Solar ROI reached on 3yr, 2mo, 3 days.

[UncleDave]

Everyone's mileage varies, but this was the biggest no brainer I've yet come across.
I was at the right place and time to make it happen.

This was turned on Sept 9, 2022.

There is a few grand missing in my payback computation on this site, I had a transformer failure in the first year, so for 4 months the system didn't record input or output - but continued to produce.

If I had to guess I'd be at about 22K - 20K in principle 2K in interest assuming I could make 10%.
Im calling the loan satisfied.

I added an irrigation system, electrically heated small lap pool and a spa.
I'm using more than I make now.

It would cost 8K a year to live here just in electricity without this array on the roof.

@JeffKeryk was super helpful.

@

 

[Rand]

For a dirty power grid like California during the night...
how is it saving 25.8tons CO2
when there is an abundance of solar power in the grid when you are producing power?
but when you are using power from the grid its mostly natural gas? Where is the CO2 reduction coming from?

On another note seems like a great deal for your circumstances.

If I had California's climate and Jeff K's sweetheart NEM deal that unfortunately switches the burden to other ratepayers.
I'd have solar power too

 

[JeffKeryk]

Ya know, sometimes the numbers are overwhelming. The competition back in early 2018 made my solar project the biggest no brainer on the planet. My cost/savings projection was based on my electricity costs at the time; which would be Uber conservative as compared to today.

Oh yeah, I rarely turned on the AC in the hot Los Gatos sun, unless we had company. Now I blare it like there is no tomorrow. And pay less than just about anyone... One tank of gas is the equivalent price to run the house and the Tesla for a month. Actually much more.

Sometimes you get lucky. Well done @UncleDave. Congrats on your win!

 

[UncleDave]

For a dirty power grid like California during the night...
how is it saving 25.8tons CO2
when there is an abundance of solar power in the grid when you are producing power?
but when you are using power from the grid its mostly natural gas? Where is the CO2 reduction coming from?

On another note seems like a great deal for your circumstances.

If I had California's climate and Jeff K's sweetheart NEM deal that unfortunately switches the burden to other ratepayers.
I'd have solar power too

I'm not the one making co2 claims thats the app.
It's not saving anything at night.

I dont know (or really care) how they compute CO2 reduction, but Id guess they use either production or avoided consumption.
The app can show it in other meaningless terms - like "trees planted" or "phones charged".

Im not attempting to virtue signal "green" my signature line would back that up.
I dont really care about any other green than my wallet, Im horrible, I know.


My deal is decent, not as sweet as Jeffs, I got the last few months of PGE&Nem 2 contract.

The cost shifting claim is bogus.
Lawrence Berkley labs computation on cost shifting shows it to be diminimous and overblown by the power companies. Cost shifting isn't a reason not to do it, but climate, electricity price, and individual circumstance are.

 

[UncleDave]

Ya know, sometimes the numbers are overwhelming. The competition back in early 2018 made my solar project the biggest no brainer on the planet. My cost/savings projection was based on my electricity costs at the time; which would be Uber conservative as compared to today.

Oh yeah, I rarely turned on the AC in the hot Los Gatos sun, unless we had company. Now I blare it like there is no tomorrow. And pay less than just about anyone... One tank of gas is the equivalent price to run the house and the Tesla for a month. Actually much more.

Sometimes you get lucky. Well done @UncleDave. Congrats on your win!

The high reflectivity roof, piles of insulation combine with the whole house fan effectively mitigate 90% of my AC use.

These admittedly expensive changes/additions made a huge difference.

 

[Arc]

I live in the shadow of a big hill. I can barely get my solar lights to charge. OK it's not that bad but still not good enough for solar.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I live in the shadow of a big hill. I can barely get my solar lights to charge. OK it's not that bad but still not good enough for solar.

My town averages 330 days of sunshine per year. Everyone was in shorts this past weekend. It hit 81* on Saturday; Sunday was cooler, about 78*. Gonna be 76* today... This is November, after all. February is the cloudiest month, so the panels generate less.

People still do solar projects, but PG&E only pays wholesale. Ya gotta get a battery to make it work and breakeven is longer. FYI, the batteries are made by Tesla. Most of the solar companies are gone now.

 

[mk378]

You don't have to use Tesla batteries though. It looks like generic LFP batteries are down close to $100 per kWh now.

 

[JimPghPA]

Its a no brainer here in Pittsburgh PA also, unfortunately, that no brainer answer is NO WAY.

If it were used here it better be some location where dirt and snow can easily be removed. But even then, the total yearly hours of enough sun at a good enough angle without significant clouds, just dont add up to enough.

Put it on a roof without easy access, and in a few months it will have enough dirt on it to degrade output. And snow, even if its only a small amount, may just stay there for a long time, while it blocks sun.

Then add in roof problems, repair, fire fighter acces safety, selling a house with it.

Theres a reason its very seldom seen around here.

Wish it weren't so, but for our area, the numbers are not there yet.

 

[Rust_Belt_Pete]

Yeah I am in Buffalo NY, this is a bad idea for ME.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Its a no brainer here in Pittsburgh PA also, unfortunately, that no brainer answer is NO WAY.

