Spark plugs - Talk about snake oil

[bottgers]

There seem to be as many or more high tech spark plugs on the market as there is oil additives and engine treatments. It seems no product line is safe from the "miracle" products.

I've done quite a bit of research throughout the various automotive websites trying to find out which plugs are for real, and which ones are just "snake oil."

It seems in many cases, the more expensive the plug, the worse it is. I have yet to read a good review by anyone who's used Splitfire or Bosch Platinum +4 plugs. These plugs cost $5-$6 a piece and everyone that's used them said they either made their engines run rough, lack power, lose fuel economy, or a combination of of all of these. I think I read somewhwere the +4's actually only spark to one of the grounding points and not to all 4 as you might think. If this is true, then what's the point of the 4 grounding points? Is it just for looks to make them look more techincal so they'll sell? The bottom line is stay away from these plugs, they're nothing but expensive junk!

What are the best? Most people seem to like NGKs, Densos, and Bosch platinums (the regular ones, not the +2's or +4's). I've used mostly NGKs and I've always had really good results. They last a long time and they seem to give really good performance. A friend of mine uses the Densos and he's never had a complaint about them either.

If anyone has any spark plug experiences please post them here. Thanks.

 

[tom slick]

quote:

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I think I read somewhwere the +4's actually only spark to one of the grounding points and not to all 4 as you might think. If this is true, then what's the point of the 4 grounding points?

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you are correct. the only reason to have multiple electrodes is for longevity. the spark will jump to whichever electrode is easyist to get to. so as one wears out, the spark will jump to a different one. the only reason to use any specility plug is if it is an OEM specific design. some BMW engines and Mazda rotary engines use special plugs that look "high performance" but are actually to correct a problem the engine has with a regular plug.

 

[punisher]

A spark plug's job is to light the fuel mix on time, every time. Thats it. If an ignition system does that, then there is no improvement possible no matter how fancy the plug. It doesn't matter if you throw iridium plugs in, add 10mm monster wires , or use a 60KV ignition coil.

The only time I had verifiable problems with a plug was with a Bosch Platinum in my faithful Toyota truck. The insulator on the electrode decided to break off in the combustion chamber and rattle around in the chamber for awhile.

At the dealership I saw dozens of missfires due to improper spark plug operation, many of the plugs were Bosch, some were SplitFires and the occasional Champion. During the early '90s Motorcraft had a bad run of plugs that made it into factory engines as well as the aftermarket. Nothing to **** off a customer more than paying for a tune-up and coming in a week later to replace a nearly new plug to correct a missfire.

IMHO, read your owners manual and go with what it says.

 

[Kestas]

To add, generally the manufacturer does all engine testing with the specified plugs. Hence, engine tune is maximized for those plugs.

 

[Dark Jedi]

Kestas I would agree but the champion plugs they had in my 4.7 V-8 Dakota. had about a 45Degree angle on all of them. to me thats excessive wear on a plug with about 25,000 miles (I can take pic if anyone wants to see the wear of these plugs). I used champion plugs in all my vehicles and never had wear like that. I guess its because of the coil over design (no plug wire ) I heard they are hard on champ plugs. I got autolites in them now. alot of owners that has the 4.7 engines says they do better and havent had any prob from them. I will pull them soon as its been 6 months to see how they are wearing. I will get NGK V groove as they seem to stand up better to this engines design. but usually your simple copper cheap plug works the best unless its a high preformance vehicle. then you might have to go more exotic with your plugs. but I will never use plats. I tried them once and my 2.3 ranger ran so so. put copper plugs in it and ran better.

its really up to the person what they want and willing to spend. just like oils some people buy the $15 a quart oil. while others buy the $2 a quart oil (will prob get blasted on this one lol.)to each their own.

 

[bottgers]

punisher

Going with what the owners manual recommends is exactly what I do, and I've had good results.

