Suggest a CB radio setup for my truck

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quote:

Originally posted by XS650:
18 feet is 1/2 wave length, so the reflected signal ends up in phase with the signal from the transmitter. It will do no harm and may avoid some signal loss.

18 feet is 1/2 wave length -- in open air.

Signals in coax travel at a slower speed than they do in open air, and the difference is called the "velocity of propagation".

Typical RG-58 coax has a velocity of propagation figure of .63, meaning that signals travel through RG-58 coax at 63% of the speed they do in open air.

Therefore, it would seem to me that in order for this theory to actually work, when using typical RG-58 you'd need to use a coax that is (18*.63) 11.34 feet -- for it takes the signal the same amount of time to travel through 18 feet of air as it does to travel through 11.34 feet of cable.

The length of the coax is indeed critical for phased antenna arrays, but the VOP figure is taken into account to calculate the correct length of coax to be used.
 
quote:

Originally posted by brianl703:

quote:

Originally posted by XS650:
18 feet is 1/2 wave length, so the reflected signal ends up in phase with the signal from the transmitter. It will do no harm and may avoid some signal loss.

18 feet is 1/2 wave length -- in open air.

Signals in coax travel at a slower speed than they do in open air, and the difference is called the "velocity of propagation".


This has all been educational. Thanks Brian and TanSedan for the good info.
 
XS650, You beat me to it. Thanks!

I used to do alot of QRP on 10 meter and 11 meter.I also like off roading. A 102" SS whip and 18' of coax has always given me the best combination of low SWR, broad bandwidth and durability. I have also found that the lowly 102" wip is easy and cheap to tune to other bands and is rather broad banded for 10,11 and 12 meter use. If one adds an antena tuner people might think you had an expensive Outbacker antena.

Top loaded antean pretty much require mounting on mirrors or the use of a multi-mount for hood or doors. THey typicaly are too short to have 1/3 or more of their radiating area above the roof line of the truck if mounted any place else. Very few trucks have steel mirrors to mount to. For Citizen Band radio it is too easy to mount to the corner of the bumber or a stake mout etc....

I have owned K40's and Wilson 1000's...... and they are ok but they all tend to fall apart to quickly. I am sure most of us all started out on CB.

If you like SSB have the clarifer "cliped"(slang). This will alow your transmit to track with recive. If you can afford it consider digital voice compression. It will do more for you then a power mike could hope to do.
 
You all are getting so technical it's making my head spin.
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For a simple application that works well, use a 4'Francis antenna and good quality coax cable. 18' has always worked well for me. No SWRs to set with the Francis antenna. But that's the simplest solution that I can think of that works. You can do this on a budget also.
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Ya .. ya .. ya

On this site we always recommend the simplest . . . such as, "Always find the cheapest possible oil change special; don't worry about it, sheesh, its just oil".

CB (and other tranceiver) JUST as addicting as cars, chronographing bullets, etc.

Simple IS good, but first it must be defined.

Installation quality first (clean power and excellent ground); decent antenna, but BEST mounting location; RG-8 coax, but . . . etc.
 
What seems to work well:
Wilson 1000 mag mount. Depending on age of vehicle, clear coat paint, etc. the antenna may be tuned properly setting the whip all the way down in the holder. The thicker paint may require pulling the whip up a little bit. SWR will most likely be under 1.5, usually close to 1.1. I used to run a Kon-Nection 500 mag mount antenna, with the optional ground planes. Looked wicked, seemed to work better. I was the only person around with such a setup. Also had a "little helper" under the seat.
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Got out 10-15 miles easy, maybe 20 depending on lack of interference.
 
OK Ive got a Uniden PC122XL radio for free. I just need to get the power to cig lighter cord and probably a Wilson Antenna, either a Little Wil or a 500 or 1000. I think I will just mount it on top of the truck since I wont be parking in the garage much in the near future. IS it bad to have a wire connection outside of the truck? Like underneath where a rubber grommet comes through under the cab? I would prefer to run a wire from the CB to outside under the cab, then attach the antenna under the cab so I could remove it and just leave the other wire inside the cab. If I put a connection under the cab, should I just wrap it with duct tape or something?

