Spark Plug Extended Change

Whimsey · Feb 20, 2003

I get teary eyed when I think how easy it was to change the plugs and wires in my '89 F-150 truck with the 4.9L L6 cyl. engine. Other than the back plug being stuck and needing the "liquid wrench" and loosing/tightening motion the rest of the plugs were a dream to change compared to the plugs in the 4.6L V-8 in my 2002 F-150. Oh well, so much for progress.

Whimsey

dkcase · Feb 20, 2003

With my 74 F250, with the 300 CID Six (before it bacame a 4.9 liter engine), I used to climb into the engine compartment and stand alongside the engine with my feet on the ground to change the plugs and the points/condenser/rotor.

On a '96 Caravan, I never changed the plugs, over 96,000 miles, 6 years. Couldn't even TOUCH the plugs on the rear side. Never saw them. Terrible. 3.0 V6. Got rid of it before I had to try to remove them, was sure they'd be seized.

sprintman · Feb 20, 2003

Patman - $100 to change plugs?? Even more of a reason to fit Iridiums IMO if that bad a job.

Whimsey · Feb 20, 2003

8 HOURS!

Gee, I thought only Ford's with the 4.6/5.4 engines in their trucks took outlandish time and effort to change the plugs. I feel a lot better now Patman, Thanks!

Misery loves company.

Whimsey

Patman · Feb 20, 2003

That's why I paid my friend $100 to do my plugs and wires. No way I'm doing that job myself!

I miss my LS1 Formula even more at plug change time. I had that plug change down to 45min in that car. It looks harder than it is.

Soma07 · Feb 20, 2003

8hrs?!? Did you have two broken arms or something? j/k

I dont think its that bad... If you remove the alternator, starter and Y-pipe you can get them all pretty easy. My first time took me and a buddy 3hrs to do the plugs and wires on stock manifolds. Of course I can do them all pretty quick now with the headers but I'm selling them and going back to stock manifolds in a few weeks

I did the plugs on a 99 TA and I didnt think it was any harder than my car. It would have been pretty easy but the coil packs kept getting in the way. Changing the wires was trivial by comparison considering they're only ~4" long. That made me seriously jelous

Patman · Feb 20, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by sprintman:
Patman - $100 to change plugs?? Even more of a reason to fit Iridiums IMO if that bad a job.

$100 is a steal, dealers want over $400 to do it! Shop rates here are killer.

I ended up using NGK TR55GP plugs, which are G-Power platinums. These should last longer than the OEM platinums, which use 'discs' which burn off. On the 7 plugs I got out, most of them were missing these discs so the gaps were .070 instead of .050. Driveability was drastically improved.

Patman · Feb 20, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by Soma07:
8hrs?!? Did you have two broken arms or something? j/k

I dont think its that bad... If you remove the alternator, starter and Y-pipe you can get them all pretty easy. My first time took me and a buddy 3hrs to do the plugs and wires on stock manifolds. Of course I can do them all pretty quick now with the headers but I'm selling them and going back to stock manifolds in a few weeks

I did the plugs on a 99 TA and I didnt think it was any harder than my car. It would have been pretty easy but the coil packs kept getting in the way. Changing the wires was trivial by comparison considering they're only ~4" long. That made me seriously jelous

Yep, I shoulda kept my LS1, the plug changes were so easy! Not even the coil packs got in my way (they are less intrusive on the 98s)

My friend had a lot of trouble with a few of the stuck plugs, which is why it took so long. It would've been faster with a hoist too, but he just used jackstands.

S2000driver · Feb 20, 2003

If I was considering a car where the engine had to be lifted to change the spark plugs, I would laugh/shake my head and move on to something else.

A car with that setup shouldn't make it to production.

Soma07 · Feb 20, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by S2000driver:
If I was considering a car where the engine had to be lifted to change the spark plugs, I would laugh/shake my head and move on to something else.

Which car are you refering to? I dont recall anyone saying that...

S2000driver · Feb 21, 2003

Oops, I guess that makes me an idiot

RobZ71LM7 · Feb 21, 2003

Patman, What are you using on the #2 plug to get it off? I used a regular plug socket directly onto a plain craftsman 3/8" ratchet on my LT1's #2 plug. It was a tight fit but it worked. You might try getting a stubby ratchet they fit in there perfectly. Aero Kroil made by Kano Labs is a very good penetrating oil.

