Restore and Protect; How does it clean?

[Stumpalump]

I called Valvoline and they said that they never tested it’s ability to remove lead. I run a GM 2.0 LSJ factory supercharged engine open loop with larger injectors and more boost on leaded fuel. No Catalytic converter and run off road only. Lead can build up in tiny oil passages like piston squirters I am told. What is in the Restore oil that cleans? I need to find out if it will remove lead deposits.

 

[buster]

Lead deposits? Never heard of that. Only one way to know, try it. No one knows how the oil cleans other than Valvoline and whoever else has RE it.

 

[kschachn]

The oil isn’t going to remove lead deposits from the fuel. A fuel additive can, at least from those surfaces which come in contact with the fuel. But no way by the oil.

Have you actually confirmed these deposits in the “tiny passages”? How much lead is in the fuel? How much blow by is happening in the engine?

 

[loneryder]

Where do you even get leaded fuel??

 

[Stumpalump]

Where do you even get leaded fuel??

Race gas and LL100aviation fuel. I need the octane for the boosted engine.

 

[MolaKule]

...Lead can build up in tiny oil passages like piston squirters I am told. What is in the Restore oil that cleans? I need to find out if it will remove lead deposits.

I don't think Valvoline ever claimed lead cleaning for their cleaner chemistry since all fuels from local fuel suppliers is tetraethyl-lead-free, so why would one expect lead cleaning from VRP?

Tetraethyl-lead deposits would more likely to be found on spark plugs and in galleys, since this lead is solubilized in oil, forming a paste-like deposit.

 

[kschachn]

So are you seeing these lead deposits in tiny passages?

 

[VersatileGuy]

They aren't saying regardless.

My guess is that they found something like a chlorinated hydrocarbon but it is not a chlorinated hydrocarbon like percholorethlyene(brake cleaner).

I might buy Valvoline stock because this might be the mother of all petroleum oils...(whale blubber was always better)

 

[kschachn]

They aren't saying regardless.

My guess is that they found something like a chlorinated hydrocarbon but it is not a chlorinated hydrocarbon like percholorethlyene(brake cleaner).

I might buy Valvoline stock because this might be the mother of all petroleum oils...(whale blubber was always better)

Are you saying this is the secret ingredient in R&P?

 

[loneryder]

Somebody posted on here that from his study of their patents, he thought it was some kind of microscopic abrasive material in the oil. Does make some sense.

 

[VersatileGuy]

Are you saying this is the secret ingredient in R&P?

No, I said it is something that works like perc. The way perc just breaks up and loosens up motor oil deposits, then leaves the surface dry like the oil was never there is quite noticeable compared to the acetone-based non chlorinated brake cleaner.

But I doubt perc would make good engine oil because it would boil off at 120 degrees C and likely compromise the lubrication. It ability to remove and separate applies to fresh oil too and is not desirable when you want new oil coating metal.

 

[VersatileGuy]

Somebody posted on here that from his study of their patents, he thought it was some kind of microscopic abrasive material in the oil. Does make some sense.

Mighy some sense...but if it is cleaning up a dipstick or valve cover top, I leaning towards something that dissolves the varnish as another key component at least.

 

[kschachn]

No, I said it is something that works like perc. The way perc just breaks up and loosens up motor oil deposits, then leaves the surface dry like the oil was never there is quite noticeable compared to the acetone-based non chlorinated brake cleaner.

But I doubt perc would make good engine oil because it would boil off at 120 degrees C and likely compromise the lubrication. It ability to remove and separate applies to fresh oil too and is not desirable when you want new oil coating metal.

I'm pretty certain that is not how it works.

And I also do not think that is what is happening, but I do I agree that a chlorinated anything has no place in an engine.

 

[Stumpalump]

I don't think Valvoline ever claimed lead cleaning for their cleaner chemistry since all fuels from local fuel suppliers is tetraethyl-lead-free, so why would one expect lead cleaning from VRP?