Thanks again...
fl-400s
 
A Uniden Grant is not that big since the re-design and it has rock solid SSB! Galaxy 949,959 are also great buys and are rock solid FCC type aproved radio's. The Cobra's are not made by Uniden any more and are not as solid! THe PLL they use now is horrable unstable in SSB especialy as they heatup. The Cobra's are also suffering a lot since RCI bought them in terms of quality control.

I would never co-phase becasue you truly can not get the antena's far enough apart to properly co=phase them.They are also harder to tune and have more coax issues due to the large number of shoty cophase setups. You also should not do it unless you only want to talk to people in front of you and behind you. A good omidirectional antena and quatity coax will get the job done with one antena 99% of the time. IF you can get 3/4 of the antena above the roof line helicaly wound antean's like FireStik are convient especialy with the tuneable tip! FireStick and other antena makers claim that you do not need that much above the cab with a top loaded design but I think they work best that way. The 5' Firstick is a great performer and the 4' one will work in a pinch. If you can not get 3/4 of the antena above the roof line I like the trusty old 102" stainless steel wip match that to 18' of coax and no springs or cheep mounts and you are styling! If you have to use a magnetic mount I have good results with wilson 3000 and 5000 magnetic mount antena's

What ever you do do not let any butchers cut out limiters in the radio!! It is one thing to modify by addition or substition of componets is quite another to use dikes to modify. If the tech does not have a signial generator and a scope on his work bench you need to grab you radio and run!

A well setup voice compresser like the old FR-1A(sp) is good and can help on AM and SSB to help break through pile up's! Stay far far away from super swing or modulator mod's. Un locking the clarifer is good if you do a lot of SSB and work a club.

Galaxy has a newer design FCC Type approved CB radio with SSB that is much smaller then a full size chasis. It is designed to fit in the premolded cut-out area of some big rigs I thinkthe volvo's but I am not sure. It is about the slightly larger then a Cobra 25 but smaller then a Cobra 29 LTD.
 
Fl400's THose old Uniden PC122's were great in my book! THeir are plenty of modification site for them and they were solid performers! THey were the perfect size for most cars! I used to take a lot of heat for likeing those PC122's but I still wish they made them! It is hard to find a compact SSB radio that is built on a compact chasis and is FCC type apporved for CB. Most of the compact Chasis SSB radio's are export types!
 
quote:

Originally posted by JohnBrowning:
Fl400's THose old Uniden PC122's were great in my book! THeir are plenty of modification site for them and they were solid performers! THey were the perfect size for most cars! I used to take a lot of heat for likeing those PC122's but I still wish they made them! It is hard to find a compact SSB radio that is built on a compact chasis and is FCC type apporved for CB. Most of the compact Chasis SSB radio's are export types!

I have 2 pC122 units sitting in the garage! Never out of the box.
 
A couple of comments -

John's right about not letting people tinker with radios without real alignment equipment. With voice radios you're looking for modulation, not just signal strength. You want to maximize the undistorted modulation. That will get you much farther than large increases in output power. Output power increases by people who don't quite know what they're doing often accomplish nothing more than generating higher amplitude unmodulated carrier.

I also understand his reasoning behind wanting a large whip antenna although I've never used one myself.

Remember, it's not just the impedence match you're looking for with an antenna but you want it to be an effective radiator. Antenna length is likely to give you that if the system is designed correctly. There's no real replacement for lots of aluminum in the air.

A friend and I used to talk all the time on 10 meters across town using only dummy loads for antennas. Great match, but not much for propagation. Enough to get 15 blocks with 100 watts though.
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Thats an extreme example of a great match and a poor radiator but you get the idea.

