Seeing more VW Micro Busses

LouC said:
I predict a short life for that product, too expensive and limited market. Same for VWs trying to reprise the International Scout. They're clueless about some things.
About the old school VW vans, one of the best conversions was one sold by Crown manufacturing in the late 60s. It allowed you to swap a Corvair flat six into a bus or beetle. So you went from a 1.6 liter at most with 60 hp to a 3.0 liter with more than double the HP. Really made sense, from the point of view of using the bus to actually move cargo.
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Many automakers still can not figure out that the masses can not afford vehicles between $50,000 to $99,000 to over $100K.
Yeah, of course many years ago they sold thousands and thousands of popular vehicles like the VW vans and the VW Beetles etc.... but they were fair and sanely priced.

I know it costs a lot more to build some these days but I will never be convinced until someone shows reports and paper work showing all of the costs involved by all these automakers to prove they must charge the wildly highest prices in the history of the automobile to be able to make money/profit. I refuse to believe they must charge those prices to make any money. I think they simply got away with so much of the greed factor since the early 2000s that they are not about to go back until forced to.

At the same time they simply keep raising the prices on vehicles while new ones keep sitting piled up all over the dealer lots. Some dealers have trouble clearing the lots for the next years models these days. Someone is gonna have to blink.
 
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I have 2 Westfalia VW campers and both are original. I rebuilt the motors myself with German parts. There is no comparison to the experience of using one of these to camp or travel. They are slow by todays standards but I can't stop smiling when I drive them. One is a 1975 Orange one that has an 1800 motor made to 2.0L and the other one is a 1986 that has the 2.1 L waterboxer motor. Both are stick and the 86 has AC that works. I am the second owner on both of them. We traveled all over in the 86 till my wife decided she needed one that had AC when parked and a toilet on board. They have seen little use since then. I still get them out of the garage and drive them when I can. At least with the original motor you can get parts for them and they are easy to maintain. I have owned an un- rememberable number of VW's and started with a 55 Bug and a 59 Bus.
 
vwmaniaman said:
I have owned an un- rememberable number of VW's and started with a 55 Bug and a 59 Bus.
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Gimmie a oval rear window V-Dub with the tiny tail lights... Cool as heck.
And a Ghia. And a 356 bath tub....

'56 Rag... Needs Porsche Chromies.
1759184674275.webp
 
JeffKeryk said:
Gimmie a small rear window bug with the small tail lights... Cool as heck.
And a Ghia. And a 356 bath tub....

'56 Rag... Needs Porsche Chromies.
View attachment 302650
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I spent a couple years in high school going everyplace with a good friend in his , I think a 72 VW Beetle. We loved that car. What surprised me was the amount of room inside. His had the stick shift on the floor. What we really liked was the lack of money we had to use on traveling fuel. Car seemed to run forever on a tank of petrol. Fun times for sure.
 
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Trav said:
Some people just do not get it! The Europeans have the EU jackboot on their necks and are being forced in going EV even though the vast majority want nothing to do with them. Americans overwhelmingly rejected the EV and green agenda. It is time to dump this experiment into the trash can of history just like was done in the early 20th century. JMO
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Americans overwhelmingly thought(!) they are too expensive. It's only in the last couple years that they have been available at relatively affordable prices. And the prices continue to fall.

When they are equivalent to or cheaper than gas vehicles, what will you say then?
 
SammyChevelleTypeS3 said:
Many automakers still can not figure out that the masses can not afford vehicles between $50,000 to $99,000 to over $100K.
Yeah, of course many years ago they sold thousands and thousands of popular vehicles like the VW vans and the VW Beetles etc.... but they were fair and sanely priced.

I know it costs a lot more to build some these days but I will never be convinced until someone shows reports and paper work showing all of the costs involved by all these automakers to prove they must charge the wildly highest prices in the history of the automobile to be able to make money/profit. I refuse to believe they must charge those prices to make any money. I think they simply got away with so much of the greed factor since the early 2000s that they are not about to go back until forced to.

At the same time they simply keep raising the prices on vehicles while new ones keep sitting piled up all over the dealer lots. Some dealers have trouble clearing the lots for the next years models these days. Someone is gonna have to blink.
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Yes, I agree. Both EV and ICE vehicles are too expensive.

Some of it is the fault of required safety equipment, that those cheap vehicles back in the day did not have.

It's still possible to buy brand new cars in the 3rd world in the $10-20K range, ICE and EV. There is an entire class of tiny EVs in China for less than 100,000 CNY, or $14,045 USD, new with warranty. But would Americans accept the safety compromises that come with that? Probably not.

Wait before I finish this post,

(Portuguese language article)
https://www.automaistv.com.br/venda...00-com-calota-e-305-km-de-autonomia-na-china/

The BYD Dolphin Mini, which is the same car sold as the BYD Seagull in China, is starting at R$51800 in my wife's native country, Brazil. That is $9688.46 USD as converted at the current mid-market rate.

