Steering wheel wobble during acceleration

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Billbert
Front drive problems can be difficult to isolate, especially when there are a lot of worn out parts. There well may be multiple causes all adding up. (the front drive is at its highest load under acceleration)


Exactly , I should have been more clear about that . You can't just cherry pick which front end parts you may think are the issue , they pretty much work together and have likely got to a point where most will have to be replace if showing excessive wear . Yes , you can usually get by with a little wear but if several are worn then the problem becomes much greater .

Go to the garage and have them show you their findings so you understand .


Problem is, what they've found, or least what the guy told me over the phone that they found, doesn't fit this problem specifically. I can't think of any time when I've heard of worn suspension parts causing front end/steering wheel wobble ONLY DURING ACCERATION. Those parts when bad tend to cause this issue whenever the vehicle is moving, not just during acceleartion...if I tell them to look specifically for a bad half shaft or motor mount and they say they're all good, then what? Replacing everything they said was wrong with the vehicle would obviously cost more than it's worth...

 

[grampi]

They just called me back and said the mechanic could not find anything wrong with either the half shafts or the motor mounts...he thinks the problem is being caused by severely worn struts and rear sway bar links....so now I guess I'll call around and see if I can get the work done for less than their estimate of a little over $2 grand...I know a 4 wheel alignment will need to be done, but $2 grand sounds quite a bit high to me...

 

[Scott_Tucker]

Did you take a ride with a mechanic when you dropped it off? I wouldnt authorize any work until you did. The struts are unlikely to cause what you described and the end links will not. It sounds like the service writer is the one who is trying to diagnose the car, not the mechanic.

 

[mechtech2]

Right.
Worn suspension or motor mount components can make any vibration feel worse. They don't CAUSE it, but ALLOW it to various degrees.
The original problem could be in the differential, C/V joints, even a wheel bearing. C/Vs are my first guess.

 

[grampi]

I have had this place diagnose problems with my car before and they have always been spot-on...if the mechanic says my half shafts and motor mounts are good, I have no reason to doubt him, however, I have never actually had them do the work because they're too expensive...I called some other places and found one that will replace all 4 struts (complete assemblies) and all 4 sway bar links (front and rear) for a labor charge of $350. Parts are going to be $575, and I'll have to pay another $100 for a 4 wheel alignment. Total will be less than half of what this place wants to do it....

 

[Warstud]

Originally Posted By: grampi
he thinks the problem is being caused by severely worn struts and rear sway bar linkS


2 grand for a "he thinks qoute"? My first thought was one of the steering components. Have you ever replaced any of them?

 

[The_Jeff]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Right.
Worn suspension or motor mount components can make any vibration feel worse. They don't CAUSE it, but ALLOW it to various degrees.
The original problem could be in the differential, C/V joints, even a wheel bearing. C/Vs are my first guess.


I'd go with CVs amplified by shot ball joints or tie rod ends. Probably got the whole hub banging around when it hits its resonant frequency. Whatever looseness is there will grow even more-- and quickly. Google the Jeep phenomenon of "Death Wobble" for nefarious front end problems amplifying each other.

First gear is a 4:1 ratio; final drive 4:1 again; your engine makes 100 ft lb of torque, that's 1600 ft lb twisting the axle and CVs. A pry bar is not necessarily going to find slop that appears under this load.

 

[dblshock]

same exact thing on my Accord was the left axle...eventually it will start to click on turns as well, especially once the cold weather arrives.

 

[grampi]

Going on the mechnaics diagnosis, I spent most of the day on the phone yesterday calling about parts, and trying to find a place that was more reasonable for labor. I ended up buying all 4 complete strut assemblies and the front and rear sway bar links. The strut assemblies on this car were the originals, so I knew they had to be replaced regardless...and I hoped they cured my shaking front end. The strut assemblies are Monroes I picked up from Advance Auto...total parts was $557...I found a place that installed them for $355 in labor, and then I had a 4 wheel alignment done for $65...total cost was less than half of what the original place wanted and best of all, it DID cure the shakey front end problem. The Corolla lives on to see another 100-200K...hopefully....

 

[mechtech2]

What are the new struts covering up?
Remember, they don't cause vibration, they allow it.