Funny thing I remember about the +4's, Bosch (or maybe it was Splifire talking about their plugs, I tend to get the phonies mixed up from time to time) used to have a promo on their site that talked about "the kernel" as they called it, providing a more efficient burn than conventional plugs. They were very careful about how they worded the whole thing, but they were basically implying the +4's provided a more efficient burn because of ther're revolutionary 4 prong design and that the electrode sparked to all 4 prongs simotaniously. It was kind of like the scene in Spies Like Us where Chevy Chase was trying to bribe the test proctor while the whole time not saying anything concrete that he could be prosicuted for.

 

[wileyE]

One of the things that starts up the "warning will robertson" alert for me, is the one size fits all application charts. If you notice ngk makes alot of different part and application #'s that are very specific. Companys like splitfire have 3 plugs that fit everything, uh, don't think so.

Low speed misfire? I battled this on a 4 cyl bikes using non-ngk plugs. In short the resistor value quality control was terrible out of the box on the off brands. 4-6k is what I'd check for, NGK's were always right there, the others showed frequent duds.

Multiple ground electrodes on the new plugs are all about 100,000 mile tune ups and hotter ignitions that degrade spark gaps faster. No added performace, more like maintaining performance. Same with platinum.

 

[sprintman]

NGK Iridiums in both vehicles and still fantastic. I could feel the differnce as soon as I screwed them in. 50,000+ kmson the ones in the turbo. NGK have their at together IMO

 

[Audity]

I've used mostly NGK and Bosch plugs in most of my cars over the (jeez, way too many...30+)years, and have settled on NGKs as the best. I've never had a problem with them, their standard copper plug even seems best in the 944 engine under pretty abusive track duty. I used Bosch Platinums in it for quite a while, but the NGKs have worked at least as well, and clearly last longer. Much cheaper too.

The only recent exception is with my daily driver S4 (2 turbos), where I had an occasional misfire problem with NGK Iridiums with maybe 20k miles on them. NGK Iridiums are standard, but I couldn't find any on a weekend. I ended up with Denso Iridiums and they've performed great for the last 10k +/- miles, no misfires showing up on the VAG-COM. That said, I wouldn't hesitate to go back to NGKs.

 

[Master ACiD]

i like bosch supers. im not a platnum plug fan or a multi electrode fan. just plain old $1.68 a piece bosch supers for me.

i take my plugs out every couple oil changes and look at them, so i end up changing plugs every once in a while whenener i feel like it. not even when they need it. just because i feel like it. for this, bosch supers, or really any non fancy plug works great.

i just use bosch supers from my mispent days of aircooled german engines, vw and porsche etc.. i awalys used bosch on those engines because bosch was "the thing" to use for german ignitions. f you showed up to a porsche rallye with some champion plugs in youre engine and anyone seen that you were ridiculed for it. its kind of a stupid thing but porsche people are snobs like that. (one of the reasons im not into porsche anymore) i guess i just kind of kept on using bosch, even after i moved on to other types of cars that are not german.
i dont see anything wrong with ngk, denso, torch, etc, but i just have a fondness for bosch that was made from my mispent german car days.

every engine i have used them in, from subaru, kia, mazda, hyundai, ford, honda, chevy etc all performed as normally, as they should. and im sure all those engines would have performed the exact same with a denso or nrk plug, but what else can i say? i just like bosch, thats all.

the only times i have seen multi electrode plugs required as oem are on a 89 vw jetti gli. it has a high output dual cam engine and the factory manual said this engine requires triple electrode bosch plugs and then gave a special part number. in this case, i put in what the factory said to. i dont know if it really needed triple gound electrode plugs or not but the factory said so and they only cost $2.50 each so who cares. water under the bridge if you ask me.

also on my dads bmw r1100r boxer 2 cylinder motorcycle it requires twin electrode bosch platnums for some reason. we put in twin electrode supers instead and although they are not platnum, they appear to be working fine. maybe they need to be changed out a little more often, but who cares. plugs cost almost nothing to change.

 

[pennzoil_guru]

Nothing works better in my wife's 2000 Civic than plain old NGK copper. I have a smoother idle with NGK over Bosch

 

[ikeepmychevytoo]

Hmm... If two or four is better, then we probably should swith back to the ring type grounds of the 1910's. Infinite ground points.