Tetraethyl-lead deposits would more likely to be found on spark plugs and in galleys, since this lead is solubilized in oil, forming a paste-like deposit.

Lead gets into the oil and then coats parts of the engine. It was first noted in significance when they started putting synthetic oil in aircraft that ran on leaded fuel. Lawsuits followed to have engines replaced For some reason, synthetic oil does not have the ability to clean and suspend lead deposits. Aviation oil would do the cleaning for me, but those are low stress low RPM engines and I do not trust the oil made for that application.

 

[97prizm]

Where do you even get leaded fuel??

Racetracks, airports, fuel depots, and marinas.

 

[97prizm]

Lead gets into the oil and then coats parts of the engine. It was first noted in significance when they started putting synthetic oil in aircraft that ran on leaded fuel. Lawsuits followed to have engines replaced For some reason, synthetic oil does not have the ability to clean and suspend lead deposits. Aviation oil would do the cleaning for me, but those are low stress low RPM engines and I do not trust the oil made for that application.

I've always wondered if certain synthetic oils would suspend lead deposits better than others.

 

[kschachn]

Lead gets into the oil and then coats parts of the engine. It was first noted in significance when they started putting synthetic oil in aircraft that ran on leaded fuel. Lawsuits followed to have engines replaced For some reason, synthetic oil does not have the ability to clean and suspend lead deposits. Aviation oil would do the cleaning for me, but those are low stress low RPM engines and I do not trust the oil made for that application.

So have you seen these deposits in the small passages on your engine?

Also the relevance to today’s synthetic oils and the issues with AV-1 are not clear cut. Mobil could have improved the lead scavenging ability of the oil but by then the somewhat misguided “synthetic is bad” could not be overcome in GA. It had far more to do with the specific formulation of that oil than it did with the base stock. The relevance to this oil’s Group III base is not a concern.

So are you seeing deposits in your engine that are a concern?

 

[demarpaint]

Lead has been out of fuel for decades, I wouldn't blame Valvoline for not testing for it. The market for cleaning lead deposits in this day and age is pretty much extinct imo. I would imagine it would clean it because it would be mixed in with other deposits and crap that the V&P would be cleaning out.

 

[MolaKule]

Somebody posted on here that from his study of their patents, he thought it was some kind of microscopic abrasive material in the oil. Does make some sense.

Who was it that posted and which patent? Abrasive materials as cleaning components make no sense.

 

[MolaKule]

I think there is more than one cleaning component but I think this may be the major cleaning component, an estolide:

See Page 7 of 12.

https://www.biosynthetic.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/2015-Brochure-E-Version.pdf

"Abstract​

Estolides are bio-based oils synthesized from fatty acids or from the reaction of fatty acids with vegetable oils. Estolides have many advantages as lubricant base oils, including excellent biodegradability and cold flow properties. Promising applications for estolides include bio-lubricant base oils and in cosmetics. In this review, the synthesis of estolides from fatty acids using four different types of catalysts, namely, mineral acids, solid acids, lipases, and ionic liquids, is summarized. The summary includes the yield of estolide obtained from varying synthetic conditions (time, temperature, catalyst). Also reviewed are studies comparing the physical properties of estolides synthesized from refined fatty acids against those synthesized from fatty acid mixtures obtained from vegetable oils such as coconut, castor, Physaria, etc. By varying the structure of the fatty acids, estolides with a wide range of pour point, cloud point, and viscosity are synthesized to meet a wide range of application requirements. Currently, estolide products are being commercialized for personal care and lubricant base oils for automotive, industrial, and marine applications. The application areas and the demand for estolides is expected to grow as the drive for switching from petroleum to bio-based products keeps growing."

https://aocs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1002/aocs.12323

From Lube-Tech:

Estolides - The innovative alternative of ester base oils

https://www.lube-media.com/wp-conte...innovative-alternative-of-ester-base-oils.pdf