stuff ending up in landfills due to bad design
- Thread starter Rick in PA
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Originally Posted By: Charlie1935
My dad brought a window fan in the late 1940's that would cool the whole house down in the evening. I still have it and it works good as ever. I did have to put a new cord on it about 30 years ago. Other than that a little 3 in 1 oil once every year or two is all it's needed.
Mom raised cain because he payer 25 or so dollars for it.
That would be about $250 in today's dollars.
My dad brought a window fan in the late 1940's that would cool the whole house down in the evening. I still have it and it works good as ever. I did have to put a new cord on it about 30 years ago. Other than that a little 3 in 1 oil once every year or two is all it's needed.
Mom raised cain because he payer 25 or so dollars for it.
That would be about $250 in today's dollars.
Originally Posted By: expat
Can anybody cite An instance of intentional Bad design. Honestly, planned obselesance?
I often suspect it, but never known it to be intentional.
Anything made by BMW. Rofl.
Can anybody cite An instance of intentional Bad design. Honestly, planned obselesance?
I often suspect it, but never known it to be intentional.
Anything made by BMW. Rofl.
Originally Posted By: expat
Can anybody cite An instance of intentional Bad design. Honestly, planned obselesance?
I often suspect it, but never known it to be intentional.
Homo sapiens
Can anybody cite An instance of intentional Bad design. Honestly, planned obselesance?
I often suspect it, but never known it to be intentional.
Homo sapiens
Originally Posted By: expat
Can anybody cite An instance of intentional Bad design. Honestly, planned obselesance?
I often suspect it, but never known it to be intentional.
Look at the stuff that burned out prematurely (even by today's standards) by those cheesy chinese capacitors drying out and exploding. Like those Dell Optiplexes that barely made it through warranty. They know when they spec a cap that eventually it won't have any "headroom" then won't be able to do even its basic duty.
Another way you can have stuff break is to use low-lead solder that gets micro-fissures and causes intermittent issues. Sure it's good for the environment, but they aren't crying over its going kablooey either.
Even look at plastic tabs for vehicle harness connectors or remote control battery covers. Depending on how much "softener" they put in the plastic or how quickly it degrades, the tabs will get brittle and snap. The user who snaps it will feel the guilt even though it was designed to do this!
Can anybody cite An instance of intentional Bad design. Honestly, planned obselesance?
I often suspect it, but never known it to be intentional.
Look at the stuff that burned out prematurely (even by today's standards) by those cheesy chinese capacitors drying out and exploding. Like those Dell Optiplexes that barely made it through warranty. They know when they spec a cap that eventually it won't have any "headroom" then won't be able to do even its basic duty.
Another way you can have stuff break is to use low-lead solder that gets micro-fissures and causes intermittent issues. Sure it's good for the environment, but they aren't crying over its going kablooey either.
Even look at plastic tabs for vehicle harness connectors or remote control battery covers. Depending on how much "softener" they put in the plastic or how quickly it degrades, the tabs will get brittle and snap. The user who snaps it will feel the guilt even though it was designed to do this!
Lsst summer I replaced the 20 yr old HVAC blower in my Ford truck. Was in a hurry so I simply drove to NAPA and got the China replacement rather than driving to Spokane 2 hrs away. That blower should will be in the nearby landfill in a few weeks...should have got the Ford one.
Originally Posted By: Tucson Five-O
Now we live in a disposable society. And it's worse here in the US, because we accept it and don't demand better. And until we stop accepting it, products won't improve.
Just my 2¢,
Gary
The low cost manufacturing techniques that have made a disposable society have produced a far better standard of living for the overwhelming majority of folks, and given them access to a wide variety of products they would not otherwise have.
I have a lot of stuff made when things were built to last, but how many people can pay $7000 for a radio receiver, which, if adjusted for inflation, is what a top quality radio receiver from the 1950's would cost in today's dollars?
So a relative handful of the products failing early and heading to the landfill before their time seems like not a bad tradeoff.