If it were used here it better be some location where dirt and snow can easily be removed. But even then, the total yearly hours of enough sun at a good enough angle without significant clouds, just dont add up to enough.

Put it on a roof without easy access, and in a few months it will have enough dirt on it to degrade output. And snow, even if its only a small amount, may just stay there for a long time, while it blocks sun.

Then add in roof problems, repair, fire fighter acces safety, selling a house with it.

Theres a reason its very seldom seen around here.

Wish it weren't so, but for our area, the numbers are not there yet.

Installing solar on a half-life, or worse, roof makes little sense. I did a full reroof at the time. They gave me a break due to the "solar project".

I warsh the panels about once a year or so with a long pole brush made for solar panel maintenance.

Yeah I am in Buffalo NY, this is a bad idea for ME.

I was born in Lockport, my Mom was from Kenmore. We left when I was 5 I think. My Dad used to tell me, "Lockport is a nice place to be from."

 

[UncleDave]

Yeah I am in Buffalo NY, this is a bad idea for ME.

As it would be for anyone getting dirt cheap juice and or having little sun.

Its a no brainer here in Pittsburgh PA also, unfortunately, that no brainer answer is NO WAY.

If it were used here it better be some location where dirt and snow can easily be removed. But even then, the total yearly hours of enough sun at a good enough angle without significant clouds, just dont add up to enough.

Put it on a roof without easy access, and in a few months it will have enough dirt on it to degrade output. And snow, even if its only a small amount, may just stay there for a long time, while it blocks sun.

Then add in roof problems, repair, fire fighter acces safety, selling a house with it.

Theres a reason its very seldom seen around here.

Wish it weren't so, but for our area, the numbers are not there yet.

Lots of areas and reasons where just isnt a good idea.

I wouldn't have done it if I weren't doing a roof at the same time, and the roofing company met the solar company onsite and blessed the install.

I never once washed a panel, but wait for the next rain, I can't see much of a difference if any in productivity- in normal day to day swings.

No loan, so no problem selling.
I took the double out of pocket hit for the roof and array.
I also did windows shortly after so a triple whammy I saved a long time for so I could do it all with no loan.
I went without any form of new big toys during this time.

In cali the contract stays with the house so it's got about 17 years remaining on the current deal so if I bail the next guy gets my deal.

 

[Rust_Belt_Pete]

Dirt cheap? Not anymore thanks data centers

 

[Rand]

I'm not sure that PA or OHIO has "dirt cheap" electricity so much as California has very high $$$ electricity.

also most of this area cost has already went up 20-25% and that much again in next few years.

 

[johnmyster]

If I had to guess I'd be at about 22K - 20K in principle 2K in interest assuming I could make 10%.
Im calling the loan satisfied.

[My] Investements are up 20% YTD for 2025 alone. 2023 and 2024 were also gangbusters. You made back your investment but there was an opportunity cost.

 

[UncleDave]

[My] Investements are up 20% YTD for 2025 alone. 2023 and 2024 were also gangbusters. You made back your investment but there was an opportunity cost.

Not really. I factored in opportunity cost at 10%.

I'll avoid from 500-1K a month for the next 17 years.

I can also get 20% but not on everything, and neither can you.

 

[macarose]

I played around with the idea many, many times. We're talking Blill Clinton era to COVID boredom.

The numbers don't work in Georgia for most folks. I'm paying 7.5 cents per kWh and the EMC I have has a monthly maintenance fee of $31 a month that doesn't change regardless of how much you consume.

I can count the number of times my family has exceeded $100 a month with one hand. That's in spite of the fact that my wife has been doing nearly all of her local driving with an EV for the last eight years.

We just don't consume a lot of energy. One neat thing we have is easy access to nearly all our LED bulbs. Just raise our hand and we can adjust the bulb to have just enough light for the room. We also have some nice windows that help keep the busiest areas of the house well lit.

 

[UncleDave]

I played around with the idea many, many times. We're talking Blill Clinton era to COVID boredom.

The numbers don't work in Georgia for most folks. I'm paying 7.5 cents per kWh and the EMC I have has a monthly maintenance fee of $31 a month that doesn't change regardless of how much you consume.

I can count the number of times my family has exceeded $100 a month with one hand. That's in spite of the fact that my wife has been doing nearly all of her local driving with an EV for the last eight years.

We just don't consume a lot of energy. One neat thing we have is easy access to nearly all our LED bulbs. Just raise our hand and we can adjust the bulb to have just enough light for the room. We also have some nice windows that help keep the busiest areas of the house well lit.

Totally get that.

I remember those days like I remember 1 and 2 dollar a gallon gas - very fondly.

I'd have paid over 700.00 for electricity last month without solar.

 

[Astro_Guy]

Its a no brainer here in Pittsburgh PA also, unfortunately, that no brainer answer is NO WAY.

It seems to work for me on the opposite side of PA. I am just over 21 months into this and see a trailing twelve month savings of $2600. There seem to be quite a few installations cropping up in my suburban Philadelphia location.

 

[OVERKILL]

I don't blame you at all for taking advantage of NEM 2 when it was still available. With Cali's electricity prices, this stuff "pencils" far better than areas with reasonable electricity prices and without the ludicrous subsidies.