Subaru’s Contradictory Oil Recommendation.....

Originally Posted by Linctex
Originally Posted by racin4ds
I personally like Subaru's engineers and their subtle "hints" used over the years. They say what many of us already know... if you plan to run it hard and drive spirited, use anything other than the watered down 0W20. If you're grampa trying to eek out every MPG and follow CAFE regulation, use the 0W20....


Pretty much exactly what i was thinking


When the WRX crown almost universally "accepted" Rotella T6 5W-40 as their "go-to" oil, I'm sure Subi engineers nodded theirs heads in collective approval


This right here...
 
With temps at 0 or below 0 last night and with 50/50 mix of 0w20 and 5w30, the car started right up. No hesitation or noise.
Anybody have FB engine with 5w30 and these temps, what's your experiance.
 
Originally Posted by Miller88
Originally Posted by IndyIan
Originally Posted by Miller88
I do wish there were more available options. I'd like coolant temperature too.

I have oil temp, throttle position and trip time.

What's your oil temp run at normally? If I ran the manuals cruising rpm it would be maybe at 210F?. It seems very rpm dependent.
I haven't tried my Ultra Gauge on the Outback yet, as I don't drive it that much, and I found it caused to blank out the Focus's dash once in a while(all warning lights on, no ODO,speedo, or rpm), so I don't use it unless I have a specific issue I'm looking for.


210 or so I have had it up to 225 on the highway during a higher speed run. The highest I saw was 240 or so during a very steep hill climb in the snow where the engine was between 3500 and 4500 RPM for like 7 or 8 minutes


I just returned from a "sprint" to central Illinois and back over the past three days.

As expected, the Outback ran fine and the adaptive cruise control, though I thought I would hate it, seemed to favor 78-80 mph over and back.

The oil temp stayed at a steady 214 degrees F.
 
Originally Posted by blupupher
Originally Posted by Brigadier
You want confusing oil requirements? Buy a Hyundai....

Why is that?
My (and your) 2018 Santa Fe is pretty clear, use any API Service SM *3, ILSAC GF-4 (or above), ACEA A5 (or above) oil.
It gives you a range of viscosities based on temps. 5w-30 or 5w-40 for all temps, 10w-30 for temps that are not below 0°F.


It has similar wording to the Subaru regarding fuel economy vs protection:
Quote
Engine oil viscosity (thickness) has an effect on fuel economy and cold weather operating (engine start and engine oil flowability).
Lower viscosity engine oils can provide better fuel economy and cold weather performance, however, higher viscosity engine oils are required for satisfactory lubrication in hot weather.
Using oils of any viscosity other than those recommended could result in engine damage.

When choosing an oil, consider the range of temperature your vehicle will be operated in before the next oil change.
Proceed to select the recommended oil viscosity from the chart.

The chart does say use 5w-30 for better fuel economy.

My sisters 2010 Santa Fe with the 2.4 says similar, except the viscosities are 5w-20 or 5w-30 for any temp, 10w-30 for above 0°F, and the chart does say use 5w-20 for fuel economy.

I find it pretty simple to choose oil for this.

What is that? "Above" does NOT exists in ACEA specifications. ACEA A3/B3 B4 and C3 are probably most sophisticated oils in the world, yet they are "below" ACEA A5.
 
I love the hypocrisy here... "I would run what the manual tells you while under the warranty period" AKA a 20wt for a lot of applications.
Then once out of warranty run a 0w40 or your engine will suffer a shorter lifespan because it's the only weight that can offer you protection.
lol.gif


We have had 20wt oils for over a decade and there aren't massive failures or reduced engine lifespans. (Some one off situations like Ford changing certain performance applications to 30wt from 20wt sure but this isn't every OE and every application)

Further a lot of OE's have engine oil coolers in one form or another to control oil temperatures more tightly so it makes it a non-issue in any non-performance or heavy hauling situations.

If they want you to run a 30wt like in some TGDI situations they will call for it. If they want you to stress out about HTHS numbers they would specify using an particular spec that would ensure these requirements are met.

