should my next car be a diesel?

[Robertslowpoke]

Hi everyone! thanks for all the great help with car maintenance! i have often thought of buying a diesel CAR, not a truck. I like 4 door, well equipped cars.
1. can you suggest a make and model car to buy? i would also buy used, including BMW, VW< mercedes, etc. bmw 335D,etc.
2. is a diesel worth the effort? difficulty finding diesel fuel? I live north of boston, mass. price of diesel seems high.
3. is maintenance difficult? could my mechanic handle it?
will I see better gas mileage?
4. enough power? start in cold winter? garage heated to 50 degrees or at least 40.
i really over maintain my vehicles. i have an open mind, and am willing to learn!!! would love to hear any and all ideas!! i think i am ruling out a truck.
best

bob

 

[Steve S]

Will you put enough miles on the car to see any payback for the extra $$$ for the engine? If you just have to have a diesel engine then the $$$ will not matter. Todays diesel engines start well at colder temps.

 

[renegade_987]

Well, for the car I would say either a VW Jetta or a BMW. Diesel should be easy to find, just a little higher priced. Most sedans that are diesel get great gas mileage, I think the new Jetta Diesel gets like 42 MPG. Mechanics can probably handle a diesel just as well as a gas, and DIY work is pretty easy, too. There should be plenty of power, and if your garage is heated that much, it should start just fine.

 

[Johnny]

Kind of off topic, but I've always wondered why they refer to "gas mileage" when it's a diesel. Shouldn't it be "diesel mileage"?

 

[40Deluxe]

It is fuel mileage,that way all the bases are covered except when talking about electric.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: Johnny
Kind of off topic, but I've always wondered why they refer to "gas mileage" when it's a diesel. Shouldn't it be "diesel mileage"?


How about "fuel mileage"?

Personally I'd LOVE a VW jetta TDI with my type of driving and such a diesel makes great sense until you look at the engine with all the emission stuff that will cost big $$$ down the road.

For now I'm going to stick with the mid 40's MPG Corolla since its simple. Once it gets high mileage (I'm only at 205k) I'm prob going to pick up a KIA Forte with low miles. the gas engines are so much simpler.

Take care, Bill

 

[np6000]

Bill,

My sentiments exactly. I was pondering an 06 Jetta TDI as it has the least amount of aftertreatment for a relatively late model diesel.

Mid 40's MPG for an 03-08 Corolla is impressive. Are you doing anything specific to enhance the fuel economy? Or is it just technique?

 

[expat]

I rented a Citroen Diesel in France a few years back, the car was the size of a Honda Accord and no 'slug', over a two week period we averaged almost 60 imp MPG!!!
The engine was smooth, quite and started like a Gas engine (I understand the engine was a Ford Design)
I would LOVE a small Diesel, but even in Canada right now, the selection is limited.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Diesels are great although I think next gen electric cars with gas generators will eclipse them. Don't be turned off by worry worts over emissions systems.

 

[The motor guy]

Stay away from the 07s and up. They have a the same emission junk that a gas engine has and then some. They are a PITA. There are so many sensors that it's just a matter of time before something goes wrong.

 

[Thermo1223]

Complete arrogant idiocy above, I guess we should go back to carbs instead of FI right?

The emission system is federally warrantied to last 8yr/80k so I wouldn't worry. These systems keep us breathing and keep them clean for public acceptance.

I would worry about HP fuel pump since those seem to be failing from lack of lubrication(diesel fuel). I have not heard of VW admitting fault on a design flaw with it yet.

 

[NateDN10]

Diesels have come a long way. Quiet, quick starting, good power, low emissions. IMO, the only downside is cost.

 

[rg200amp]

Originally Posted By: NateDN10
Diesels have come a long way. Quiet, quick starting, good power, low emissions. IMO, the only downside is cost.

+1


The extra costs of the car from the dealer (compared to the gas version), the EXTRA maintenance costs that goes with diesel, the fact diesel fuel has been more $$$ than petrol for quite a while, and the extra trouble during winter months (what with fuel gelling) lead me to think that if your not driving 100(s) of miles a day, you will never see the cost savings.

It is nice being able to say I have a diesel though. . . .

 

[sasilverbullet]

"the EXTRA maintenance costs that goes with diesel" - ????

I think my vw bug diesel is cheaper to maintain. Where are you getting this from?

 

[Spazdog]

It's all about the price of admission.

You can get the two-point-slow Jetta for under $16K. 2.5 can be had well under $20K. But then you go to the diesel end of the lot and the oil burning Jettas are $25K+.

Your market's prices may vary.

But it's kept me out of a diesel.

You do get the satisfaction of pumping 10 gallons into your tank and knowing that you just went 400 miles.But then you realize you could have gone just as far on that dollar amount of regular unleaded in an average 4 cylinder gasoline engined car in that class.

