Redline 5-30 3348 miles Dakota 4.7 Issues

[rpwilliams]

No problem.

I think I'm going to try taking the advice of some of you gurus & run dino oil in the next change. I should be taking a sample within the next week to see how the Redline is doing. When it comes time to change I'll drop some good old Castrol in there.

 

[VNT]

quote:

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Originally posted by rpwilliams:
Hey folks, I'm the poor sap that owns this sample & truck. I'll be changing the oil this weekend as well as resampling. As soon as I receive the results I'll post them here. The more and more people I talk to, the worse I discover this problem can be. Even my dealership who has seen the problem many a time recommends that I contact Daimler Chrysler. I've also been reading up on the effects of excessive water in engine oil, it sucks. I believe there are two fixes to this problem but I don't understand why DC doesn't implement them. 1) Replace the fill tube with a plug and use old school fill ports in the valve cover. 2) Increase engine op temp by a few degrees with a hotter thermo. Anyone agree?

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I wouldnt get too upset, this condition of condensation in the filler tube dates back to 99 when the 4.7 came out. It seems to be a bullet proof engine. On Jeeps Unlimited board, they had a post with a roll call on folks with 4.7's, many with 99's had 200K miles and most had no issues.

I'd dump your oil, put some dino in, do some highway driving for 3500 miles and resample. If it looks good go back to a synthetic. I have a 4.7 in my wifes 02 Grand Cherokee, it has 27K miles. Run AMsoil 0W-30. I think my last batch of oil changed last year had 16K miles, didnt bother sampling but the WJ only used 8 ounces of oil in the 16K mile interval.

Mike

 

[TooSlick]

If you are doing short trip driving with these sludge prone, 4.7L motors, I'd investigate the possibility of using a higher temp thermostat. That's a cheap, easy fix that will help the engine warm up more quickly in short trip driving and help with the condensation problem....Once the engine is fully warmed up the T-stat will be open all the way, so the engine won't run any hotter under steady state conditions.

TS

 

[VNT]

quote:

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Originally posted by TooSlick:
If you are doing short trip driving with these sludge prone, 4.7L motors, I'd investigate the possibility of using a higher temp thermostat. That's a cheap, easy fix that will help the engine warm up more quickly in short trip driving and help with the condensation problem....Once the engine is fully warmed up the T-stat will be open all the way, so the engine won't run any hotter under steady state conditions.

TS

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Where are you getting this info that it is sludge prone?? It is not!
They simply have a filler tube where condensation causes a milky looking slime under the cap.
FWIW, my **** snow blower has the same issue, pull the dipstick and look in the tube you get the same thing. I just wipe it clean and dont worry about it.

 

[fuel tanker man]

Well... I was reading on another thread that the "WD" in WD-40 stands for water displacing.

So I got to thinking...

Maybe you could just pour in a quart of the WD-40 and displace all of that water. No?

Dan

 

[rpwilliams]

I seriously hope you're joking.

 

[Mackelroy]

((I drive 37 miles to work 5 days a week, all highway. I should have bought a VW diesel.))

I was looking at your report, and it looked like some from a high stressed motorcycle engine.

And being this is mainly highway, I'm now completely shocked.

IMO, I'd move to another vehicle when feesable before this one costs you big bucks.

 

[fuel tanker man]

rp... yeah, that's a joke about the WD-40.

Do try a good dino in that engine. I think Pennzoil or Havoline will clean up the mess that the Redline has made.

(gotta tease the Redline advocates just a bit--but I'm betting your UOA's will look much better with a good dino).

Dan

 

[rpwilliams]

I should be getting another UOA on the truck back in the next couple of days. As soon as I do I'll post it.

As far as getting another vehicle, that's the plan ASAP.

Until I joined this site, I've only heard good things about Redline. What's the deal?

I do plan on running trusty old Castrol GTX at the next change.

 

[rpwilliams]

I should be getting another UOA on the truck back in the next couple of days. As soon as I do I'll post it.

As far as getting another vehicle, that's the plan ASAP.

I do plan on running trusty old Castrol GTX at the next change.

Until I joined this site, I've only heard good things about Redline. What's the deal?

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

quote:

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Originally posted by rpwilliams:
...

Until I joined this site, I've only heard good things about Redline. What's the deal?

---

Good question. Ignore them.
I'd bet you have HG issues. OR intake if it is possible on this design? It's probably HG.
Lab said no AF when Sodium was 50ppm but said possible AF when it was 24??? That is why you need Terry.

 

[fuel tanker man]

If those are indeed the issues, the Castrol dino oil will show the same problems.

If the Castrol UOA comes back looking significantly better (which I believe it will) I think we can certainly blame the Redline for attacking the bearings in your engine.

Hopefully there won't be so much schrapnel left by the Redline that it taints the Castrol's UOA...

Let's just see what happens.

In my corner, I have a hat ready to eat if I'm wrong.

In the Redline advocate's corner... well... I'm betting they have a notebook with several more excuses which haven't been used yet.

Dan

 

[rpwilliams]

Pardon my incompetence, but could you elaborate on "HG issues" & "OR intake".