Brian is right to point out the coax velocity factors. Keep in mind it's different for every coax type. I never bought into the 18' coax length but that's because I've not used antennas that aren't really tunable like the typical 102" whip. On those antennas you have limited adjustability so since the feedline is really a part of the antenna system, it's useful to have a coax length that gets you close to a correct impedance match on a typical installation.

Me, for a CB I've got an old Cobra 146 SSB rig with a lighter adapter and some no name mag mount for the car. I use it on trips when I know I'm going to be with people who also have CB's and don't bother with it the rest of the time. I did use it in the house with a base antenna for a while and have worked both coasts with it on sideband. But that's easy on 11 meters when the band's open...

jsharp - KE9JR - extra class amateur.
 
Jsharp,I really like SSB on CB but in the last 10 years or so it has really gone to the dog's here in Michigan! I need to break down and get liscensed so I can run some 10 and 12 meter voice! Sooner or latter it will move up my things to do list! I am not a big a beliver in 18' of coax except with a 102" whip. It just seems to provide a SWR of 1.5 or less 99% of the time. I figure why reinvent the wheel! WHat normaly get CB users in trouble is the cheap springs,cheap coax, poor ground and poor location choice.

I used to reduce my power to 1/4-1 watt when talking SSB with some of my friends! I always figured the FCC would not mind me useing less power! Nothing I hate more then noise toys, poorly done swing mods.,cut limiters and misaligned radio's!!! Used scopes are not expensive at all and niether is a decent signal generator!!! I was looking through a catalog the other day and one kit radio I saw actualy has most of the needed test equipment designed into it. This means that you need less gear to test it! I thought that that rig would be perfect for someone like a boy trying to get his Amature Merit badge in BoyScouts etc.....
 
quote:

Originally posted by JohnBrowning:
Jsharp,I really like SSB on CB but in the last 10 years or so it has really gone to the dog's here in Michigan! I need to break down and get liscensed so I can run some 10 and 12 meter voice!.

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To bad John, whenever I see your name I think of the Browning Mark IV tube set I have collecting dust in the closit. I am thinking of putting it up on ebay. Ever think of owning a Browning. I also had a Tram D201A at one time.

I have my ticket but I still like the smell of those old tube sets. It is hard to beat an old tram or browning mobile unit with a dynamic mic. I have a little Browning brownie that keys 4 watts and swings about 11 watts. It is the loudest of my mobiles. They too are collecting dust in the closet.
 
quote:

Originally posted by JohnBrowning:
Jsharp,I really like SSB on CB but in the last 10 years or so it has really gone to the dog's here in Michigan! I need to break down and get liscensed so I can run some 10 and 12 meter voice! Sooner or latter it will move up my things to do list! I am not a big a beliver in 18' of coax except with a 102" whip. It just seems to provide a SWR of 1.5 or less 99% of the time. I figure why reinvent the wheel! WHat normaly get CB users in trouble is the cheap springs,cheap coax, poor ground and poor location choice.

I used to reduce my power to 1/4-1 watt when talking SSB with some of my friends! I always figured the FCC would not mind me useing less power! Nothing I hate more then noise toys, poorly done swing mods.,cut limiters and misaligned radio's!!! Used scopes are not expensive at all and niether is a decent signal generator!!! I was looking through a catalog the other day and one kit radio I saw actualy has most of the needed test equipment designed into it. This means that you need less gear to test it! I thought that that rig would be perfect for someone like a boy trying to get his Amature Merit badge in BoyScouts etc.....


Going
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You can work the world on 10 or 11 meters with 10 watts on sideband if the band is open and you have decent antennas. Read up on grayline propagation. Just follow the sun and the opening will move with it. I've talked to New Zealand and Australia many times with no power by waiting until about 2:00 AM.

I wish I'd have gotten into radios earlier in life. I played with CB's in the 70's and 80's, then got my ticket in the late 80's. Was gung ho for about 5 years, worked about 200 countries, mostly on 20 meters, but had to tear everything down when I moved. I've been here 10 years and still haven't got anything up.

Another thing to do if I ever retire...
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