid=1686610106&sprefix=pressure+washer+pump%2Caps%2C142&sr=8-97

 

[z71bill]

How about a 50/50 blend of your B&S SAE30 and ST 20w50?
My JD X320 stated either 10w40 or 20w50, so I bought 6 of each in Castrol motorcycle oil and made my own 15w40.
It's all gone, so I use Duron or RT 15w40 now.

Like you said, with yard equipment the engines tend to outlast the rest of the machine.

I do have a couple quarts of Super Tech SAE HD30 - that would maybe blend better with Super Tech 20W50. But think I will go with straight 20W50.

 

[jeepman3071]

Small engines really aren't picky about oil. Just make sure the oil level is full. I have a customer who runs 5w20 in all of his equipment because he is convinced he gets better fuel economy. From generators to commercial zero turns, and he has been doing it for years.

 

[football]

This is what Briggs and Stratton oil recommendation says:

Vanguard 15W-50 - Varying temperature range. For continuous-use, such as commercial lawn cutting or pressure washing

Houston at 98-99 degrees? A 50 weight is IDEAL.

Pressure washers are high demand, high load. They heat up the oil more than your garden variety mower. Only a commercial mower running non stop in heavy wet grass would be similar.

I had a small engine shop and Briggs added the 50 weight oil recommendation because of too many blown up engines on commercial equipment. They only recommended 30 weight for a decade or two. They modified their recommendation. Why? Real world evidence.

This home owner pressure washer with the sealed pump is a low hour use unit. He probably will use it for 5-10 hours per year. Realistically ANY oil used will be fine, as long as it’s kept full and not allowed to get low. It’s a Honda clone engine and Honda has only ever recommended basic conventional 10W30 oil in these style engines for decades.

The sealed pump is only rated for 50-75 hours before it grenades. At which point he buys a $70 replacement and slaps it on, and good for another 7-8 years.

Starting can be problematic with thicker oil. You have to fight the viscosity from the oil and the pump building pressure and compressing water. For that reason alone, I use synthetic 10W30 or 5W40 oils in MY pressure washers in south Florida. I meticulously maintain my equipment and the oil will never be low. If I was using it daily commercially, I would run Mobil 1 15W50.

 

[z71bill]

Small engines really aren't picky about oil. Just make sure the oil level is full. I have a customer who runs 5w20 in all of his equipment because he is convinced he gets better fuel economy. From generators to commercial zero turns, and he has been doing it for years.

How often does he change the oil?

 

[ripcord]

How often does he change the oil?

And how often does he have to top off?

 

[z71bill]

This is what Briggs and Stratton oil recommendation says:

Vanguard 15W-50 - Varying temperature range. For continuous-use, such as commercial lawn cutting or pressure washing

Houston at 98-99 degrees? A 50 weight is IDEAL.

Pressure washers are high demand, high load. They heat up the oil more than your garden variety mower. Only a commercial mower running non stop in heavy wet grass would be similar.

I had a small engine shop and Briggs added the 50 weight oil recommendation because of too many blown up engines on commercial equipment. They only recommended 30 weight for a decade or two. They modified their recommendation. Why? Real world evidence.

This home owner pressure washer with the sealed pump is a low hour use unit. He probably will use it for 5-10 hours per year. Realistically ANY oil used will be fine, as long as it’s kept full and not allowed to get low. It’s a Honda clone engine and Honda has only ever recommended basic conventional 10W30 oil in these style engines for decades.

The sealed pump is only rated for 50-75 hours before it grenades. At which point he buys a $70 replacement and slaps it on, and good for another 7-8 years.

Starting can be problematic with thicker oil. You have to fight the viscosity from the oil and the pump building pressure and compressing water. For that reason alone, I use synthetic 10W30 or 5W40 oils in MY pressure washers in south Florida. I meticulously maintain my equipment and the oil will never be low. If I was using it daily commercially, I would run Mobil 1 15W50.

Based on my scientific analysis today 95+ degrees the ST 20W50 feels about the same as ST SAE HD30 or Mobil1 5W30.

I shake the bottle of oil and determine if it is more like water or maple syrup -

All three are about the same as far as the shake test goes.

I put a tennis ball under the pressure washer handle to keep it open when I am starting the engine so very little pump back pressure.

The tennis ball also really helps relieve hand pain keeping the lever on for hours at a time. It is easy to push the ball out if I ever need to stop.

 

[ripcord]

That's "way more better" than strapping a bungee around the trigger.

 

[jeepman3071]

How often does he change the oil?

He changes it per the book, so usually 50 hours or annually.

And how often does he have to top off?

Not as much as I initially expected. He has a V-Twin Briggs zero turn, Honda GX snowblower, Honda GCV pressure washer, and a garden tiller with an old Kohler K-series. Uses 5w20 synthetic.


I've thought about trying it with mine, or running just 5w30 synthetic in everything, but I own some old equipment that definitely consumes more oil with the lighter grades, and I have family members who occasionally borrow those pieces of equipment who are not known for their "mechanical awareness".