 

[bottgers]

I don't think a plug with multiple electrodes is necessarily a bad thing, I just don't think it automatically makes a "super plug" as Bosch would have you believe with their +4. I just replaced the plugs in my Corolla yesterday and the NGKs called for by Toyota for this car have dual electrodes. Obviously these are good plugs or Toyota wouldn't recommend them. I highly doubt +4s or Splitfires would result in better (or even as good) performance as the NGKs provide.

 

[DJ]

On the multiple electrode how is it that nobody pointed out there is still just one at center so the longer wear thingh holds no water and any electrode not getting spark will be getting fouled. It is plain and simple a marketting gimmick.

Platinum is about longevity, they exibit less gap errosion and are generally frowned on for boosted or nitrous applications though some mildly boosted OEM car spec them or Iridiums. Iridiums again are about longevity. As far as what the factory specs they have different goals than an enthusiast, now if there was power in multiple electrodes or something that would be a cheap and easy way for them yo get more power or lower emmisions or something they would do it but since it is snakeoil they stick with single and add platinum so they can extend tuneup intervals. Also the plugs they spec are going to be one size fits all, different habits and conditions can and will result in a few different "right" plugs for one engine. For those of us who do our own work and enjoy a little wrenching a basic copper is tough to beat might play with the heat range one way or the other. For someone who doesn't want to change plugs but every 50K+ then OEM double platinums(both electrodes) are a good choice, though I would not trust them to the 100K being speced on many engines these days.

I have used NGKs and am now trying Autolites simply because in the plug I need they are easier to find. The NGKs I either have to buy the same heat range gapped signifigantly smaller than spec and open it up or order the right gap, they make it it is just rarely stocked, the Autolite equivalant is as easy to find as a Walmart.

wileyE makes a great point about the one size fits all when I was younger and a little less knowledgable I decided to try the Delco Rapidfires and crossreferenced to find the "right" ones for mine and my wife's vehicle. I could datalog my car and they pinged massively the computer was pulling all sorts of timing as if I had put in about 83 octane or something. The wife's car we noticed nothing in particular but when I checked them they were showing signs of signifigant detonation too.

NGK is made by Denso though some claim they are not the same plugs I would still guess they will have similar quality and range of PNs.

 

[Master ACiD]

i think maybe some people have the bosch nomenclature confused. the bosch "supers" are just plain old conventional copper single ground strap plugs. they are not multi electrode.

its the +2's and +4's which have multipule ground straps., not the supers.

 

[cousincletus]

I'm using Autolite copper plugs (the cheap ones) in both the Dodge 4.7 Durango and 3.9 Ram 1500. Have heard that GMs like ACDelco platinums best so I guess it has a lot to do w/what kinda car you have.

 

[Black Thunder]

i've had good luck with NGK since i switched from Autolites.

autolite seemed like a good plug but they didn't last very long in my car or Explorer (melted an electrode)

been a big fan now so far.

 

[02RedSpec-V]

I just put in NGK Iridium IX in my Spec-V and it feels the same probably because the stock plugs are NGK Double Platinum. The NGK Iridium cost me $60CDN for 4. At that price they be the best.....kidding.

 

[glennc]

Isn't Autolite the same company as Fram? I'd never buy a product from them unless there are no good alternatives.

I think part of the deal with the multiple-electrode plugs is that with four ground paths you have more opportunities for favorable local conditions for a spark, hence fewer misfires. In practice I doubt it helps and I've heard many say they didn't work well.

I like the advice about sticking with what's recommended by the oem.

I've never noticed any real difference between different plugs, or when replacing plugs, myself; and I typically keep standard copper plugs in an engine for 50k or so.

- Glenn

 

[Huhwhye]

quote:

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Hmm... If two or four is better, then we probably should swith back to the ring type grounds of the 1910's. Infinite ground points.

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Just a few years ago a club of ImpalaSS (Caprice) guys were using plugs like that. They swore by them. I thought they were crazy, made no sense to me. They were paying a fortune to get them too. And they were buying 8 plugs.