Everyone gets so stressed out by running something other than a 20wt or something with less than 3.5 HTHS and virtually everyone in that group will never see any benefit of running a thicker oil even if they keep their vehicles well past the junk points of 200K miles.

How many engines out there are running bottom basic dino oil past the OCI's it should be and they all seem to make it a long time as well. The average Jiffy Boob customer doesn't know a thing about the benefits of synthetic, better base-stocks and additives, HTHS or even why a thicker weight might be a better choice. Heck most don't even crack their manuals. They wait for the idiot light to tell them it's time to spend money somewhere and they will get to it when they have time. I assure you they aren't looking up ACEA specifications and international owners manuals to see what others are using.
smirk2.gif


Now if you want to experiment with different weights and different oils and trend them on UOA's for your own hobby and interests no problem, if you want to use something because it helps you sleep at night no problem but stop the mass hysteria, panic and fear around using the thinner oils.
 
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Originally Posted by ofelas
Or there's me, who changes Amzearl at 6mo intervals when I'm bored...
crackmeup2.gif


But that causes increased wear...
lol.gif
 
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the CAFE requirements to list the oil grade used to achieve mpg in government testing as the only oil to use. Hence the 0w-20 on the chart.

I believe that Subaru's other suggestions throughout the manual indicate that a thicker oil will better protect in all conditions. This is similar to the Toyota manual in that respect.
 
Originally Posted by blupupher
Originally Posted by Brigadier
You want confusing oil requirements? Buy a Hyundai....

Why is that?
My (and your) 2018 Santa Fe is pretty clear, use any API Service SM *3, ILSAC GF-4 (or above), ACEA A5 (or above) oil.
It gives you a range of viscosities based on temps. 5w-30 or 5w-40 for all temps, 10w-30 for temps that are not below 0°F.


It has similar wording to the Subaru regarding fuel economy vs protection:
Quote
Engine oil viscosity (thickness) has an effect on fuel economy and cold weather operating (engine start and engine oil flowability).
Lower viscosity engine oils can provide better fuel economy and cold weather performance, however, higher viscosity engine oils are required for satisfactory lubrication in hot weather.
Using oils of any viscosity other than those recommended could result in engine damage.

When choosing an oil, consider the range of temperature your vehicle will be operated in before the next oil change.
Proceed to select the recommended oil viscosity from the chart.

The chart does say use 5w-30 for better fuel economy.

My sisters 2010 Santa Fe with the 2.4 says similar, except the viscosities are 5w-20 or 5w-30 for any temp, 10w-30 for above 0°F, and the chart does say use 5w-20 for fuel economy.

I find it pretty simple to choose oil for this.



OK. Show me an API SM /ILSAC GF-4 oil that is A5.....Show me a 5W40 or 10W30 that is A5....

Can you even buy API SM/ILSAC GF-4 oils in the USA anymore?

So, what spec are you going to to by?

If an oil is SN/GF-5, that is better than SM/GF-4, but then it probably will NOT be A5.....is it still useable?
 
Originally Posted by JLTD
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the CAFE requirements to list the oil grade used to achieve mpg in government testing as the only oil to use. Hence the 0w-20 on the chart.

I believe that Subaru's other suggestions throughout the manual indicate that a thicker oil will better protect in all conditions. This is similar to the Toyota manual in that respect.

I don't know if that's necessarily the case. The owner's manual for my 2004 WRX said to use 5W-30, 10W-30, or 10W-40 on the main chart. However, it was pretty well known that it came with some special 5W-40 from the factory with some sort of additive for break-in. The owner's manual said to change it at exactly 3000 miles unless it was 4 months since delivery.

It also had a supplementary set of oil choices for towing or hot climates - like 30, 40, 20W-50, or 20W-40. But it basically only told me that many cars are tolerant of more than just what the manufacturer recommends for normal duty. However, I'm not sure it necessarily holds that thicker oil protects much better under all conditions.
 
I'm way ahead of the curve.