 

[JHZR2]

1. can you suggest a make and model car to buy? i would also buy used, including BMW, VW< mercedes, etc. bmw 335D,etc.

My brother has a 2011 VW Golf TDI and it consistently returns >55MPG. It is a nice, utilitarian car. The super-high torque fancier vehicles that all are equipped with ATs are IMO a long-term issue because of the weakness and maintenance costs associated with ATs, especially these modern, high gear number units. That said, Ive always had a soft spot for MB diesels, and would consider a 2006 E320 CDI heavily. Id also look at w124 body diesels from the late 1990s.

2. is a diesel worth the effort? difficulty finding diesel fuel? I live north of boston, mass. price of diesel seems high.

We export much of our diesel production and road tax it heavily. Plus the low sulfur capital costs have to be recouped. You need to consider the cost per mile due to the MPG advantage... especially since you can sometimes get a bigger car with better MPGs.

3. is maintenance difficult? could my mechanic handle it?
will I see better gas mileage?

It is funny... Diesel emissions equipment has gotten to the level of ga$$er complexity/cost. Meanwhile ga$$er injection equipment has started to creep up to the point of diesel complexity/cost. You WILL see better MPGs, but it is application dependent. For a sedan or small wagon, there is a HUGE benefit. For an SUV, the BMW and MB diesel offerings give better performance at higher economy, but none will beat the lexus hybrid...


4. enough power? start in cold winter? garage heated to 50 degrees or at least 40.

My 67 hp, 30 year old 240D has enough power. You learn to drive a diesel and there are no issues. Its not as "fast" as a ga$$er, but then again, when driving the ga$ car harder, you get far poorer MPGs too. Ive started my cars down to zero degrees unassisted. Glow plugs allow for a fine start. Like any engine, they can be a bit stiff for the first few miles, but then again, I wouldnt want to WOT and redline my ga$$er right out of the garage either in the cold.

 

[David S.]

I say the decision to own and drive a diesel car depends on your typical commutes. If the commutes are long distance (more than say 10 or 20 miles) and mostly highway then I'd recommend a diesel car. If the commutes are short distance or a mix of highway/city type driving then the decision could go either way between diesel, gasoline, hybrid, and electric. If the commutes are short and mostly city type driving then I'd recommend either a hybrid or an electric.

If I were looking to buy a new car today I'd go with a new Golf TDI 6-speed manual transmission 4-door. The automatic transmission, called the DSG, is very nice but boosts the price by about $1000 and requires maintenance every 40K miles.

In my area diesel costs vary by season. In the winter it costs about the same as high octane gasoline. In the spring and fall it costs about the same as low octane gasoline. In the summer it is usually less expensive than low octane gasoline.

The average fuel economy with a diesel strongly depends on how the engine is "broken in," our driving style, and the type of driving we do. With my 2005.5 Jetta TDI 5-speed with currently around 70K miles I typically average between 52 MPG and 57 MPG (US gallons). The car is used mostly for highway driving with a small amount of city driving, during weekday rush hour.

The two noteworthy things to point out regarding maintenance on my 2005.5 Jetta TDI, which also apply to all the VW diesels made from that point forward (and probably to earlier models):

1) The oil and oil filter are changed every 10K miles. The oil filter is a cartridge at the top of the engine, very easy to access. The oil needs to meet VW specs and is not available at most of the places we buy oil - instead we usually need to get it from Internet sources. The oil is typically between $7 and $12 per liter. About 4.5 liters are needed for each oil change.

2) The fuel filter is changed every 20K miles. It too is a cartridge at the top of the engine and very easy to access.

Visit http://tdiclub.com/ to get more facts and opinions on diesels...

 

[rg200amp]

Originally Posted By: sasilverbullet
"the EXTRA maintenance costs that goes with diesel" - ????

I think my vw bug diesel is cheaper to maintain. Where are you getting this from?


LOOK at todays diesel maintenance needs.

Water filters, diesel particulate filters.

They require more oil changes as per car maker, more fuel filter chages aswell.

Not to mention winter time issues.


This is nothing new. You know this.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted By: rg200amp
Originally Posted By: sasilverbullet
"the EXTRA maintenance costs that goes with diesel" - ????

I think my vw bug diesel is cheaper to maintain. Where are you getting this from?


LOOK at todays diesel maintenance needs.

Water filters, diesel particulate filters.

They require more oil changes as per car maker, more fuel filter chages aswell.

Not to mention winter time issues.


This is nothing new. You know this.
[censored]. DPF is not a maintenance item. Fuel filters on all cars should be changed (ie your M3) at some interval. Oil change intervals are as long as gassers.

 

[Robertslowpoke]

THANK YOU EVERYBODY!!! Lots for me to think about, and i have an open mind! as an aside, my friend buys cummins diesel dodge trucks, got rid of his last one, totally rusted out, at 340,000 miles. he is now driving another, which he totally modified for HUGE horsepower.

keep the ideas coming!!

thank you again!

Bob