So, Saab switched from G-05 to Dexcool?

[Auto-Union]

That's what this chart says, or is it just substituting G-05 for VW G-11-ish/conventional type or am I wrong thinking of G-11 as conventional?

http://www.valvoline.com/zerex/pdf/Zerex_CoolantChart.pdf

 

[Auto-Union]

I know you can't mix high-silicate with anything else, so why would they say to now use G-05 with the old Saab/VW chemistry, I thought that G-11 was high silicated too???

 

[brianl703]

My 2006 Saab 93 is definitely filled with Dex-Cool. The Opel/GM specification number for the coolant used in later Saabs/Opels is the same as it is for Dex-Cool, GM 6277M.

G11 is described as "long life" coolant. I think a high silicate coolant is NOT long life; 2-3 years at max.

 

[Auto-Union]

Yeah, but did we see any LL OAT coolant on the market before 1996...Dex and G-12? Even G-05 H/OAT?

 

[brianl703]

According to this http://www.imcool.com/articles/antifreeze-coolant/G05-Glysantin.php

"The version now being installed by DC, and tested by Ford, is based on the German BASF product, Glysantin G 05. It has been used in extensively in European Mercedes Benz and other manufacturer’s vehicles since the late 1980’s."

I couldn't find any reference as to when G05 was introduced by BASF.

As far as G11 being high silicate, it is claimed elsewhere that it is the same as G48 and here is what a spec sheet for Zerex G48 says:

Valvoline’s Glysantin G 48 antifreeze coolant is a
universal ethylene glycol-based formulation suitable for
passenger cars, light trucks and heavy-duty vehicles.
The formulation is designed for both gasoline and diesel
engines. Its low-silicate, low pH, phosphate free
European technology protects all cooling system metals,
including aluminum, from corrosion. The ASTM and
other test data shown on this sheet reflect the high
performance corrosion inhibitor package.

http://www.deckmanoil.com/downloads_products//Zerex/Zerex+G+48++Antifreeze 103002.pdf

 

[brianl703]

Also here is another spec sheet for G48 directly from BASF. Interesting to note it says "Supersedes edition of June 1995"

http://www.univar.co.uk/downloads/Glysantin_G48_TDS1.pdf

Glysantin G 48 is an engine coolant concentrate based on ethylene
glycol. It contains a hybrid corrosion inhibitor package with salts of
organic acids and silicates. Glysantin G 48 is free of nitrites, amines
and phosphates.

 

[Auto-Union]

Hmm. A coolant compatability chart I saw said everything mixes with everything except with high-silicate (Olde Prestone). Along with a warning against mixing G-11 with G-12, as well as other factors lead me to believe that G-11 was high silicated. Oh well, live an learn.

 

[brianl703]

Incidentally, Prestone and Peak both make OAT coolants they claim will mix with anything, even high-silicate coolant.

But high-silicate coolant is getting harder and harder to find.

 

[brianl703]

Here's a link to all of the BASF coolant specifications and their industry approvals:

http://www.performancechemicals.basf.com...lants/approvals

Looks like Saab used G48 before they used G34 (Dex-Cool/GM6277M).

 

[JohnBrowning]

Of course they switched they are owned by GM and G-05 is not part of GM's global sourceing system! I am suprised it took this long!

 

[MI_Roger]

Actually, Saab switched from G-48 to Dex-Cool in 2001, they never used G-05 as factory fill.

I own two Saabs, a 2000 and a 2006. The older car requires G-48, which is not readily available in the US but G-05 is readily available and compatible. The newer car requires Dex-Cool.

I have found some internet parts houses specializing in Saab cars who still sell the G-48 coolant in Saab 1-gallon jugs. Some Saab Dealers are said to carry it also, but other Dealers will try to sell you Dex-Cool and say it is compatible. I guess they are hoping the same foolish customers who believe them will return later to have their engine replaced.

 

[JHZR2]

you can get G-48 as BMW blue coolant. In my BMW, I did a detailed analysis, and found that G-05 is nearly identical to G-48, s that is what Ive been running with great results...

JMH

 

[HondaMan]

Originally Posted By: MI_Roger
Actually, Saab switched from G-48 to Dex-Cool in 2001, they never used G-05 as factory fill.

I own two Saabs, a 2000 and a 2006. The older car requires G-48, which is not readily available in the US but G-05 is readily available and compatible. The newer car requires Dex-Cool.

I have found some internet parts houses specializing in Saab cars who still sell the G-48 coolant in Saab 1-gallon jugs. Some Saab Dealers are said to carry it also, but other Dealers will try to sell you Dex-Cool and say it is compatible. I guess they are hoping the same foolish customers who believe them will return later to have their engine replaced.


This is all true.

The BMW crowd used to raid the Saab dealers of the Saab labeled G-48 as it was priced much cheaper than the BMW labeled version. Now as most Saab dealers do not have the G-48 version, the only sources of G-48 are the $19 a gallon BMW jugs.

I am told that Valvoline does source G-48 and it is available in drums only, but I have never seen any proof.

I'm sure had Saab stayed Saab, they would have never adopted Dex-Cool.

 

[CosmicFlash]

Originally Posted By: JohnBrowning
Of course they switched they are owned by GM and G-05 is not part of GM's global sourceing system! I am suprised it took this long!


I know for the 03' MY on the 9-3SS it is Dex-cool however the container said "Saab GM Coolant" if I remember correctly. I asked the tech and he said it's just regular old Dex-Cool.

 

[Kestas]

This may be more of a rhetorical question, but did Saab change the design or materials of their cooling system when they made the switch?

 

[JHZR2]

you can get pentosin G-48 concentrate somewhat easily. Sold in 1L bottles, and IIRC are cheaper than the OE stuff. Have to check that to be sure, since they can play games since it is a 1L bottle.

There may or may not be a chemistry difference between saab LL coolant and Dex cool. I think the spec is glysantin G-37, which is a chemistry that is a dex-cool like formulation.

Having done a radiator drain and refill on my 98 chev truck (got texaco dex-cool) and my 04 saab (got saab long-life coolant), can tell you that there is an appearance difference, with the dex cool being very solid orange color, and the saab coolant being lighter orange with a much more fluorescent sheen to it, FWIW. The texaco stuff was also more miscible in water, at least given the short time frame when I mixed some up and poured it in.

JMH

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Kestas
This may be more of a rhetorical question, but did Saab change the design or materials of their cooling system when they made the switch?


Well, for example on the 03 and up cars, the engine shares some basic components with the ecotec block, so likely the materials issue is a non-issue, since it was a ground-up redesign and had a similar basic structure to other dex-cool consumers.

Whether the pre-03 cars had some fundamental change, i dont know.

Ive always read that such a thing was the reason why the older series truck engines (4.3, 5.7, etc.) had issues with dex cool. Not because there was anything fndamentally wrong with it, but because parts werent designed for use with dex, and so things popped up here and there. This is also why engines designed to use it have zero problems.

JMH

 

[brianl703]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Having done a radiator drain and refill on my 98 chev truck (got texaco dex-cool) and my 04 saab (got saab long-life coolant), can tell you that there is an appearance difference


I think Prestone Dex-Cool looks different from Texaco Dex-Cool too.