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
What are the new struts covering up?
Remember, they don't cause vibration, they allow it.


Maybe a slightly out of balance tire?

 

[rpn453]

I think struts could be worn out to the point where they have enough play either in the stanchion/slider interface or the strut mount to be the primary cause of front end looseness described here. I'd have suspected control arm bushings first if the obvious - ball joints and tie-rod ends - were okay, but the strut is only other structural wear component holding the wheel in position so the solution makes sense to me. Good to hear you resolved it so quickly.

 

[yonyon]

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: rpn453
I think struts could be worn out to the point where they have enough play either in the stanchion/slider interface or the strut mount to be the primary cause of front end looseness described here. I'd have suspected control arm bushings first if the obvious - ball joints and tie-rod ends - were okay, but the strut is only other structural wear component holding the wheel in position so the solution makes sense to me. Good to hear you resolved it so quickly.


All I know is the steering wheel/front end is rock solid now with no wobble whatsoever, so it looks like the problem was fixed...

 

[The_Jeff]

Originally Posted By: grampi
Going on the mechnaics diagnosis, I spent most of the day on the phone yesterday calling about parts, and trying to find a place that was more reasonable for labor. I ended up buying all 4 complete strut assemblies and the front and rear sway bar links. The strut assemblies on this car were the originals, so I knew they had to be replaced regardless...and I hoped they cured my shaking front end. The strut assemblies are Monroes I picked up from Advance Auto...total parts was $557...I found a place that installed them for $355 in labor, and then I had a 4 wheel alignment done for $65...total cost was less than half of what the original place wanted and best of all, it DID cure the shakey front end problem. The Corolla lives on to see another 100-200K...hopefully....


I would at least stop by the first place with a 12-er of beer for the guys. They did figure out the issue and that should be worth something.

 

[grampi]

My wobble is still there. mechtech2 was right, the new struts/springs were covering up the real problem, which is still undetermined. I slid into a curb back Feb...didn't hit real hard, was probably going about 5 mph when it hit, but it hit hard enough to slightly bend the rim. I didn't think this contributed to the problem because it drove fine afterwards, but now I'm wondering if that didn't slightly damage something that's now rearing it ugly head. I'm wondering if this may have damaged one, or both of the half shaft bearings...if not maybe one of the steering system components is bad...I'm running out of ideas of what to look for...

 

[IndyIan]

Does it bother you at normal speeds? If not I would sit on it for a while and see if it gets worse.
My Neon has a slight up and down motion from the drivers front corner which is quite pronounced at maybe 5mph. Does it with every tire I've put on up there so I think the axle is bent slightly. But when I've had the front end jack stands and let the tires rotate even quickly, nothing looks out of line or wobbling...? I've done it with the tire off as well and nothing seems to out of axis? Since it doesn't seem to matter at normal speeds I've done nothing about it in the 8 years 120k miles I've had the car.

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Does it bother you at normal speeds? If not I would sit on it for a while and see if it gets worse.
My Neon has a slight up and down motion from the drivers front corner which is quite pronounced at maybe 5mph. Does it with every tire I've put on up there so I think the axle is bent slightly. But when I've had the front end jack stands and let the tires rotate even quickly, nothing looks out of line or wobbling...? I've done it with the tire off as well and nothing seems to out of axis? Since it doesn't seem to matter at normal speeds I've done nothing about it in the 8 years 120k miles I've had the car.


It doesn't seem to have a particular speed where it happens, and it's totally random. It'll drive along nice and smooth and then it just starts wobbling...may do it for 15-30 seconds, then smooths out again...a bent shaft you'd think would wobble all the time...

 

[RH+G]

Still sounds like its the axles or wheel bearings.
I have had a similar problem with a car with wobble when accelerating at random times and both axles wre original and look good. Replaced it and it problem was gone.

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: RH+G
Still sounds like its the axles or wheel bearings.
I have had a similar problem with a car with wobble when accelerating at random times and both axles wre original and look good. Replaced it and it problem was gone.


I guess I could try replacing the right side half shaft and the bearings (since that was the side that smacked the curb, it would make more sense to start there).