Redline 10W-30, 6037mi., Mazda 626 4 cyl

[jason07-1zzfe]

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000828#000000

Also recall that M1's starting TBN is higher than RL's in addition to the Blackstone TBN differential.

 

[qship1996]

Jason,you really think using an analysis done by a different lab,with obvious silicon{dirt} problem and resulting metal wear is a valid comparison to explain the redlines poor TBN? if you are so sure of Redlines performance,why is it I only see one 1800 mile test of it in your pontiac? are you still using it? how are your analysis looking? my results,after the 9th run of redline,were improved all around after switching to mobil 1-a fact that I had a hard time believing-way to much talk and excuses on this board about redline cleaning,need to use FP,LC,or auto-rx.

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

Ok the silicon MAY explain the iron. But at that level, I doubt it is all dirt or there would be much more wear. My main focus was the TBN and I explained the differences in labs there. The difference is predictable.

Yes I am still running Red Line in the Pontiac, been running it since we got it 60k miles ago. I'm not in the BMW because the VS seals bit the dust and I don't plan to keep it any longer than a year or two.

Actually I'm pretty sure I have 3-4 UOA's of the GTP posted here. Just got one recently. Didn't post because I thought my coolant leak was fixed, in fact it was...verified in that 1800mile UOA. Did another >9000 interval after that since I thought it was fixed, but no UOA. Then got the next drain analyzed and all h&ll broke loose with the intake gasket. 10k miles with a MAJOR coolant leak and RL still protecting. Actaully it's been leaking coolant slightly since day ONE!! Over 70k miles now 60k on Red Line(with 5 nearly 10k intervals!), yet the engine parts would never no it was leaking coolant!
If you would like to come plastiguage my bearings feel free to email me, or take any othe measurements on the engine. I'll even take it somewhere in the area as long as I dont have to do the work or pay.
I could post my recent UOA if you'd like. I'm sure it will be misterpreted by many.

 

[White Fang]

Well, Redline is certainly a controversial oil. I am doing these analyses as a test of Redline. I bought the car with 22,000 mi on it, ran Mobil 1 for a while, then did an Auto RX treatment and put in the Redline. I am going to keep using Redline and monitor the results. I should have another installment in 6-8 months.
Wear metals that are not listed such as Pb are zero.
There seems to be a small air leak in the system which is letting some Si in. I switched to a Mobil 1 oil filter and will see if that helps to keep the dirt down. I am going to be putting in 2oz of Lube Control every 1,000 miles this time to see if I can get the TBN up. Although I was disappointed in the Zero TBN reading the wear metals were not too bad so I guess I can say, "who cares what the TBN is as long as the wear is down."

Terry has analyzed both analyses. As most of you know he doesn't like to have his comments posted here. But in general he seems pleased with the results other than the Si levels.

 

[harrydog]

quote:

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Originally posted by qship1996:
Jason,you really think using an analysis done by a different lab,with obvious silicon{dirt} problem and resulting metal wear is a valid comparison to explain the redlines poor TBN? if you are so sure of Redlines performance,why is it I only see one 1800 mile test of it in your pontiac? are you still using it? how are your analysis looking? my results,after the 9th run of redline,were improved all around after switching to mobil 1-a fact that I had a hard time believing-way to much talk and excuses on this board about redline cleaning,need to use FP,LC,or auto-rx.

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I've been using Redline for over a decade now. I'm still a believer.
In my Subaru WRX I had Oil Analyzers, Inc. run 3 UOA's using Redline. The miles on the oil and the TBN was as follows:

4131 miles - TBN 5.75
4932 miles - TBN 5.57
4871 miles - TBN 4.43

Then using Blackstone...
5012 miles - TBN 2.3

So I think it's clear that Bkackstone's TBN numbers are low for whatever reason.
I also ran German Castrol most recently and Blackstone's UOA was:

5089 miles - TBN 2.8

So Redline didn't do too bad in the TBN area compared to GC.

 

[buster]

quote:

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Terry has analyzed both analyses. As most of you know he doesn't like to have his comments posted here. But in general he seems pleased with the results other than the Si levels.

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Stick with what Terry says. He won't steer you in the wrong direction. The guy has 25 years experience looking at these things. I've given him a hard time with RL, but I have ZERO credentials for analyzing oils and realize he knows a lot more about oil then I ever will.

I believe RL's chemistry is just very aggressive and under different circumstances, it reacts differently then other oils. Sometimes good, sometimes bad maybe. You'll have a clean engine though and that IMO is more important.

With that said though, I still don't like RL for all applications. I think it's over kill and not the best choice many times. But that can be said about any oil. I'll leave RL to the hard core racing crowd and continue to use a M1/Amsoil type product.

 

[qship1996]

after reading that this engine recieved the Auto-Rx treatment before the switchover to Redline makes this analysis look even worse!what could this second batch of oil possibly be cleaning in a low mileage,already auto-rx cleaned engine? NOTHING! just another poor result of this oil.I do not think the 11 ppm of silicon is high at all for the redline signature-some redline virgin samples show much more than the 11ppm.after using this oil myself for the last 2 years,i only feel comfortable with 5,000 mile drains,and now expect worse looking results than with mobil 1 in my engine

 

[buster]

I didn't realize this engine had an RX treatment before. Hmmmmm....

 

[White Fang]

OK guys here are the details:
Car purchased used on 10/14/02 with 21,288 mi.
I immediately changed the oil to Mobil 1 5W-30 and changed it regularly. On 11/7/03 at 30,329 miles I began an Auto RX treatment using Pennzoil 5W-30 for the wash and rinse cycles.
On 3/6/04 at 34,420 miles I did the first Redline fill, left it in 4,461 miles, did an analysis with Terry's interpretation and just now I did the last one.
(If testing oil wasn't so much fun I would just go back to Castrol

)
I too didn't think the Si was that awful, but Terry didn't like it. There is a Redline VOA on this board that shows Si of 15ppm and I only had 11. I really don't have a clue what is going on here.

But I am going to keep going with this just to see what happens. This oil is so controversial I want to find out if it is any good myself. Keep tuned.

[ April 15, 2005, 08:17 PM: Message edited by: White Fang ]

 

[TooSlick]

I'd like to see White Fang run the GF-4 version of Mobil 1 under these conditions. I'll bet anyone a beer it would be shot as well after 6000 miles of this type of service.

Any takers??? I didn't think so ...

I should add that Redline IS best suited for high temp,high load conditions, as well as engines that see lots of use. For example, most of the RL formulations have CCS viscosities that range from 6000-7000 Cp at their respective test temps. By contrast the PAO based formulations from EOM, Amsoil, RP, etc have CCS viscosities well below this in many cases.

For this type of service the best oil to use is a synthetic diesel oil like Delvac 1, the Amsoil Series 3000, Esso 0w-30, etx, or a 10w-30, conventional HDEO. For warm weather use and short trip driving a 15w-40 would also work well.

Any lubricant has it's best uses and this isn't the optimum application for Redline to be used. I still like the stuff a lot, primarily due to its ability to keep engines extremely clean for hundreds of thousands of miles. It's also one of the best oils out there for turbocharged applications. However it's not an oil I'd try to run over 10,000 miles if I wasn't testing it all the time....

TS

 

[buster]

quote:

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I am doing these analyses as a test of Redline.

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White Fang, any updates on this? Are you still running RL in this car? Thx