I do wish that we were making more of it here, but our government has always enabled cheap imports at the expense of domestic industry. First the stuff from western Europe and Japan after the war, then NAFTA, and now southeast Asia.
That's the real tragedy.
Now we live in a disposable society. And it's worse here in the US, because we accept it and don't demand better. And until we stop accepting it, products won't improve.
Just my 2¢,
Gary
The low cost manufacturing techniques that have made a disposable society have produced a far better standard of living for the overwhelming majority of folks, and given them access to a wide variety of products they would not otherwise have.
I have a lot of stuff made when things were built to last, but how many people can pay $7000 for a radio receiver, which, if adjusted for inflation, is what a top quality radio receiver from the 1950's would cost in today's dollars?
So a relative handful of the products failing early and heading to the landfill before their time seems like not a bad tradeoff.
I do wish that we were making more of it here, but our government has always enabled cheap imports at the expense of domestic industry. First the stuff from western Europe and Japan after the war, then NAFTA, and now southeast Asia.
That's the real tragedy.
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Does anyone think that the new digital TVs following the ATSC standard will use the same (MPEG-2) protocol for 60 years, like NTSC TVs did?
The .264 codec already fits 2x the stuff in the same data stream.
Doubt it. Younger generations prefer mobile video streaming viewing on smart phones and tablets.
Does anyone think that the new digital TVs following the ATSC standard will use the same (MPEG-2) protocol for 60 years, like NTSC TVs did?
The .264 codec already fits 2x the stuff in the same data stream.
Doubt it. Younger generations prefer mobile video streaming viewing on smart phones and tablets.
The problem I see is that things are now "out of fashion" before they are broken, so the women in the house want them gone before they are broken, so why bother paying for more quality with more money?
I once heard from a family friend that told me to get IKEA particle board furniture, because "you'll have more excuse to get new one" when your old one breaks.
I once heard from a family friend that told me to get IKEA particle board furniture, because "you'll have more excuse to get new one" when your old one breaks.
Originally Posted By: Charlie1935
My dad brought a window fan in the late 1940's that would cool the whole house down in the evening. I still have it and it works good as ever. I did have to put a new cord on it about 30 years ago. Other than that a little 3 in 1 oil once every year or two is all it's needed.
Mom raised cain because he payer 25 or so dollars for it.
And how much energy does it use?
My dad brought a window fan in the late 1940's that would cool the whole house down in the evening. I still have it and it works good as ever. I did have to put a new cord on it about 30 years ago. Other than that a little 3 in 1 oil once every year or two is all it's needed.
Mom raised cain because he payer 25 or so dollars for it.
And how much energy does it use?
Originally Posted By: 123Saab
Originally Posted By: Charlie1935
My dad brought a window fan in the late 1940's that would cool the whole house down in the evening. I still have it and it works good as ever. I did have to put a new cord on it about 30 years ago. Other than that a little 3 in 1 oil once every year or two is all it's needed.
Mom raised cain because he payer 25 or so dollars for it.
And how much energy does it use?
It likely uses more, however the extra cost is negated by the fact that he doesn't have to keep buying multiple chinese junk units because they fail every couple of years, or don't perform in a satisfactory manner.
Originally Posted By: Charlie1935
My dad brought a window fan in the late 1940's that would cool the whole house down in the evening. I still have it and it works good as ever. I did have to put a new cord on it about 30 years ago. Other than that a little 3 in 1 oil once every year or two is all it's needed.
Mom raised cain because he payer 25 or so dollars for it.
And how much energy does it use?
It likely uses more, however the extra cost is negated by the fact that he doesn't have to keep buying multiple chinese junk units because they fail every couple of years, or don't perform in a satisfactory manner.
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I found a multi-speed fan that somebody had dumped. It's from the 30's/40's. I guess Grandma or Grandpa had died and they were cleaning out the junk.
I took it home 'cause it looked cool. Cleaned it up, fixed the plug end. Have been using it for years. Moves a LOT of air. Oscilates. Cast iron base, so is very heavy.
It will never wear out. My great grandchildren will be using it.