On the topic of plugs... I changed all of our plugs early just so I could get rid of the AC platinums, but more importantly to put anti-sieze on them! GM just relies on the plug's plating and doesn't use any anti-sieze at all.

[ February 22, 2003, 12:51 AM: Message edited by: RobZ71LM7 ]

Patman · Feb 21, 2003

My friend was using a stubby ratchet on the plug change I believe. I wonder what the dealer might charge to do one plug? Then if they break it off they have to fix it, not me.

MNgopher · Feb 22, 2003

I'll ditto the comments that misery loves company! Take a 4.6l/5.4l to a dealership and ask for a plug change. Try not to let your eyeballs pop out of your sockets! Quotes seem to always come back between $200-300 for JUST plugs and wires. Somewhat less if you have the coil-on plug design with no wires to replace. I got a much better price at a light/medium duty truck dealership that knew what they were doing. Nothing like needing a ton of long extensions and wobblies to get at the plugs in back. I'm glad and yet almost sad to hear how bad the F-bodies are!

With these hassles, the 100k recommend chnages start to look good. I had the plugs on my '97 done for the 1st time at 112,000 miles when the truck had to go to the shop for a suspension issue. Otherwise I never found the time or reason! OEM's were well worn and the gap was too big, but they were acceptable given the mileage. My fuel mileage even dropped after they were changed! Go figure. My '99 was done at about 70,000 miles while trying to track down a lumpy idle issue, and those were the same - well worn, but but acceptable given the mileage.

[ February 23, 2003, 01:15 AM: Message edited by: MNgopher ]

Patman · Feb 22, 2003

I just remembered, back in 98 or 99 when my mom got the plug wires changed in her 94 Probe GT, the Ford dealer charged her $800!!! Just for wires only!! $400 in parts, $400 in labor, and this is before our insane 15% taxes too!! She was robbed, they might as well have used a gun.

Soma07 · Feb 23, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by Patman:
I just remembered, back in 98 or 99 when my mom got the plug wires changed in her 94 Probe GT, the Ford dealer charged her $800!!! Just for wires only!! $400 in parts, $400 in labor, and this is before our insane 15% taxes too!! She was robbed, they might as well have used a gun.

So thats like $10 US right

The GT has the 2.5L V6 correct? I can see where changing the back plugs on transverse mounted (FWD) V6 would be a PITA. I dont see how a set of plugs and wires is worth $400 tho...

What's even worse is that my dad (ASE tech) told me to reach the back plugs on some late model Chrysler vans (the AWD ones I think) you have to pull the intake manifold! No thanks! By comparison our cars seem like a walk in the park

Patman · Feb 23, 2003

Yes, her car has the 2.5L V6. I guess Ford charged a lot in the earlier years after these first came out. I bet the price is lower now.

My mom just got her exhaust replaced on Saturday, everything from the cat back and it was only $270CDN ($175US) including labor and tax. We were expecting it to be four times that price.

[ February 24, 2003, 05:25 AM: Message edited by: Patman ]

RogerUK · Feb 24, 2003

Plugs are so cheap here in the UK I think it is false economy not to change them every year or two at the most. Incidentally some here recommend the use of anti-seize, which I assume is copper based grease, on the plug threads, but does this not alter the torque tightening figure, and by how much?
I have never encountered a seized plug in 45 years, and approximately 750K miles of dealing with cars.
Splendid forum.
Roger

S2000driver · Feb 24, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by RogerUK:
Plugs are so cheap here in the UK I think it is false economy not to change them every year or two at the most. Incidentally some here recommend the use of anti-seize, which I assume is copper based grease, on the plug threads, but does this not alter the torque tightening figure, and by how much?
I have never encountered a seized plug in 45 years, and approximately 750K miles of dealing with cars.
Splendid forum.
Roger

Don't fret, I'm going to change my plugs at 30,000... only costs me $8 for parts.

As for torque, you are expected to use anti-seize so that's where they set the torque.

DABEAR95 · Feb 24, 2003

I changed my factory 100K mile platinum plugs at 50K miles when I installed my headers.

It's easy to change plugs on an LT1 when the alternator, starter, y-pipe, exhaust manifolds, etc are removed.

The plugs looked less than satisfactory at that time.

Jason

[ February 24, 2003, 07:50 PM: Message edited by: DABEAR95 ]

Spark Plug Extended Change

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