I only buy used filters, and step up to 20w50 on all vehicles to compensate for any extra wear.

Only after warranty, naturally.

Originally Posted by StevieC
Originally Posted by ofelas
Or there's me, who changes Amzearl at 6mo intervals when I'm bored...
crackmeup2.gif


But that causes increased wear...
lol.gif
 
My wife just got a 2019 Outback 2.5 company car.

The oil filler cap says 0w20. The manual says 0w20 is best for cold weather starting and is the factory fill, but that 5w30 or 5w40 are also acceptable. It further says conventional or synthetic oil can be used with no adverse effects. OCI is 12,500km (7,800 miles).

It's a fleet car, so I'll never know or care what oil it gets...but I'd wager the dealers here use 5w30.
 
Yes, it's very contradictory. (Try to use 0w20 whenever possible, but thicker oil is better in hot weather.)

Somewhat the same verbiage as my moms 4Runner. Use 0w20. If 0w20 isn't available, a 5w20 can be used, but you must use a 0w20 next time. Going up in viscosity is okay if it's used for towing.

I'd personally run a 5w30 or 5w40.
 
Originally Posted by Tones
My 3.6R is doing fine on the Mobil 1 5W-30 so far (only 10k miles). I figure if it starts burning oil I will switch it to the 10W-30. Engine is great in this car. Touchy throttle though. I barely tap it and the car really takes off. However, I'm still trying to figure out the dipstick. There are two very faint lines between the two holes. I'm not whether to use the lines or the holes.


17 3.6 and doing 8k oci with Mobil 1 5-30. UOA posted a while back. About 50k now and doing great. I keep wondering about a 0-40 but crazy to change what's working so we'll to this point.
 
Originally Posted by dkryan
We have a 2019 Outback with the 2.5L (non-turbo/non-DI) engine. The warranty OCI is 6k miles. In reading the owner's manual (mostly to figure out the technology) I came across the following pages in re: oil.

First, on page 11-13, read the "Note" at the lower left side.

I am NOT posting this to re-ignite the "thin versus thick" bonfire.

However, I interpret that statement to ask, "do you want fuel economy or protection?"

Now look at the right column under "Synthetic Oil," and read the first sentence.

On page 12-4, read the second bullet point under the second note. It re-affirms the statement on page 11-13.

On page 12-5, Subaru is pushing the use of 0w-20. However, they claim conventional oil can be used in viscosities of 5w-30 or 5w-40.

That 2.5L supposedly has a long timing chain. My friend with a 2015 Legacy 2.5L was told by the service manager that synthetic oil was required in order to protect the timing chain.

Oddly enough, the 2019 3.6L engine specs 5w-30 conventional oil.

I plan to use Platinum Ultra 5w-30 after the factory fill is changed.





Agree, your doing the right thing by using a 5w30.
This stuff drives me nuts in this forum, but again, we most likely are a little nuts being in here :eek:)

When will others realize the ONLY reason there is 5/20 and 0/20 oil is because the US government wants better gas mileage from the manufacturers and every TINY bit helps, the consumers will not notice anything, its the average score of all vehicles combined.

Anyway, yes, ANY 5w/30 oil is the best choice, anything less is better for the manufacturer NOT the engine.
 
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Subaru back dated oil change interval from 7500 to 6000 miles due to oil use or leaking. My company had a bunch of Subaru outback as company cars and the engines were blowing .....no oil. Guys weren't checking the oil.
Syn oil can go past 6000 miles very easily as long as you monitor the oil level. I have 50/50 0w20 and 0w30 in now and will first take it to 4000 miles and then check it once a month till 6000, change to 5w30 then do the same thing till 8000 miles.i looked at the EU Subaru sites and 5w30, 0w40, 5w40 are good out to 15k which is 9200 miles. And I'm going to use a Purolater Boss filter
 
This is interesting. I have a 2018 Traverse that wants Dexos 5w-30. I also have a 2016 Outback with the 2.5l . Would be nice to use 1 oil for both.
 
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