Since My Car Burns Oil...

Messages
895
Location
Brooklyn, NY
About 2 quarts over a 3000 mile periods, is it safe to extend the oil change interbal to 5000 miles on dino, since I am sort of refreshing the oil by adding the additional quarts? I have a known sludger - 97 Toyota Avalon, 1MZ-FE.
 
Messages
853
Location
east TN
I would recommend the thickest and cheapest syn you could run in your climate. Thicker to slow down the consumption (possibly) Synthetic to prevent sludge in a known sludger
 
Messages
7,077
Location
Ontario, Canada
I would say not a good idea. Have you brought the car to a Toyota dealership to see if you are a candidate for a free engine under their special warranty? With that consumption it's probably already sludged.
 

parimento1

Thread starter
Messages
895
Location
Brooklyn, NY
The Toyota slude warranty was 10 years, mine is past that. I pulled the valve covers at ~85k and it was free of sludge...had some varnish and a bit of grit, but I think it was OK. The engine now has 153,000 miles.
 
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4,942
Location
Billings, MT
I'm not a Mobil 1 person, but I've been using the 10W-30 High Mileage to top off my sump and it has slowed my consumption significantly. It will also help keep your sludge prone engine clean.
 
Messages
6,987
Location
Michigan
If the sludge issue has not destroyed your car yet it is probably not a big issue. But on a known sludge prone engine if you plan to keep using dino them change it at 3,000 miles. I agree to run a thicker or HM oil to slow consumption.
 

parimento1

Thread starter
Messages
895
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Yea, I just changed it now, I figure better safe than sorry...I used Peak 5W30 that I got for free. I have 5 more quarts of that, and 5 more of QS, then I will try Mobil 1, probably for an extended drain interval.
 
Messages
1,563
Location
North Carolina, USA
Sludge is not your problem with this engine. The rings are of a very low-tension design and stick very easy if services are not kept up and kept short AND some type of fuel system cleaner is used. Having been a Toyota Master tech. for many years,I have been inside more than my share of these motors. Without fail, the oil control rings will usually be stuck to some extent even if the rest of the engine is clean. If I had one of these engines with this problem my plan of attack would be simple. Nuetra 131 in every tank of gas and something like Auto-RX for at least two bottles. I've seen the 131 do wonders over an extended period. It's not a one or two tankful fix but it will over time break loose carbon deposits. The Auto-RX will attack it from the oil side. As far as oil, if it's burning it I would run something like plain old Rotella T in it. Boy,that'll get 'em stirred up.
 
Messages
782
Location
Alberta
My thinking is that most of those engines that had sludge, were probably run on a Group I based 10W-30. These GI based oils were still quite common even in the previous oil spec, SL, in the early 2000's. The older Group I based oils couldn't handle heat near as well as the current Group II based oils, as there is a huge difference in thermal/oxidative stability between Group I and II base oils. With the current high quality SM rated GII based oils, even at 5k miles that engine should be fine. With and additional 2 quarts going in every 5k, I see no problem at all at running 5k on these oils.
 
Messages
15,052
Location
Canada
 Originally Posted By: parimento1
Yea, I just changed it now, I figure better safe than sorry...I used Peak 5W30 that I got for free. I have 5 more quarts of that, and 5 more of QS, then I will try Mobil 1, probably for an extended drain interval.
Just how 'exteneded' an interval are planning? 10k miles seems to be about the most these engines will take on the best syn oils.
 
Messages
39,806
Location
Pottstown, PA
If the consumption is pretty constant from when you change it, then I'd say you're okay to go out a bit longer before changing it. If it's getting worse as you approach 3k ..then it's another story. I'd also figure on how much fuel you're going through to reach that 3k mark. If you're getting some dismal mpg, then your oil isn't really doing 3k ..it's probably doing 5k+ worth of work.
 
Messages
1,648
Location
Little Rock, AR
Wow, I haven't seen a Mokanic post in a fortnite. Glad to see you back. Meanwhile, I have a '98 Sienna (160k miles) and my consumption is almost identical to yours. I historically burn 1 qt in the first 1k and 1 qt in the next 2k of an OCI. I've had Toyota mechs inside the engine - no sludge issues - engine very clean. So apparently it's the oil ring issue that Mokanic describes. BTW, I routinely ran M1 for 8-9k OCIs - and all is well - except the consumption issue. Good luck.
 
