Stabil works or not, no objective studies?

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friendly_jacek

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According to a study supposedly done by Stabil chemists, it works fine:

Quote:
There is a standard test for this called the ASTM D525 “Oxidation Stability Test.” A gasoline sample is put into a container with pure oxygen under 20 atmospheres of pressure. When the sample starts to polymerize (oxidize), the temperature goes up. This is when gum starts forming. Plain gas takes 100 to 200 minutes to start polymerizing, but gas with STA-BIL lasts 1,200 to 1,500 minutes.


from http://adlersantiqueautos.com/articles/winterstorage.html

On the other hand when competition studied Stabil, there was little edge over 87 Chevron:

Quote:

Sample No. of Minutes
Baseline 1320
STA-BIL® 1560
PRI-G® 2105


From: http://www.kansaswindpower.net/PRI lab_tests.htm

Now, pri-G states that their product also restores 15 year old fuel to usability, so not sure we can trust them either.

Since I experienced green gum in my boat always fed Stabil, I'm planning to my own study aging gas in glass jars.
 
I have been using Stabil and lately switched their blue version. I usually don't bother emptying the gas tank in my mower or blower at the end of the season. So far, my mower have always started on the first or second pull. Since the blower has electric start, I start it every month or so. Stabil works for me.
 
I've used red StaBil for at least a decade in every tank of outboard motor gas (I use a lot), and I do not drain the carbs over the winter. I just double dose a full tank of gas for six-month winter (cold) storage and my motors have always started right up in the spring, and no gunk in the carbs. I do the same with my motorcycle now and it is fine after winter storage. So, I am assuming it works as advertised, but no scientific testing. I am now switching to the blue StaBil as I use up my red supply.
 
Originally Posted By: AuthorEditor
I've used red StaBil for at least a decade in every tank of outboard motor gas (I use a lot), and I do not drain the carbs over the winter. I just double dose a full tank of gas for six-month winter (cold) storage and my motors have always started right up in the spring, and no gunk in the carbs. I do the same with my motorcycle now and it is fine after winter storage. So, I am assuming it works as advertised, but no scientific testing. I am now switching to the blue StaBil as I use up my red supply.

Why would you do that and not just use it in the last gas purchased for the season?
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Yea....seems kind of "silly" to me....now I'm an additive junkie even...but in a regularly driven/operated machine, I don't see the real need for it....I've posted this before....but when my younger brother joined the Navy, he went off to Boot Camp, plus A school, for roughly 9 months....before he deployed, his car kind of "died" on him, kept over heating, etc....and since he didn't really have the $ to repair it, and then leave it sit for 9-12 months while off away from home, he just held off on repairing it til he got finished....well, he came back home, and the car cranked right up....no need for any additives, prelube, fogging solution down the spark plug holes, etc....granted, we turned it over about once a month to move it from one side of the yard, to the other, to mow the grass growing under it :P But that was the extent of it's operation during those 9+ months....and didn't have any problems with it starting.
 
LOL, everyone keeps saying I used it for X years and everything was fine. Well, I used it for 9 years and everything was fine till one day boat refuses to start and the carb is full of !@#$.

So, testimonials without examination are useless.

Here is what I'm doing. I filled several glass jars with small amounts of BP gasoline (I didn't want to use the best quality gas). Added a drop of water (to simulate moisture) and small amounts of rubber (to simulate seals). Will add some brass later when I find some to test for carb jet corrosion. Would pennies suffice?

I added small amounts of Stabil, MMO, Seafom, TCW3 to different jars. One I left without additive for control. One has both Stabil and Seafoam (to look for synergy).

I screwed the lids back and left the jars on the back porch to bask in afternoon sun.

I will take off or loosen the lids at some point to simulate carb bowl vent and allow for oxygen to get in.

Anything else I need to do to simulate carb conditions at storage?

BTW, here are some surprises already. BP gas had no measurable ethanol (I did the gas/water mix and water level didn't go up). Pump states the usual "up to 10% ethanol". Only Stabil put back a water drop back into solution, thus contains alcohol. Interesting, isn't it?
 
Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
That's crazy. If BP doesn't have any ethanol that is! /mindblown

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That is a bummer indeed, as I planned to study E10 gas and didn't expect you could buy 100% gas anymore here, as every pump in town is labeled "up to 10% ethanol." That label is more like a legal disclaimer I guess (and useless).

I should have suspected that, as I checked Chevron gas a year ago and 87 was 100% gas and only premium had ethanol in it.
 
