I've been all over the rotella site looking for the hths ratings for the 3 main grades of hdeo. I've even looked at the voa area also with no luck. Can anyone anwser this question for me on triple t, t-5 and t-6.
Thanks
Thanks
Rotella htst?
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HT/HS for T6 5w-40 is around 4, based on some past email exchanges with SOPUS.
Not sure on the others.
Not sure on the others.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
HT/HS for T6 5w-40 is around 4, based on some past email exchanges with SOPUS.
Not sure on the others.
Hey QP wasn't that the Canadian version? And are they the same as the US? I would assume so, but you never know. I'm curious about this as well as I use T6 in my bike.
HT/HS for T6 5w-40 is around 4, based on some past email exchanges with SOPUS.
Not sure on the others.
Hey QP wasn't that the Canadian version? And are they the same as the US? I would assume so, but you never know. I'm curious about this as well as I use T6 in my bike.
The reason i am wondering is that dd says that 10w30 can be used but has to have a ht/hs rating of 3.8 or higher. Anyone know of 10w30 oils that meet this spec?
Originally Posted By: simplistic
The reason i am wondering is that dd says that 10w30 can be used but has to have a ht/hs rating of 3.8 or higher.
That's a tall order for a 10w-30 grade. Even a heavy oil like M1 HM 10w-30 only has HTHS of 3.5 cP.
Amsoil's 10w-30 is at 3.6 cP.
The reason i am wondering is that dd says that 10w30 can be used but has to have a ht/hs rating of 3.8 or higher.
That's a tall order for a 10w-30 grade. Even a heavy oil like M1 HM 10w-30 only has HTHS of 3.5 cP.
Amsoil's 10w-30 is at 3.6 cP.
I agree, so i do no know then if i misread the book. Maybe it was 3.6 then. I am checking out dd looking for aproved oils.
I found cummins requires min 3.6 ht/hs. I guess dd and most other diesel engine makers have similer requirments.
I found cummins requires min 3.5 ht/hs and meet their ring and liner requirements. I guess dd and most other diesel engine makers have simular requirements.
Well i found my anwser. DD requires any oil used have a min 3.7 ht/hs rating. That's a tall order on a 10w30 oil. So that being the case how could dd recomand 10w30 if none meet there spec?
Originally Posted By: simplistic
I've been all over the rotella site looking for the hths ratings for the 3 main grades of hdeo. I've even looked at the voa area also with no luck. Can anyone anwser this question for me on triple t, t-5 and t-6.
Thanks
you could mix some t5 and t6 I suppose.
I dont think sopus publishes actual numbers
but RTS 5w40 should be between 4 and 4.2
I've been all over the rotella site looking for the hths ratings for the 3 main grades of hdeo. I've even looked at the voa area also with no luck. Can anyone anwser this question for me on triple t, t-5 and t-6.
Thanks
you could mix some t5 and t6 I suppose.
I dont think sopus publishes actual numbers
but RTS 5w40 should be between 4 and 4.2
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: simplistic
Well i found my anwser. DD requires any oil used have a min 3.7 ht/hs rating. That's a tall order on a 10w30 oil. So that being the case how could dd recomand 10w30 if none meet there spec?
For what it's worth, Mobil Delvac Elite 10w-30 has Detroil Diesel builder approval 93K218. Mobil's other 10w-30 HDEO and 0w-30 HDEO do not.
Well i found my anwser. DD requires any oil used have a min 3.7 ht/hs rating. That's a tall order on a 10w30 oil. So that being the case how could dd recomand 10w30 if none meet there spec?
For what it's worth, Mobil Delvac Elite 10w-30 has Detroil Diesel builder approval 93K218. Mobil's other 10w-30 HDEO and 0w-30 HDEO do not.
I guess that means for most if not all of the new 10w30 hdeo will have to be at min a syn-blend?
DD demands HT/HS >= 3,5cP for xw-30 oils .
This one is pretty recent(y.2013), see page 8:
http://www.ddcsn.com/cps/rde/xbcr/ddcsn/DDC-SVC-BRO-0001.pdf
Most of the xw-30 HDEO oils are around 3,6cP(even those which are Volvo VDS-4). Volvo demands HT/HS of >=3,4cP after 90 cycles(for 15w-30),but since these oils carry some other OEM approvals at the same time,their HT/HS visc.is usually >3,5cP.
10w-30 and 5w-30 have been factory and service fill in the Euro engines for some time now ...
This one is pretty recent(y.2013), see page 8:
http://www.ddcsn.com/cps/rde/xbcr/ddcsn/DDC-SVC-BRO-0001.pdf
Most of the xw-30 HDEO oils are around 3,6cP(even those which are Volvo VDS-4). Volvo demands HT/HS of >=3,4cP after 90 cycles(for 15w-30),but since these oils carry some other OEM approvals at the same time,their HT/HS visc.is usually >3,5cP.