Messages
286
Location
New Orleans La
My wife has a 1996 Avalon. Three years ago one day she calls and said her car smoked. She had the oil changed at a jiffy lube. That night I changed the oil to three quarts 10w40 and two quarts 20w50 maxlife IIRC. After that I used 15w40 Rotella until recently after I found it has consumed one quart in about 1600 miles. This time I put 20w50 penzoil. I always thought it the valve stem seals. Anyway we use it as a spare car putting about 150 miles a month. Sometimes a little more/less. I never heard of the low tenson rings. I did run a couple RX a couple of times, but just never went back to 5w30. Maybe I'll try something in the oil like MMO.
 
Messages
1,648
Location
Little Rock, AR
 Originally Posted By: Bullet
My wife has a 1996 Avalon. Three years ago one day she calls and said her car smoked. She had the oil changed at a jiffy lube. That night I changed the oil to three quarts 10w40 and two quarts 20w50 maxlife IIRC. After that I used 15w40 Rotella until recently after I found it has consumed one quart in about 1600 miles. This time I put 20w50 penzoil. I always thought it the valve stem seals. Anyway we use it as a spare car putting about 150 miles a month. Sometimes a little more/less. I never heard of the low tenson rings. I did run a couple RX a couple of times, but just never went back to 5w30. Maybe I'll try something in the oil like MMO.
I'd recommend studying up on Schaeffer's Neutra 131 instead of MMO. Neutra can be used in the fuel (see Mokanic's post above) and in the oil - typically should be used for the last 500-700 miles of an OCI. It's chemistry does a slow clean - unlike, and very likely more effective, than Seafoam, and the quick flushes. Or go with the Auto-rx. But I don't think MMO is going to do much for you - I've had quite a bit of it in my crankcase on two occassions, and I use it pretty regular in the gas of my Sienna - can't say it's done anything. Meanwhile, I did a couple of runs (way back) with 131 in my '98 Sienna's crank case and in the gas. Saw improvement in consumption - perhaps by half. The van started seeing fewer miles (secondary vehicle) so I didn't bother staying with it. However, this summer it's going to see perhaps 4-5k of hard vacation miles - so I'm re-invigorated by Mokanic's post to start pushing the 131 thru it - cause consumption is still an issue. Will likely make a lunch time run (a long one) to my Sch. distributor tomorrow and get a couple of gallons. BTW, Neutra is very economical - last time I bought some it was $16/gal. - and that goes a long ways. I'll keep it running all summer in the gas tank and for the last 1k of my OCI (which I'll now shorten to the end of summer).
 
Messages
1,563
Location
North Carolina, USA
 Originally Posted By: Bullet
My wife has a 1996 Avalon. Three years ago one day she calls and said her car smoked. She had the oil changed at a jiffy lube. That night I changed the oil to three quarts 10w40 and two quarts 20w50 maxlife IIRC. After that I used 15w40 Rotella until recently after I found it has consumed one quart in about 1600 miles. This time I put 20w50 penzoil. I always thought it the valve stem seals. Anyway we use it as a spare car putting about 150 miles a month. Sometimes a little more/less. I never heard of the low tenson rings. I did run a couple RX a couple of times, but just never went back to 5w30. Maybe I'll try something in the oil like MMO.
Low-tension rings were initially seen on race engines way back as a way to free up horse power from decreasing drag that all internal moving parts have. Toyota/Honda led the way on passenger car applications way back in the mid-80s. Now,regardless of the car manufacterer, just about all gasoline engines have low-tension rings in them. They decrease engine wear,heat,and moving mass but they also are more inclined to stick in applications that see infrequent oil services or in the case of the Toyota Avalon/Camry engines that due to design are rougher on oil. Today, even your diesels are using the design and the trend is going to even lower tension rings with thinner designs. The top compression ring on my old 81 22R is thicker than ALL three rings combined on some new applications. The oils are better now and engine designs(as a whole)are running cleaner than ever.
 
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