Another observation so far:

1. The small drops of water disappeared in SeaFoam too. Not surprisingly as we knew it contained IPA.

2. After just one day in glass jar in sun, Stabil gas is discolored orange-yellow. I think sacrificial Stabil oxidation is happening already. If oxidation products are insoluble, that would explain my problems with Stabil.

I think they will be insoluble. Once I had a bottle of Stabil went bad from age and precipitated crystalline deposits at the bottom.

I will set up another experiment, thin straight Stabil film exposed to the elements. This will simulate the scenario that gas evaporated in a carb and left a thin film of Stabil.
 
Quote:
Why would you do that and not just use it in the last gas purchased for the season?


Because I never know for how long a particular batch of gas will be sitting. Today's ethanol gas deteriorates rapidly, particularly in the marine environment with all the moisture around. I give straight gas about a month before it starts to go bad. If you wait the month and then add Stabil it has already partly deteriorated. Stabil recommends you add it to fresh gas. Here is what it says on the website:

Quote:
Q: I have some gas in a tank that has been there more than 2 months. Will STA-BIL® Fuel Stabilizer make this old gas like new?
A: No, STA-BIL®Fuel Stabilizer will not restore or improve old gasoline. It will, however, stop it from degrading further. The best thing to do is treat the fuel with STA-BIL® brand as soon as you buy it.


I don't think your test is realistic. Gas should always be stored in a cool, dark place. The sunlight will alter the results significantly.
 
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Originally Posted By: AuthorEditor

I don't think your test is realistic. Gas should always be stored in a cool, dark place. The sunlight will alter the results significantly.


The official test is ASTM D525 “Oxidation Stability Test.” A gasoline sample is put into a container with pure oxygen under 20 atmospheres of pressure.

Are you also going to call it unrealistic too? Unrealistic is to test gasoline for several years. I'm not that patient.
 
Quote:
Are you also going to call it unrealistic too? Unrealistic is to test gasoline for several years. I'm not that patient.


Well, I've been "testing" my own gasoline in boats and motorcycles for more than ten years and I have had no problems with fuel going bad utilizing StaBil in every tank. I know lots of people who have had problems. It isn't scientific, but I see no need to change what I am doing. I think the sunlight will make a significant difference in your test that does not emulate a real-world situation.

It is important to keep fuel out of sunlight, according to this from here: Circle Track http://www.circletrack.com/enginetech/ctrp_1105_fuel_system_basics/viewall.html

Quote:
Storage
Aside from the hopefully obvious safety aspects, poor fuel transportation and storage techniques can effectively take away some of the power producing components of the fuel. And I can think of very few racers who feel that they have too much power.

For example, everybody enjoys a sunny day but your race fuel likes dark and cool places and you should remember that. Fuel, especially gasoline, should always be stored in containers that do not allow the sunlight to reach the fuel. Most fuels are light sensitive and exposure to sunlight can and will damage the fuel. Prolonged exposure to sunlight can cause some race fuel to break down and some of the components to separate and once this happens it can't be undone. You can't just shake the container to mix the fuel components back together.



Read more: http://www.circletrack.com/enginetech/ctrp_1105_fuel_system_basics/viewall.html#ixzz1tqhO2PiI
 
Originally Posted By: AuthorEditor

Well, I've been "testing" my own gasoline in boats and motorcycles for more than ten years and I have had no problems with fuel going bad utilizing StaBil in every tank. I know lots of people who have had problems.


Well, the whole test idea started when I discovered that stabil didn't prevent gas going bad inside carb in my boat. It took a total 9 years to plug the carb bad enough. The gas in the tank itself was not that bad and I'm burning it in my cars.

I noticed that you are in NY. Well, I bet you my backyard in deep south is hotter than yours and thus all chemical reactions run faster. Twice as fast every 10C increase in temp if I remember my chemistry right. YMMV.
 
Quote:
I noticed that you are in NY. Well, I bet you my backyard in deep south is hotter than yours and thus all chemical reactions run faster. Twice as fast every 10C increase in temp if I remember my chemistry right. YMMV.


I agree with that, but I have also lived for years in the southeast and spent two years down in Central and South America, where I did the same thing. I understand your desire to prove or disprove whether or not StaBil works, and I laud your attempt to test it, but I don't think your study is realistic or scientific enough to give us the answer. By the way, I notice ValvTect ValvTect has a fuel treatment they claim utilizes "the industry's most effective fuel stabilizer."
 
After 1 1/2 weeks of study there is only one thing to report: brass screws turned from gold to dark brown in gasoline samples with TWC3 and MMO. Too early to know it that is real corrosion or just cosmetic discoloration. Everything else nominal.
 
pics4truth
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And....on the plus side.....save all your data for your kids, grand kids, etc.....to use as/at their next Science Fair project
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