The relative lack of safety would probably be improved in Sao Paulo and Rio, because, most of the time you're rarely going over 30mph.
 
vwmaniaman said:
I have 2 Westfalia VW campers and both are original. I rebuilt the motors myself with German parts. There is no comparison to the experience of using one of these to camp or travel. They are slow by todays standards but I can't stop smiling when I drive them. One is a 1975 Orange one that has an 1800 motor made to 2.0L and the other one is a 1986 that has the 2.1 L waterboxer motor. Both are stick and the 86 has AC that works. I am the second owner on both of them. We traveled all over in the 86 till my wife decided she needed one that had AC when parked and a toilet on board. They have seen little use since then. I still get them out of the garage and drive them when I can. At least with the original motor you can get parts for them and they are easy to maintain. I have owned an un- rememberable number of VW's and started with a 55 Bug and a 59 Bus.
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There's a VW van in the neighbourhood, same body style as your '86. The switch to the Wasserboxer was what, early '80s?

I don't know if this one is air- or water-cooled. I'd love to talk to the owner sometime.

Regardless, it makes me smile everytime I see it.
 
Zee09 said:
Don't see them much anymore
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True, they were everywhere when I was a teenager back in the day. I have taken long road trips in them a few times with friends. 40-45 up the mountain passes in the West.

The thing is you can now get a Suburban that gets the same or better mileage on the highway and has four times as much power.
 
The American market will never appreciate a vehicle like this. That’s why they haven’t sold the T5, T6, and T7 here. Does fine in Europe where it is appreciated. Mercedes had the same issue with the Metris.
 
The Vanagons which is the newer body came out in 1980 with the air-cooled 2 L motor that made 67hp on a good day. The body was heavier than the older Bay window bus. In 1984 was the first full year of the waterboxer and it was a 1.9 L motor that made 95 HP. In 1986 they went to a larger 2.1 L waterboxer and it made 101hp. Still low in power and VW started fuel injection on them in 1975. I had a 1983 van with seven seats that was the aircooled with automatic transmission and AC and drove it cross country. It was fine as long as you didn't care about going over the speed limit. I then had a 1984 Westfalia and a 1985 Westfalia and now the 1986 Westfalia. They are completely well thought out campers that I have traveled many miles in. The Samba web site is loaded with information about them and source for and help or information. They are getting old since the last one was 1990. Parts are getting harder to source so you keep spares when you find them. I have had so much fun owning them that I can't say anything against them.
 
SammyChevelleTypeS3 said:
...

At the same time they simply keep raising the prices on vehicles while new ones keep sitting piled up all over the dealer lots. Some dealers have trouble clearing the lots for the next years models these days. Someone is gonna have to blink.
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DO you know why?
Because the public in todays world isnt as price sensitive as yesterdays world.
Yesterday's world they would save money to buy stuff, on a vehicle even a small loan that would be over in 3 or 4 years. Also the loan wouldnt be so big and it would have to simply be a reasonable part of the family budget.

Todays world? 7 or 8 year mortgages on vehicles, some of the cars they trade in arent even paid off yet. In addition to credit card debt, home mortgages... even payments on their home appliances and bedroom mattresses. They are hooked on debt, borrowing money for stuff they shouldn't buy. Darn it. I have trouble at times finding the price of cars now (and some other products at times), over the last decade or two, its ingrained in the public mind not to advertise price, advertise the monthly payment. Humans are part of the animal kingdom and believe it or not, the pecking order exists. The intelligent ones makes money selling them stuff they havent saved up for and as another bonus making more money lending them the money for the stuff they havent saved up for. :)
 
alarmguy said:
DO you know why?
Because the public in todays world isnt as price sensitive as yesterdays world.
Yesterday's world they would save money to buy stuff, on a vehicle even a small loan that would be over in 3 or 4 years. Also the loan wouldnt be so big and it would have to simply be a reasonable part of the family budget.

Todays world? 7 or 8 year mortgages on vehicles, some of the cars they trade in arent even paid off yet. In addition to credit card debt, home mortgages... even payments on their home appliances and bedroom mattresses. They are hooked on debt, borrowing money for stuff they shouldn't buy. Darn it. I have trouble at times finding the price of cars now (and some other products at times), over the last decade or two, its ingrained in the public mind not to advertise price, advertise the monthly payment. Humans are part of the animal kingdom and believe it or not, the pecking order exists. The intelligent ones makes money selling them stuff they havent saved up for and as another bonus making more money lending them the money for the stuff they havent saved up for. :)
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The 7-8 year car payments and price increases came from really low interest rates or subsidies. People felt no interest so what is big deal. Some people go as far as thinking they are winning by overbuying/borrowing at low rate/long term and investing it. They leave out risk.
 
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