I took it home 'cause it looked cool. Cleaned it up, fixed the plug end. Have been using it for years. Moves a LOT of air. Oscilates. Cast iron base, so is very heavy.
It will never wear out. My great grandchildren will be using it.
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
What I have noticed is that even if you WANT to pay for better quality or durability and design, you almost have an impossible task finding it.
Or it's mail order only.
What I have noticed is that even if you WANT to pay for better quality or durability and design, you almost have an impossible task finding it.
Or it's mail order only.
Originally Posted By: Rick in PA
I have a window air conditioner that developed a rattly-nonworking fan. Took it apart. The plastic blower wheel had broken at the hub. There was a spring clamp securing the hub to the shaft, but the shaft was flatted (like for a set screw). The shaft should have been full round. I suspect that the compression of the spring clamp deformed the plastic on the flat, stressing the plastic, causing failure. During my Internet search for a replacement blower wheel (none available) I found another case of the same failure. Ah well, maybe I can make a new hub out of aluminum and screw it onto the blower wheel. A luxury not everybody has available.
3D printers should make making your own replacement plastic parts quick, cheap, and easy.
I have a window air conditioner that developed a rattly-nonworking fan. Took it apart. The plastic blower wheel had broken at the hub. There was a spring clamp securing the hub to the shaft, but the shaft was flatted (like for a set screw). The shaft should have been full round. I suspect that the compression of the spring clamp deformed the plastic on the flat, stressing the plastic, causing failure. During my Internet search for a replacement blower wheel (none available) I found another case of the same failure. Ah well, maybe I can make a new hub out of aluminum and screw it onto the blower wheel. A luxury not everybody has available.
3D printers should make making your own replacement plastic parts quick, cheap, and easy.
Originally Posted By: HardbodyLoyalist
I hate to say it, but most Americans aren't willing to pay for good design. And until they are, it's a race to the bottom as far as most manufacturers are concerned.
I'm not convinced this is true. Even some of the quality brands we use to know were good have turned to garbage.
I hate to say it, but most Americans aren't willing to pay for good design. And until they are, it's a race to the bottom as far as most manufacturers are concerned.
I'm not convinced this is true. Even some of the quality brands we use to know were good have turned to garbage.
Originally Posted By: Rick in PA
How much stuff ends up in landfills due to bad design?
....
How many of the appliances in the world end up as landfill just due to bad design?
BTW Rick, this also annoys me as well. I don't like tossing items because one part was poorly designed or cheaply made. And I don't and won't support (when possible) MFG who produce garbage products.
How much stuff ends up in landfills due to bad design?
....
How many of the appliances in the world end up as landfill just due to bad design?
BTW Rick, this also annoys me as well. I don't like tossing items because one part was poorly designed or cheaply made. And I don't and won't support (when possible) MFG who produce garbage products.
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Originally Posted By: Mr_Incredible
I found a multi-speed fan that somebody had dumped. It's from the 30's/40's. I guess Grandma or Grandpa had died and they were cleaning out the junk.
I took it home 'cause it looked cool. Cleaned it up, fixed the plug end. Have been using it for years. Moves a LOT of air. Oscilates. Cast iron base, so is very heavy.
It will never wear out. My great grandchildren will be using it.
What's really cool is those are actually worth alot of money. Not sure if it's because of their quality or collectability,but they sell for big $$'s at antique shops. I'm always on the lookout for one. They're awesome!!
I found a multi-speed fan that somebody had dumped. It's from the 30's/40's. I guess Grandma or Grandpa had died and they were cleaning out the junk.
I took it home 'cause it looked cool. Cleaned it up, fixed the plug end. Have been using it for years. Moves a LOT of air. Oscilates. Cast iron base, so is very heavy.
It will never wear out. My great grandchildren will be using it.
What's really cool is those are actually worth alot of money. Not sure if it's because of their quality or collectability,but they sell for big $$'s at antique shops. I'm always on the lookout for one. They're awesome!!
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My entire home stereo system is from the early-mid 70s. I have what collectors call two of those "monster receivers". They both have oiled walnut cases and everything on them is metal. They're completely analog,and are HEAVY. Only modern home stereo I'd have the desire to own would be McIntosh.