10w-30 and 5w-30 have been factory and service fill in the Euro engines for some time now ...
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: simplistic
The reason i am wondering is that dd says that 10w30 can be used but has to have a ht/hs rating of 3.8 or higher. Anyone know of 10w30 oils that meet this spec?
DD lube manual does state 3.8, but on the 40w oils. On the 30w oils, the same lube manual states min 2.9. Looking at the manual right now, section 3.2 on page 6, 2013 published DDC-SVC-BRO-0001 Lubricating Oil, Fuel, and Filters. I then checked the Schaeffer #711 10w30 diesel oil and it has an HTHS rating of 3.25, or 3.05 after 90 cycles. And it meets Detroit 93K218.
I did see the information on page 8, so we seem to have a difference of standards in the same manual. But they do state in the page 8 information that it is for information purposes only and not to be construed as a specification nor used alone as a selection for engine lubricant.
The reason i am wondering is that dd says that 10w30 can be used but has to have a ht/hs rating of 3.8 or higher. Anyone know of 10w30 oils that meet this spec?
DD lube manual does state 3.8, but on the 40w oils. On the 30w oils, the same lube manual states min 2.9. Looking at the manual right now, section 3.2 on page 6, 2013 published DDC-SVC-BRO-0001 Lubricating Oil, Fuel, and Filters. I then checked the Schaeffer #711 10w30 diesel oil and it has an HTHS rating of 3.25, or 3.05 after 90 cycles. And it meets Detroit 93K218.
I did see the information on page 8, so we seem to have a difference of standards in the same manual. But they do state in the page 8 information that it is for information purposes only and not to be construed as a specification nor used alone as a selection for engine lubricant.
Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
DD lube manual does state 3.8, but on the 40w oils. On the 30w oils, the same lube manual states min 2.9.
That's sounding like some legacy wording. I don't think one is going to find any HDEO 30 grades anywhere near that thin.
DD lube manual does state 3.8, but on the 40w oils. On the 30w oils, the same lube manual states min 2.9.
That's sounding like some legacy wording. I don't think one is going to find any HDEO 30 grades anywhere near that thin.
Could be, but it is in there. And it does say a minimum of 2.9. Not sure that implies that 2.9 is the average level.
It's not going to happen, unless there are DD lubes that lack API diesel certification. Every HDEO specification as far back as I can look up, back to and including CD, calls for a minimum HTHS of 3.5.
The table on page 6 is just the updated SAE grade specs.
If any xw-30 oil is API CJ-4 ...
http://www.apicj-4.org/performance_specs.html
...or ACEA Ex certified...
http://www.acea.be/uploads/publications/2012_ACEA_Oil_Sequences.pdf
...or officially certified(not just claiming "meets and exceeds") by any major OEM(MB 228.x,CAT ECF-x;Cummins CES XXX etc.) ,then it has HT/HS >= 3,5 cP.
MB
http://www.lubritecinc.com/PDF/MB_Spec_EO_Service_Oils_2012.1.pdf
Cummins:
http://www.infineum.com/sitecollectiondocuments/notebooks/pc10/august2007/Cummins CES20081.pdf
The only(?) exception seems (still) to be Volvo VDS-4 with min.3,4 cP for xw-30 . But finding an oil outside the dealer with this approval only is mission impossible. So any xw-30 HDEO carrying the respective API or ACEA official approval has HT/HS visc. >=3,5 cP.
If any xw-30 oil is API CJ-4 ...
http://www.apicj-4.org/performance_specs.html
...or ACEA Ex certified...
http://www.acea.be/uploads/publications/2012_ACEA_Oil_Sequences.pdf
...or officially certified(not just claiming "meets and exceeds") by any major OEM(MB 228.x,CAT ECF-x;Cummins CES XXX etc.) ,then it has HT/HS >= 3,5 cP.
MB
http://www.lubritecinc.com/PDF/MB_Spec_EO_Service_Oils_2012.1.pdf
Cummins:
http://www.infineum.com/sitecollectiondocuments/notebooks/pc10/august2007/Cummins CES20081.pdf
The only(?) exception seems (still) to be Volvo VDS-4 with min.3,4 cP for xw-30 . But finding an oil outside the dealer with this approval only is mission impossible. So any xw-30 HDEO carrying the respective API or ACEA official approval has HT/HS visc. >=3,5 cP.
There are xW-30 oils on the market at 3.5 cP HTHS that have formal builder approvals.
If you are not going to dip below the 3.7 HTHS minimum of an XW-40 grade, then you are not going to see the added fuel economy benefit. EMA has all but said HTHS is so intimately connected to fuel economy that they aren't even pushing for a fuel economy engine test.
If you are not going to dip below the 3.7 HTHS minimum of an XW-40 grade, then you are not going to see the added fuel economy benefit. EMA has all but said HTHS is so intimately connected to fuel economy that they aren't even pushing for a fuel economy engine test.
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