One thing all oil labs will tell you is it's not the individual sample that you need to worry about, but the trends that need to be monitored. For the future Castrol samples to mean anything we will have to see what the next few UOAs look like by using Castrol in the nex few changes.

I'll see what I can do about getting a copy of that notebook.

 

[rpwilliams]

Oil - Redline 5w30
Miles on truck - 11169
Miles on oil - 4169

Miscellaneous
A/F - N
Fuel - N
H2O - N
Viscosity - 52.0

Infrared Analysis
Soot - 25
Oxidation - 40
Nitration - 68
Sulfur - 0

Wear Metals(PPM)
Copper - 3
Iron - 45
Chrome - 2
Aluminum - 14
Silicon - 8
Lead - 0
Sodium - 32
Tin - 0
Nickel - 2
Barium - 1
Silver - 0
Zinc - 1268
Boron - 0
Calcium - 2546
Phosphor - 1170
Magnesium - 9
Potasium - 3
Molybendum - 570
Titanium - 0
Vanadium - 0

Lab Comments
- All readings acceptable

FIRE AWAY FOLKS!!!

 

[LarryL]

My next door neighbor had a Durango with the 4.7 engine and had the dreaded 'oil sludge' problem. I saw the problem right away and told him to get back to the dealer and ask what was happening. He was on his third or forth 3k change at the dealer. The dealer told him it was 'not a problem' and a good long drive would clear it up. I taught the neighbor how to change his own oil and let him use my tools and ramps. He started changing it every 2k to 3k miles always getting it done in under 3k miles. He kept a log book and stapled receipts on the pages. Soon he bought his own tools and ramps, and continued to change the oil and filter himself, often at 2k intervals, with Castrol GTX oil and AC filters. I'm sure he did the work, because I always took the used oil in my big container to the parts store for disposal with my used oil. Well, at three years and about 60k miles his engine developed an oil pressure problem and was towed in to the dealer several times, then failed completely. They did all the service work on their schedule except for the oil changes he did. The dealer told him his log was obviously 'faked' and there was not warranty coverage. The cost would be $7,200 and the vehicle was parked in their lot. To get the vehicle without the work would cost $268 in 10 days or sold for expenses. In this case, thank god for an attorney. With the 'faked' statement in writing on a service order and this attorney he got his new engine. The day he picked it up, 3 months after it was determined the extendended warranty applied, he had to pay the dedictable and the $268. The 3 months must mean that this repair was on the fast-track plan. Can you guess what brand of vehicle this guy may not buy next time?

 

[TooSlick]

Larry,

I've had irate Dodge owners email me privately to complain about my characterization of this engine. I find you post to be very interesting to say the least....

TS

 

[TooSlick]

RP,

You have a significant air leak into this engine. Note the elevated levels of Fe/Cr and the presence of nickel from your intake/exhaust valves. The high level of sodium is from road salt and is a strong secondary indicator of dirt and other contaminents getting into the motor!

Tooslick

 

[LarryL]

TooSlick, I went with the Durango owner to pick up his vehicle. While the Durango owner was waiting for his truck to be brought up, the Service Manager was explaining to me that there was no sludging problem with Dodge V8's and that this engine replacement was an example of Dodge's good will toward loyal customers. He said that maybe the owner should start using the dealer for oil changes, from now on, that new cars are much too complicated for self-service. And there were not warranty papers, just a regular Work Order, to be signed. There was a deductible, oil and coolant, and a few misc charges. On the way home we stopped at Home Depot for a 'For Sale' sign.

By the way, TooSlick, is your Audi out of warranty, yet?

 

[Cutehumor]

he had an extended warranty and they still wouldn't cover the sludged up engine?

Sounds like my experience with the Nissan dealer. My dad's headgasket was leaking pretty bad and they continued to say that it pressure tested fine. it wasn't until the check engine light came on that they actually replaced it. I wonder sometimes if the engine sludged up with all that coolant and failed without the check engine light. the burden would have been on me with oil changes and receipts. I do have the receipts but what a headache that would have been! there's no way we could have afforded an attorney or my dad be without a car for three months. he drives 30k a year and has two part time jobs. He bought the factory extended warranty and they still give us the run around.

 

[rpwilliams]

Oil - Redline 5w30
Miles on truck - 12045
Miles on oil - 5008

Miscellaneous
A/F - N
Fuel - N
H2O - N
Viscosity - 48.0

Infrared Analysis
Soot - 27
Oxidation - 42
Nitration - 73
Sulfur - 0

Wear Metals(PPM)
Copper - 3
Iron - 61
Chrome - 2
Aluminum - 10
Silicon - 10
Lead - 0
Sodium - 37
Tin - 0
Nickel - 2
Barium - 1
Silver - 0
Zinc - 1294
Boron - 0
Calcium - 2516
Phosphor - 1158
Magnesium - 13
Potasium - 5
Molybendum - 592
Titanium - 0
Vanadium - 0

Lab Comments
- Wear metals consistant for oil change interval
- Resample at next oil change interval to monitor


Comments anyone?