Originally Posted By: NJC
I'm not convinced this is true. Even some of the quality brands we use to know were good have turned to garbage.
I agree. There is some truth to the "people buy whatever is cheapest" mentality because of the economy, but many people are still willing to spend money on what they believe to be quality products. The problem is many of those products the consumers believe to be quality are just a name brand and nothing more. I see it every day, people shelling out more money for a "name brand" item which they believe to be better quality, even though it may be just the same as the generic.
I've had people tell me "quality products don't sell, only cheap ones". Cheap products do sell, but for how long? How many times will someone buy a cheap product that breaks before they get frustrated and try another brand? Sometimes only once.
Many companies have been incredibly successful selling quality products, even if they are more expensive. John Deere is a brand that comes to mind. They sell some of the most expensive lawn and garden tractors you can buy (at the dealers) and I have customers who won't ever buy anything else. The same goes for Kubota, Gravely, Ariens, etc.
The same goes for Wix filters. They aren't the cheapest or easiest to find, but they are well constructed and very popular. They are priced somewhere in the middle, since they are more expensive than the cheapo junk filters, but cheaper than say a Mobil 1 or Royal Purple filter. This gives the consumer a well constructed product at a fair price.
I'm not convinced this is true. Even some of the quality brands we use to know were good have turned to garbage.
I agree. There is some truth to the "people buy whatever is cheapest" mentality because of the economy, but many people are still willing to spend money on what they believe to be quality products. The problem is many of those products the consumers believe to be quality are just a name brand and nothing more. I see it every day, people shelling out more money for a "name brand" item which they believe to be better quality, even though it may be just the same as the generic.
I've had people tell me "quality products don't sell, only cheap ones". Cheap products do sell, but for how long? How many times will someone buy a cheap product that breaks before they get frustrated and try another brand? Sometimes only once.
Many companies have been incredibly successful selling quality products, even if they are more expensive. John Deere is a brand that comes to mind. They sell some of the most expensive lawn and garden tractors you can buy (at the dealers) and I have customers who won't ever buy anything else. The same goes for Kubota, Gravely, Ariens, etc.
The same goes for Wix filters. They aren't the cheapest or easiest to find, but they are well constructed and very popular. They are priced somewhere in the middle, since they are more expensive than the cheapo junk filters, but cheaper than say a Mobil 1 or Royal Purple filter. This gives the consumer a well constructed product at a fair price.
I've been trying to scoop up well-kept vintage items. This year alone I needed a briefcase, didn't want to pay a high price for a well-made modern one, so I slid over to eBay and picked up a vintage attorney's briefcase from the '60s. Solid and well-made, it has decades of use left in it.
I wanted a small case to keep my rain jacket, flashlight, etc., in the car. So, eBay again, and I found a vintage doctor's case in black pebbled leather.
And my vintage fedoras are softer, with a 1940s-1950s vibe, and yet withstand more weather than a lot of what Stetson puts out today.
Small appliances? Who fixes them today? I had a Braun coffeemaker I was attached to (long story). The rubber seal to the reservoir began to crack and leak. I found a shop in Denver that would repair it, but that was in 1998. When its heating element wore out, I was living in NO, and nobody here works on such things. I bought another Braun, and when it failed the only choice I had was to send it to a service center in another state, or buy something new.
I wanted a small case to keep my rain jacket, flashlight, etc., in the car. So, eBay again, and I found a vintage doctor's case in black pebbled leather.
And my vintage fedoras are softer, with a 1940s-1950s vibe, and yet withstand more weather than a lot of what Stetson puts out today.
Small appliances? Who fixes them today? I had a Braun coffeemaker I was attached to (long story). The rubber seal to the reservoir began to crack and leak. I found a shop in Denver that would repair it, but that was in 1998. When its heating element wore out, I was living in NO, and nobody here works on such things. I bought another Braun, and when it failed the only choice I had was to send it to a service center in another state, or buy something new.
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